EnergyStar fraud

As I have been saying, for a long while, putting some “Government Approved” sticker on something doesn’t mean that it is valid.

There are many local building codes that are, in reality, just plain wrong.

It appears that the EnergyStar “standards” are also.

And fron the “green” New York Times, to boot.

And, I would also posit, that BPI, RESNET and LEEDS are similarly flawed.

These are not so much about producing a valid, scientifically and reality based standard, but at least as much in producing a government imposed monopoly.

Hope this helps;

Hey Will, what does products that carry the energy star label have to do with BPI, RESNET and LEEDS???
What you posted an be compared with bad home inspectors to good one’s, you’ll always find a bad apple in the whole basket.

And no, it does not “help”

Well said Peter.

What I am saying is that the various “standards” for energy audits and energy efficiency in houses are not, for the most part, based upon objective scientific pronciples, but seem to be more concerned with getting their standards accepted and approved by the government so that the group who has prepared it has a monopoly and can rake in the income.

Many of these groups have web based computer programs that the inspector has to pay for each report. This provides a continuing source of income and this income, once a standard is government approved, is guarenteed.

Likewise education. People profit from that as well.

As has been stated in opther threads, this may have been the reason that another HI association has been pushing state licensing. Once their SOP and test have state approval, they have a continuing source of income.

I would much rather see a standard that is not “owned” and is freely available to all. And a standard that is objective and not tied to “green” activist groups or government imposed political correctness.

Just my opinion.

Peter, things are not working as well in other parts of the country as they are in NH.

The correlation is that “Raters” must be consistant and be able to recreate the same test results reguardless of who does the test. This may be difficult in a self regulated industry.

We can’t be so naïve as to think that people doing energy improvements are not prone to manipulating the numbers.

Yes, it is just like one bad home inspector out of a bunch. However the green movement is getting a serious black eye starting from the top down (no pun intended).

There are so many different standards among the standards, consistency is impossible.
The state of Tennessee requires a 1.5 day TVA to course for all government subsidized work. Did you learn all the information at BPI in 1.5 days? nope!

Mr. Decker is from Obamaland, remember?
He is bound to have a different perception of government controlled subsidies.

What do you mean by this?

You may be mistaken.

No, just that you may have a better understanding of the workings of the current Gov. agenda as it originated closer to you than the rest of us. I’m assuming you had to put up with him longer than we have!

I never heard of this Obama character till he ran for Pres.

By the way, keep a close look at Home Star. Obama & Kerry have there paws in the puddin! Sounds like a good program, but I don’t like who is pushing the buttons.

In reply, and based upon me growing up in the Beverly neighborhood (where most of the “middle management” of the original Daley Machine lived) here is my take.

  1. Don’t believe what he (the President) says, but look to what he does. See here for some clear proof:

  1. You have to understand Chicago. Around here, very few regular people buck the system. To do so would bring the Police (multiple traffic and parking tickets), the Building Dept. (all the codies descend on you and check every little thing, and write you up and demand that you vacate the property until they are fixed (and you MUST use Union tradesmen with permits that take forever to be issued) and re-inspected), the courts, and Jesse Jackson’s “protestors” (also called “Hire a Mob”. Ever wonder how this guy became a multi-millionaire as a mere Pastor?).

  2. Never underestimate the power of the term “Racist” or “Sexist” or “Homophobe”. Even though President Obama is only half black, and he never even dated a black women until he dated Michelle, and his own book describes all these things, he can bring to bear GREAT power, through the media:

All it takes is some name calling and everyone does his work for him.

  1. Look at what has already happened. Health care passes. It will raise company costs for health benefits. Companies, as required by law, re-file their financial statements with the SEC, to reflect these new expenses. And what happens? They get called before a Senate committee, are forced to produce truckloads of confidential financial information and called on the carpet, in front of the press, for daring to plan for these new expenses:
  1. Whenever you can, look up a columnist for the Chicago Tribune, named John Kass. He is the successor to Mike Royko, and knows the city political machine inside and out. He has been trying to get the national media to understand that President Obama is just an old Chicago Pol for years:,0,4939258.column

And, this, from another good site:

We, in Illinois, know how President Obama and the Chicago Machine works. We have lived it for all of our lives. Why do you think that the Rev. Jesse, years ago, looked like a shoe in for the Democrat Presidential nomination, until the Illinois Primary? We all knew that he was a crook, but the national media were so enthrawled with him. Same thing here.

