# 4-Point -Electrical deficiency or not? **URL:** \ **Category:** Florida and SUNachi Inspectors\ **Created:** [September 12, 2011, 5:56pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537 "2011-09-12T17:56:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![rmurphy1](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/rmurphy1/32/178404_2.png) [@rmurphy1](https://forum.nachi.org/u/rmurphy1)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 5:56pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/1 "2011-09-12T17:56:09Z")
Just thought I’d see what you all think: Do you report panels in bathrooms or clothes closets as deficiencies? ---
**Author:** ![mmeeker](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/mmeeker/32/59432_2.png) [@mmeeker](https://forum.nachi.org/u/mmeeker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 6:41pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/2 "2011-09-12T18:41:20Z")
NO. I do not if I can access them and remove the deadfront. ---
**Author:** ![wsiegel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3d9bf3/32.png) [@wsiegel](https://forum.nachi.org/u/wsiegel)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/3 "2011-09-12T18:49:52Z")
Panels are not allowed in either. I report them. ---
**Author:** ![jjonas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/jjonas/32/301755_2.png) [@jjonas](https://forum.nachi.org/u/jjonas)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 6:52pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/4 "2011-09-12T18:52:19Z")
Not allowed. (local mileage may vary). ---
**Author:** ![mmeeker](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/mmeeker/32/59432_2.png) [@mmeeker](https://forum.nachi.org/u/mmeeker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 7:08pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/5 "2011-09-12T19:08:21Z")
We even see them outside of the bldg in South Florida. ---
**Author:** ![wsiegel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3d9bf3/32.png) [@wsiegel](https://forum.nachi.org/u/wsiegel)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 7:19pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/6 "2011-09-12T19:19:17Z")
Out side is fine, as long as they are rated for such use. ---
**Author:** ![jsuarez](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/jsuarez/32/292149_2.png) [@jsuarez](https://forum.nachi.org/u/jsuarez)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 9:41pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/7 "2011-09-12T21:41:40Z")
> [@mmeeker](#): > > We even see them outside of the bldg in South Florida. Very common… 😛 ---
**Author:** ![ccurrins](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/ccurrins/32/225758_2.png) [@ccurrins](https://forum.nachi.org/u/ccurrins)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 9:45pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/8 "2011-09-12T21:45:17Z")
> [@mmeeker](#): > > We even see them outside of the bldg in South Florida. Outside (exterior) and inside bathroom or closet are completely different locations. Like Jeff said latter 2 are not allowed by NEC. ---
**Author:** ![jjonas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/jjonas/32/301755_2.png) [@jjonas](https://forum.nachi.org/u/jjonas)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 9:55pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/9 "2011-09-12T21:55:33Z")
> [@ccurrins](#): > > Outside (exterior) and inside bathroom or closet are completely different locations. Like Jeff said latter 2 are not allowed by NEC. And outside is allowed, as long as rated for exterior use. Before you ask, no, an exterior rated cannot be used in the bathroom. Bathroom and clothes closet not allowed, period. ---
**Author:** ![mmeeker](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/mmeeker/32/59432_2.png) [@mmeeker](https://forum.nachi.org/u/mmeeker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 9:57pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/10 "2011-09-12T21:57:19Z")
Help John or Dennis… Oh ever so knowledgeable ones what would you guys do? Do they do 4 points elsewhere in the country? ---
**Author:** ![jjonas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/jjonas/32/301755_2.png) [@jjonas](https://forum.nachi.org/u/jjonas)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 9:58pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/11 "2011-09-12T21:58:21Z")
> [@mmeeker](#): > > Help John or Dennis… > > Oh ever so knowledgeable ones what would you guys do? > > Do they do 4 points elsewhere in the country? 4 points have nothing to do with it. It is a defect. Period. ---
**Author:** ![ccurrins](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/ccurrins/32/225758_2.png) [@ccurrins](https://forum.nachi.org/u/ccurrins)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:01pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/12 "2011-09-12T22:01:33Z")
Aren’t 4 points insurance inspections? The reason service panels are NOT allowed in a bathroom or clothes closet is for fire/safety reasons. Isn’t that a purpose for insurance? ---
