Hot Panels

How many don’t take covers off panels?

Probably the ones in court today…:smiley:

First line from NACHI’s SOP:
“1.1. A Home inspection is a non-invasive visual examination of a residential dwelling,”.

Define non-invasive for me.

Non-invasive basically means that we don’t do any “destructive” inspecting. We don’t poke holes in drywall, pull up carpet etc., etc.

We do open and/or remove panel covers, FAU covers, access covers, etc. etc.

Personally, I will even go as far as removing junction box covers, cover plates and other means, if I feel there is something “not quite right,” but that’s just me.

I am hesitant to respond to posts such as the original in this thread. With a user name of barf, and an apparently “loaded” - wide open - question on his debut post, it just seems a bit fishy. We’ll see where this goes.

May I suggest you change the term since:

"Main Entry: non·in·va·sive http://www.m-w.com/images/audio.gif
Pronunciation: -in-'vA-siv, -ziv
Function: adjective
1 : not tending to spread; specifically : not tending to infiltrate and destroy healthy tissue <noninvasive cancer of the bladder>
2 : not being or involving an invasive medical procedure <noninvasive imaging techniques>

  • non·in·va·sive·ly adverb "

"Main Entry: in·va·sive http://www.m-w.com/images/audio.gif
Pronunciation: -siv, -ziv
Function: adjective
1 : of, relating to, or characterized by military aggression
2 : tending to spread; especially : tending to invade healthy tissue <invasive cancer cells>
3 : tending to infringe
4 : involving entry into the living body (as by incision or by insertion of an instrument) <invasive diagnostic techniques>

  • in·va·sive·ness noun "

You, NACHI, should find a more suitable term.

PS
Main Entry: 1vi·su·al http://www.m-w.com/images/audio.gif
Pronunciation: 'vi-zh&-w&l, -zh&l; 'vizh-w&l
Function: adjective
Etymology: Middle English, from Late Latin visualis, from Latin visus sight, from vidEre to see
1 : of, relating to, or used in vision <visual organs>
2 : attained or maintained by sight <visual impressions>
3 : VISIBLE <visual objects>
4 : producing mental images : VIVID
5 : done or executed by sight only <visual navigation>
6 : of, relating to, or employing visual aids

Note line ‘5’

“Noninvasive” is an industry standard term used by home inspectors and their related affiliations. In fact, it is also used as part of the definition of a “home inspection,” by several states in their written laws governing the HI.

Look here at CA for instance. . .

http://www.aroundthecapitol.com/code/code.html?sec=bpc&codesection=7195-7199

No, I don’t believe that to be appropriate.

-You are not a member of NACHI
-Removing the panel cover is non invasive in a home inspection sense.
-The SOP sets minimums.
-State home inspection laws often require evaluation of the service equipment including the interior of “distrubution panels”

Are you suggesting that HIs should NOT inspect the service panel with the cover removed?

Since you are not an electrical inspector why are you offering your opinion on this matter?

I agree the guy who came up with non-invasive watched a lot of TV, From Ben Casey to St Elsewhere and Becker. It is medical jargon that got co-opted by other folks. I have to admit I may have been on the bleeding edge of “clone” as referred to computer hardware when I started calling non-IBM I/O boxes clones in the late 70s after the Scientific American article about the German guy who said he cloned 3 mice. (later proved a hoax)
Folks seem to be quick to steal other people’s jargon if it seems appropriate.
I will use another medical phrase to describe "inspection.
“First, do no harm”.

I don’t take the covers off of FPE Stab-Lok, Zinsco, or Sylvania/Zinsco panels, nor any panel that has fuses rather than circuit breakers.

At least not intentionally…

Or at least not when anyone is there watching us. It’s amazing what Ms Margarita and Dr Cuervo will do when left in a house all alone. Sometimes their ethics, standards of practice, and inspection protocols leave leave one desiring a wedge of lime. :margarit:

By the way, at one of last Friday’s inspection, Ms Margarita and Dr Cuervo were introduced to Dr Smirnoff. Dr Smirnoff had four assistants with him: Green Apple, Raspberry (another star with just one name!), Black Cherry, and Wild Grape. All of them had been working at Costco but have just signed contracts with me and are in the kitchen working. They came highly recommended.

Michael

It is obvious that you have not read my sig.

I am an Electrical Safety Inspector.

Please read:
http://www.yourhomesok.com/certified.htm

Mark;

Do you remove the dead fronts?

In our state, we are required to, by law. How else to inspect?

Only exception, exterior rust or wet.

What’s your point?

ok…I have estimates to do but I will comment…I have been doing this nearly 20 years…I have NO problem with an HI removing a panel and peering inside…in fact I WELCOME it…Enough Said…Nite Nite…

I have read it Mr. Parks. That term does not always indicate AHJ designation. Thanks for the clarification. Perhaps you will post your license # and municipality where you work as well.

Now I would appreciate an answer to my questions in my post.

Woopee You say that you are and just maybe you are and maybe you are not .
You come into our home and try and show us how great you are and how smart we aren’t, as I said before we have a lot of Home Inspectors who just might not agree with your thoughts .
Roy Cooke …Royshomeinspection.com

I am tired of people coming and posting who don’t list their real names, and cannot fill out the profile or were they reside. Its discourteous and not good at instilling honesty.

The cover should be removed, if you do not, you should go get training and start. You are doing your client a disservice.

100% correct.