Hope this helps;

Does any of it ever help??? :roll:

Great article.

Wow Will, to get the Utopia you are after you would literally have to throw away everything that you own that uses some form of software, service, calibration…basically anything with a re-accuring cost associated with it. That means no computer, cell phone, utilities, automobile or house…among other things. That borders on communism.

Not that I am against this, but what about the same government(s) that passed manidatory home inspections…should we throw that out also? Just like Peter stated there are bad home inspectors out there, but ultimately I think the home inspection system works. It helps to limit the amount of fraud and greed that could potentially happen in the real estate market.

Everything is open to manipulation, greed and fraud. In the words of the great Warren Buffett “Capitalism can breed greed and fruad, but it also eventually spits those individuals or companies out, and the strong survive. Over the past 200 years we have lived in the greatest economy ever to exist. I would never change capitalism just because of the few that try to cheat or game the system”. That was a quote of his during a recent CNBC special where Warren Buffett and Bill Gates were asked questions from Columbia University students about the future of capitalism.

Government is not where our contries money is spent or saved, and yet people get so worked up over it. Last year the largest US company, Exxon Mobile, had revenue of $277B. That is about 12% of all government spending for the year 2010. That is just one company. If Exxon Mobile decided to give free health care away to all of its employees everyone would think it was one of the greatest things that a company could ever do. And yet our government decides to do it, and it is the end of the world.


Do you realize you’re preaching to a Certified Master Energy Auditor???

I will keep my comments limited to the topic at hand, i.e., energy auditing, and stay away from the red-herrings in this post.

Sorry if you misunderstood the thrust of my arguement.

Hope this helps;

Point taken, Linus.

The titles (private or public) mean little. It is the actual individual and their expertize, honesty and ethics that matter most.

My whole point is that a federal government imprintar is, in the final analysis, just about as valid.


Funny you threw in that last line, Will. I was going to add to my post that the only thing I really wish the government would change its to have a guy like a Buffet in there running it as a business, at least a non profit one. That is one of those situations where you have to watch what you ask for because you might just get it. It would actually be possible to mess things up even more and cause higher taxes by running it as a business for profit.


you do realize, Will…that Obama won Illinois by a fairly huge margin. So much for Chicagoans filtering out "old Chicago Pol"s before they get to the national stage.

Many people in many States will vote to get rid of a crooked politician mistakenly thinking they won’t have to deal with them anymore. I have many friends from GA who told me when Carter was running for President that he was a bumbling fool and damned ruined GA when he was the Governor and they couldn’t wait to get rid of him. Unfortunately he did get elected and dang near ruined the whole country. Fortunately, the public caught on and he only did the one term. Carter was a rank amateur compared to this guy. The “Georgia Mafia” can’t even carry the Chicago gang’s laundry bags.

Chicago is 59% black and a big union town. Chicago also has some 75% of the votes in Illinois.

Jesse Jackson (sr.) did not have these demographics when he was running (black majority). Also, Pres. Obama was a relative unknown when he ran for the Senate and his Republican opponent shot himself in the foot.

From then on, it was the Chicago Machine all over the place (Jesse did not have the Machine’s support) and Axelrod (Richard J’s personal campaign guy) took Mr. Obama to the top.

Even then, Pres. Obama only wone by 4% of the vote.

Hope this clarifies.

Mr. Decker, Well said and do not back off. Daley was Mayor when I went to boot camp, USN Great Lakes, at North Chicago in the early 70’s and the current Mayor also happens to be named Daley, imagine that! Talk about a political machine.

Will stay out of the political stuff, but I definitely agree on the energy efficiency part, Will.

I find it to be a paradox around here. I think it is sadly funny the amount of improperly insulated homes, new homes, that I find around here, and I am not even referring to the Infrared insulation findings.

They have the nice little 2006 IECC or the Energy Star sticker on the breaker panel in the garage. Then you climb the ladder and see that they are 2 inches low on ceiling insulation according to their own height markers. I have had multiple houses that had several areas of insulation completely missing in accessible areas near the access - still had their stickers. Again, not even talking about homes that I find significant insulation missing in INaccessible areas with IR.

I am still on the outside looking in on the efficiency rater stuff (trying to decide which certs to get this year) but I have to say, I am not impressed with the work I see being done. I strongly suspect many of these guys are doing walk bys and throwing up their stickers.