**Author:** ![mmeeker](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/mmeeker/32/59432_2.png) [@mmeeker](https://forum.nachi.org/u/mmeeker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:05pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/13 "2011-09-12T22:05:41Z")
I am not sure what the idiots at the insurance companies want or do. I have never seen it on anyones form who does 4 points. That is why I gave a “Shout Out” to John S or Dennis B. they will have the answer for sure. I doubt many around here have done more insurance inspections then those two guys. ---
**Author:** ![rmurphy1](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/rmurphy1/32/178404_2.png) [@rmurphy1](https://forum.nachi.org/u/rmurphy1)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/14 "2011-09-12T22:09:47Z")
The Citizens electrical inspection form asks several questions two of which are: Does it meet local codes? Is there any exposed or unsafe wiring? Panels located in bathrooms or clothes closets would seem to fail on both of these questions. ---
**Author:** ![jjonas](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/jjonas/32/301755_2.png) [@jjonas](https://forum.nachi.org/u/jjonas)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:10pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/15 "2011-09-12T22:10:19Z")
> [@mmeeker](#): > > I am not sure what the idiots at the insurance companies want or do. I have never seen it on anyones form who does 4 points. > > That is why I gave a “Shout Out” to John S or Dennis B. they will have the answer for sure. I doubt many around here have done more insurance inspections then those two guys. Believe it or not, all the insurance companies I do inspections for, use code for their basis, and then add my opinion into the mix. Like I said, your local mileage may vary, but the fact remains, it is still a defect. Period. ---
**Author:** ![mmeeker](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/mmeeker/32/59432_2.png) [@mmeeker](https://forum.nachi.org/u/mmeeker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:14pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/16 "2011-09-12T22:14:39Z")
I am not disagreeing and I do not think I have personally come across the situation that is why I am asking the FLORIDA insurance guru’s opinions. I would not have called it out but perhaps I may if I encounter it based on what I have read so far. I personally do not use the citizens electrical form and whenever it is requested I contact a Licensed Electrician to handle it. ---
**Author:** ![wsiegel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/3d9bf3/32.png) [@wsiegel](https://forum.nachi.org/u/wsiegel)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:18pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/17 "2011-09-12T22:18:33Z")
Mike, No writing it up can get you one of those them thar fat letters that will wind you up in court if there ever is a problem in that particular home. ---
**Author:** ![rmurphy1](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/rmurphy1/32/178404_2.png) [@rmurphy1](https://forum.nachi.org/u/rmurphy1)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:21pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/18 "2011-09-12T22:21:41Z")
> [@mmeeker](#): > > I personally do not use the citizens electrical form and whenever it is requested I contact a Licensed Electrician to handle it. I don’t use the form myself, but I do use it as a basis for conducting the inspection - They are asking questions that I believe should be answered. ---
**Author:** ![jshishilla](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/jshishilla/32/1188_2.png) [@jshishilla](https://forum.nachi.org/u/jshishilla)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:29pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/19 "2011-09-12T22:29:32Z")
I tell them where the panel is(period). Not my call. I would agree that if the location is not on your form you should call out bathrooms and cloths closets as unsafe location. btw, exterior is unsafe if you need to access it in the rain! ---
**Author:** ![mmeeker](https://sea2.discourse-cdn.com/internachi/user_avatar/forum.nachi.org/mmeeker/32/59432_2.png) [@mmeeker](https://forum.nachi.org/u/mmeeker)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2011, 10:39pm UTC](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537/20 "2011-09-12T22:39:34Z")
SEE\>\>\>\> I knew one of em would have a great plan. I like it and will do it when and if I encounter a similar situation. It does not screw the client and it tells the insurance company the facts. Thanks for your opinion John 🙂 [Next page](https://forum.nachi.org/t/4-point-electrical-deficiency-or-not/62537.md?page=2)