Inspector friend of mine called to get my take on this so I figured I’d run it by the group: High rise condo inspection, building is about 50 years old and has huge floor to ceiling windows. Upon moving in, the large curtains were moved to paint and a window was found to be cracked. $1800 to replace and, of course, buyer wants the inspector to pay.
I guess the question is, do curtains need to be moved or are they under the umbrella of “obstructions?” This condo was on the 20th floor and I’m not sure if it was facing the balcony or not so there might have been no chance to see it from outside.
Generally, I feel like anything that starts with, “When we removed XXX we found…” isn’t our issue but am thinking this might be a tough one since it was just curtains. Anyway, let me know what you all think.
According to the InterNACHI Standards of Practice, home inspectors are not required to move window coverings or other obstructions to inspect windows. However, some recommend that you open up window treatments, such as blinds and curtains, to help the inspector move around efficiently. You can also check for damage to curtains, blinds, or shades that might affect how the window operates.
I don’t know how a person could inspect a window without pushing curtains aside. That said I can imagine how heavy awkward drapes could obscure the view of a crack hidden near the edge of a window. Plus there are plenty of chances for something to happen when taking down drapes or moving furniture in or out of the unit…
If there was furniture blocking the window, then he might have an argument, but if there wasn’t or if the condo was vacant, then IMO he needs to pay for a new window.
Curtains or blinds IMO should always be moved to inspect windows, and with windows like you described, I always verify that they’re tempered glass.
My friend was able to find this listing photo on Redfin and the window sure doesn’t look to be cracked. It is a thermal panel. Hard to say if it would show if the inner pane had the cracked. The painter discovered it when he took the curtains down… also a chance he’s the one that broke it. It reportedly looks like it’s from impact and the crack goes from top to bottom on the side behind the curtain. Anyone see a crack?
Depends upon whats the clear path of the window treatment to disturbe. An expensive vase or large plant on a vase table top.
As well, I ask the vender or purchaser to move drapes or blinds and open windows with clutter sourdnding them.
Sounds like a curtain wall. In my neck of the woods the assocation representing the shareholders is responsable. Monthly fees pays for such insurance.
That’s considered by many to be fluff. Of course, I’m fluff incarnate, so it goes. I always image big glass. Always, just for this reason, specially if it’s furnished and the furnishings are going with the seller. Yes, I suppose I could keep a pocket pile of pics…but I let 'em fly. The buyers can compare when they move in as well.
A curtain wall is part of a structural framed opening that is bolted or metal pinned and locked in to the concrete.
Similar to a slider, any curtain wall is going to be tempered glass. It would not crack, but it would shatter from impact, and be a lot stronger.
So far as the window at hand…I guess it is hard to prove when it happened but easily could have happened when moving belongings out. If it is a picture window, I can see how your buddy did not spend too much time “operating” it beyond a quick glance.
If I can get to window treatments, I will move them to look at the window.
There all all kinds of reasons why the inspector is not liable to replace the window. Such as furniture or other items blocking the window (Not just the drapes, that would be a weak defence IMO). If there was items blocking access then the Seller should be liable…Also something this significant should have been known by the seller, and it should have been disclosed.
The window certainly could have been sound on the day of the inspection and then movers, seller, or painter may have broke it after the insp.
However if the only excuse is that drapes blocked the view of the inspector and “that is his reason (drapes in the way) for missing it”… Then most likely it was broke and he is admitting to missing it.
I would not be using a flimsy excuse as “drapes blocked view”…because I would be moving the drapes and So without question, could say it was not broke when I moved the drapes and looked at it on the day of the inspection. Would I have a picture of the window not being broken? No, because I don’t take pictures of non-broken things (hence it was not broken)…this is when my CYA series of 360 pics I take of every room would have also shown if there was furniture or other items blocking access to the window. (maybe furniture purposely put there by the seller to cover a known $1,800 problem.
I thought of this too and clarified with the agent when she called - it was a trust and exempt from a seller’s disclosure in Oregon.
To clarify, the “friend” is the guy I sold my company to and he is still very much a friend but the agent called me out of habit and still having my cell#… and I hadn’t talked to her for a while and was happy to field the initial call.
He sent the picture of the intact window over today and didn’t hear back… I’m pretty sure he won’t.
Observations and question. First that is obviously a patio door so a crack of that size most likely would have been visible from the exterior looking in. Did the Inspector step out onto the balcony and inspect the window from the exterior?
Next was the listing photo from Redfin taken before the inspection? If so that only proves it was not cracked before the inspection and really is of no use to the Inspector.
Now onto my opinion how the situation should be handled. This is based on these premises.
The Inspector had a valid reason not to step onto the balcony and clearly excluded that in their report.
The Inspector properly inspects all windows for damaged, broken seals, etc.
The Inspector either routinely does not bring large items like ladders into a home or for some reason did not on this one and disclaimed it in the report.
If one or a combination of these are the case then I would just politely explain to the client that the crack was not there at the inspection and there is no way the Inspector could have placed that much force on a window to cause that type damage without potentially bringing down the curtains as well. Instinct is if a person falls against the glass they would grab those curtains and they are coming down.
It all boils down to the crack was not there during or as a result of the inspection.
Seriously? You expect to see any/every small/thin crack in a photo at that angle? Wow!
I have discovered cracks that were directly in front of my face, 12 inches away, and only observed them by pure-ass-luck!! Many I was only able to observe because of a change in light hitting the window as I moved from one side to the other. It is amazing what the coatings on modern glazing hides/covers up.
I add this CYA statement any time there is “anything” in the home that may block full view, including if the home is “staged” I put this in the “other” section of the interior and also have a similar statement for a garage that is not empty of stuff:
“ADVISEMENT: Because this home is/was occupied on the date of the inspection and or may have stored items on the premises, many areas were not, or may not have been accessible for a full inspection. Also furniture, area rugs, pictures or other personal items may not allow for complete observation of some areas. It is very important to visually check all areas at final walk-through that may be hidden from the inspector when the inspection was actually performed. This is especially important for walls, floors and closets. Any damage or deficiencies that are observed at final walk-through that are not shown or covered on this inspection report should be noted and resolved before taking possession of the home.”
This after a client called when they discovered water damage to a laminate floor at the kitchen and at the master bedroom…My 360 pics actually saved me as the damage at the kitchen was shown to be covered by a throw rug and there was a large potted plant where the water damage was discovered in the bedroom. (IMO the seller should be paying for anything blocked from view as they certainly would have been alerted to it when they “packed up their Stuff” (potted plant).
Love stories that end well!! When the painter was confronted with the Redfin picture he caved and admitted he broke the window with his ladder.
Of course, no one called my buddy to tell him… he was just at an inspection with the agent again and she told him. An ever-rare instances of justice in this industry!
