Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Although you cannot see all of it, on the right, on top of the furnace is a device that allows the exhaust to be removed but has a fan attached to it to eject hot air into the room instead of all the heat escaping to the outside. It is poorly sealed to the furnace and the exhaust pipes for the hot water heater and furnace need to be repaired and sealed properly at the connections. Is anyone familiar with this type of energy saving device?
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
This is the house of a good friend of mine that I inspected. He has a CO detector in the basement of this room and it never went off. The upstairs never went off either. I did not check for CO myself. The exchanger does differentiate between the two. The exhaust is funneled right up through and the fan blows on the pipe that comes through and it diffused through a baffle. It is called a “stack heater” fuel saver. Made by Simplex/Van West in Peckville, PA. I am having trouble finding information on it.
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: mhenderson This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
It is important you understand that CO is not a normal bi-product of combustion. If gas is burned completely, the products of combustion are heat, carbon dioxide (CO2) and water (H20). These are harmless products and would not be a safety or health concern. Incomplete combustion will produce carbon monoxide (CO) as well as compounds called aldehydes. The point is that you may have a large hole in a heat exchanger or smoke pipe, but pick up no CO. Accordingly, you may pick up CO in a register, but the heat exchanger is not necessarily cracked.
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Yes, those are electrical wires laying across the water heater. The loop white wire loop you see is the overtemp switch. I love the location of the kill switch for the furnace too. If you notice, there is some real nice romex going to the heat exchanger I referenced. Electrically, this house was a mess.
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jeff,
To my knowledge this is not against any code. I have come accross several of these on the older homes when the basement did not have any source of heat. Actually they work pretty well, I just make sure they are not leaking any CO into the house. I also recommend adding a CO detector in the proximity of the exchanger since it would vent the flue gas into the basement if it broke or rusted through.
Originally Posted By: Badger This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Where to start?
This is one of the best arguments against DIY that I have seen for some time. From left to right:
1. The flex (copper) connectors are a red flag denoting DIY and demanding a closer look. Dollars to donuts there is no extension of the T&P valve reaching to the floor.
2. The vent pipe coming off the manifold male side reversed is 4" instead of 3". Sizing up can effect draft.
3. The first elbow is level but the second runs down hill! A flue pipe must run continuously up hill at a 1/4" per foot.
4. I won't even get into the NM strapped to the top of the WH.
5. The connection to the "heat saving device" is not approved. A tee or saddle tee (where approved) would be normal practice.
6. The "heat saving device" probably doesn't. They were notoriously inefficient heat exchangers unless connected to a fan. But that was a good thing. If they work too well they will drop the stack temperature and condense the byproducts of combustion in the chimney.
This device has probably not been tested by any approved lab and represents a health hazard I would not be willing to risk.
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Looks like we have ourselves a good discussion on this picture. The entire house was a DIY family project. Needless to say, this took awhile with all of the notes I had to take. Seems like I never left the basement.
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Sorry,
I just had to put my two more cents worth in.
Copper flex connectors are common around here and they do not necessarily indicate a DIY project. I have found that many contractors are making this type of change to try and save labor costs. I would have to say that they manner in which they are bent (installed) is more of an indicator.
Other than the hill on the WH flue pipe this type of setup is typical of causing draft problems, known as a backdraft. While very rare the potential is there to cause harm. I would have to agree a "t" would have been a much better choice.
The wiring....next time I find one that is properly wired and supported I will call you and let you know. If I were you I would not hold my breath, I have not found one yet. 
BTW..most of those heat exchangers you find on the flue pipe are forced air or at least were until the fan broke. I have never found any code that would not allow it, if you know something I don't please share it with us.
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Here is yet another “energy saver” installed of this oil furnace. Notice the incorrect slope of the exhaust pipe. It actually runs downhill. There must be some validity to the “acid rain” theory of this type of heat saver from dropping the temp in the flue down to the dew point. There was a hole in the 90 deg. elbow that was under this heat saver. Please, lets continue the thoughts and comments on this.
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jeff,
Other than the slope on the flue pipe, I really do not see anything wrong with this setup. Some of the flue pipe should be chopped off so it runs slightly uphill.
The hole on the elbow you speak of is for a probe they use to set up the boiler.
I suggest they place a CO detector by the boiler anyway because it uses combutionable fuel. I really do not have a problem with them.
