I would like to hear from other NACHI inspectors in Kansas if they have signed the Kansas application, and sent in their $200.
Posted on Sat, Nov. 28, 2009
Some home inspectors say new Kansas law doesn’t pass the test
By DAVID KLEPPER
The Star’s Topeka correspondent
TOPEKA |
For years, anybody with a stepladder and a flashlight could work as a home inspector in Kansas.
There were no state licenses for inspectors and no state agency to complain to if inspectors failed in their job.
But a new law imposing regulations on Kansas home inspectors has set off a firestorm in the industry. Some inspectors argue that the law will drive good inspectors out of business, hurting the very public the law intends to help.
“I’m worried about my business right now,” said Gary Farnsworth, an Olathe inspector who has deluged lawmakers with requests to reconsider the law. “I don’t want somebody running my business. This gives the (regulatory) board absolute power to control the industry.”
Under the law, inspectors must register with the state and abide by professional standards derived from national inspector associations. They must be trained and meet continuing education requirements. The law also requires inspectors to have insurance and caps liability for inspectors who are sued at $10,000.
Of particular concern to Farnsworth is a provision that allows the licensing board to examine the work records and reports of inspectors under investigation.
Lawmakers who pushed for the new law argue that homebuyers deserve to have protection from inspector negligence. They said most inspectors already abide by the new standards voluntarily. And they note that real estate agents, architects, appraisers and mortgage brokers already are regulated.
“It’s a basic consumer protection,” said Rep. Steve Brunk, a Bel Aire Republican and one of the prime advocates of the legislation. “We felt there needed to be some minimal standards.”
But Farnsworth and some other inspectors are fighting the new rules.
They accuse the man charged with implementing them of abusing his position for personal gain.
Jeff Barnes, a Wichita home inspector, serves as the chairman of the state’s fledgling Home Inspector Registration Board. Barnes said he got involved to ensure whatever regulations the state adopted were fair to inspectors and the public.
Barnes registered himself before any other inspectors and claimed the first registration as his own. His professional Web site proudly declares him to be “Kansas’s 1st Registered Inspector.”
And the registration board’s official address is Barnes’ own address.
All this has raised some eyebrows.
“He’s using his clout to help his own business,” Farnsworth said.
But Barnes said he gave himself the first registration because he was testing the system before registering other inspectors.
“This is a whole new agency,” Barnes said. “We had to test out the process.”
Barnes said that because of budget woes, the state can’t afford an office for the board yet, so he had to use his own address.
But the International Association of Certified Home Inspectors was so concerned about Barnes that its lawyers wrote to Gov. Mark Parkinson, asking him to investigate. A spokeswoman for Parkinson said he would take the request under advisement.
Farnsworth also questions why the new rules are even needed. He thinks real estate agents wanted to shield themselves from liability, so they pressured lawmakers to make home inspectors liable for up to $10,000 for mistakes.
Previously, inspectors could limit their liability to the cost of the inspection.
Brunk, the main advocate of the new law, is a real estate broker.
But Brunk said that the law won’t help his business and that nothing in it prohibits homebuyers from suing anyone — inspectors or agents — if they feel cheated.
If anything, he said, the new law’s cap on inspector liability shields inspectors from potentially devastating lawsuits.
To reach David Klepper, call 785-354-1388 or send e-mail to dklepper@kcstar.com.
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Punishable by a max. $2500 fine, and up to a year in jail.
It’s important for the public to be safe from those frightening illegal home inspectors!
‘I robbed a liquor store, and killed the owner - what are you in for buddy?’
‘Me?..uh…I performed a home inspection without a license…’
Holy crap.
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Boy, the commissioned home sales people really want us out of their way so they can sell houses. And, no responses to #21.
Hey Gary
Nope
I will un-officially take KS 0110-0FU2 :mrgreen:
Thanks, Paul. As all of our business here in Kansas is almost zero, and the holidays coming, a chuckle is sometimes the best gift.
33 have registered with less than four weeks to go.
I noticed that the commissioned real estate salesman appointed to the Kansas HI Registration Board works for Coldwell Banker…the proud owners of the concierge service where home inspectors pay to be referred.
I think that it will be important for the media to know of the possibility that this person, chosen to help implement the new law, also collects money on the side from home inspectors wanting to do business with his agency.
Can someone get me a list of home inspectors on the concierge list for “Coldwell Banker Regan” or “Regan Realty”? I will see that it gets to the right people.
33? I bet the attorney on the board just cannot wait to get his hands on all of their records, tax returns, home inspection reports, computers, and checking account numbers. It will be like a large christmas present to him. Then he can give all of this information to ASHI, who can use it against our industry.
I did a few inspections for an agent with this C/B office, and did not pay anything. This agent moved on, and I moved with him. I have not done an inspection from this office in years. This “board RE” just wants to learn the business, so he can do inspections on his own, and not under any state rules. The attorney will spread the reports to this RE, so he can learn how to do them. No problem.
Steven -
It doesn’t matter about cutting the KS budget, BECAUSE I heard the Commissioned House Sales Peoples Lobbyist (Luke Bell from Lawrence) and Jeff Barnes the KAREI / ASHI leader from Wichita tell the Senators that the Bill would be totally SELF-FUNDED by home inspectors AND it would NOT cost the TAXPAYERS anything.
When asked about a BUDGET (there was no full blown fiscal study done) the same 2 people stated in the Senate Legislative hearing that they had checked with OTHER small boards and we could run the KS inspector board for under $40K ($20k - $40k). So there it is … NO cost to Kansan’s.
The same Luke Bell (we’re told he’s an attorney) told the SENATE legislative committee that:
(1) NO other group limited their LIABILITY in the real estate transaction (other than home inspectors) AND that;
(2) If a home inspector used a LoL clause that used the inspection fee AND anything ever went wrong, the poor consumer had no recourse at all but to get his inspection fee refunded (I could have sworn there was arbitration, mediation, small claims court, and lawsuits - but apparently I was wrong AND there is not);
(3) The Commissioned Used House Sales Peoples Lobbyist (Luke Bell), also told the Senate Legislative Committee that everybody else in the real estate transaction (including real estate agents and attorneys) carried E & O insurance and stood and took it on the chin if things went bad (except for home inspectors). The attorneys lobbyist backed him up.
By the way NEITHER real estate agents, attorneys, doctors, etc are required to carry E&O (or malpractice insurance) to get licensed in Kansas.
(4) The engineer from Topeka (John Lyle) and the engineers lobbyist told the Senate Legislative Committee that engineers should be excluded from the Bill because of their vast training and superior education, which meant that HI training was wasted upon them PLUS since they were already LICENSED - the engineering board would govern them.
In KS the state engineering laws EXCLUDE 1&2 family houses from the practice of engineering (the engineering board has NO JURISDICTION over an engineer doing a home inspection and has said so previously in written letters which we showed the SENATE).
Oh, By the way - When he got into home inspection a few years back - John Lyle and his wife (both engineers) hired one of my instructors to train them as home inspectors in private sessions (several weekends).
Engineers are NOT required to carry E&O to get licensed in KS AND every engineer I’ve ever seen on a home inspection uses LoL clauses like any other home inspector … Cool !
Neither the real estate lobbyist, the attorneys lobbyist, nor Jeff Barnes fought the engineers agenda to get themselves exempted (there was an engineer or 2 on the legislative committees).
SO - In short / as in many other instances, the legislative committee’s MADE their decisions based upon false and deceiving testimony of the special interest groups (or if you want to be politically incorrect and call a spade a spade - LIE’s).
Yep, Dan; about says it all. Now with the word getting out, the consumers will really be educated on what happened, and what now to expect; basic, limited home inspections, all controled by the KAR and ASHI, all for the conficating of all records, documents, personal information of all non-ASHI home inspectors. Attorneys are licking their chops.
Somebody sent out an email saying the 1st bunch of inspectors must be all ASHI.
Not so. I looked at the list and I see at least 3-5 that are not ASHI.
For Example: Steve Bauer; Mike Faulconeer; and Ralph Pimatel (Board Member) are not ASHI members.
Anybody see a #10 ???
I guess that is less strenuous than chasing an ambulance…:roll:
AW Jeeze, to frickin funny. I’m sure you meant CHOPS, but don’t attorneys use private dikcs? They’re probably licking them too. :mrgreen: Trying to get them ready to track us bad guys down. :twisted:
I am frustrated and very nervous guys. I am loosing my busines, my house payment is due, I have no inspections scheduled. Registering as a Kansas home inspector is against fifth amendment rights. I have probably been blackballed in every RE office. This is what they want; me out of business; but there is no business to be had. It looks like I will end up 40% down from last year. I am a CMI, have advertised, radio program, book ads, and no business.
I have to have a meeting with my wife. I have to go now. See ya all.
Gary,
I am sorry to hear the news about your business. Is the market in your area slow? I don’t imagine anyone, realtor or home buyer, knows what a CMI is. In my area, where ASHI does not have a strong presence, they wouldn’t know what I meant if I told them I was a Certified ASHI inspector. However, the MLS organization is strong and has been priming all of the realtors about our recently installed licensing requirements. Realtors are beginning to ask if I am licensed, which I am. Now I don’t know you from anyone, but, if I might make a recommendation. Google your name, the top 3 hits are you venting about the Kansas home inspection licensing etc… If I were a client looking for an inspector, I might hesitate in choosing you. Conspiracy theories are just that, theories with no merit. The more you and some of the others continue to constantly bash the licensing process, which won’t change, the more you become isolated and really look like a conspiracy theorist.
I realize that this post will not change yours or anyone else on this train’s mind. But, it is my opinion from the outside looking in. I do hope your business picks up.
Rob
You are basically correct. The average consumer doesn’t know what ASHI means or that ASHI is to be avoided as ASHI is a known diploma mill. We are getting more and more agents to be fearful of negligent referral lawsuits and so more and more agents take the time to fulfill their fiduciary duty and caution their client’s about diploma mill ASHI which is a good thing.
Wherever licensing goes into effect, most agents take the safe route and simply do as you describe…
…and simply direct their clients to the state list of licensed inspectors.
As for CMI, no one know what it means, just another 3 letters in the alphabet soup of inspector designations… HOWEVER… and this is the biggest HOWEVER I’ve ever typed… CMI was never designed to be used as letters and if you write out the full words: CERTIFIED MASTER INSPECTOR… every consumer in the world from here to Beijing, China instantly knows you are the very best of the very best. Nothing tops those 3 words in a row in terms of consumer recognition. It is that good and that self explanatory. It is so powerful from a marketing standpoint that it trumps everything… license #, P.E., InterNACHI, everything. * Certified Master Inspector* is a stronger marketing tool (if used correctly) than all your other marketing combined IMHO.
Nick,
Even more so, especially in this area(Washington State), nobody knows Nachi either. I didn’t intend my reply to turn into another ASHI bash. If anything I explain to anyone that asks(which in 7 yrs has been minimal), that I wouldn’t trust any “organization” that issues a certification based upon an online exam. You can spin it anyway you want Nick, your organizations MINIMAL qualifications, are just that MINIMAL. It is a nice easy way for a newbie to get “certified” and try and market themselves as such. There’s a reason your org has so many members, it’s easy, and your a good salesman.
Rob
Rob your absolutely right. No one is going to change the fact that Kansas inspectors have to be licensed now. If you want to stay in business get your license and stay out of the lime light. I can see Rob’s point head on… people only have seconds for an impression and if they see you complaining then they may get the wrong impression especially since 99% don’t care to read much in regards to what your complaining about in the first place.
Rob Jones, as for InterNACHI issuing certification based on online education… I think you are very uninformed.
First of all, our Code of Ethics 1.10 requires all members comply with all government rules and licensing requirements of the jurisdiction where he/she conducts business. So all InterNACHI’s requirements are on top of, and above and beyond whatever their state requires. I think in Washington, your state, you are required to pass a proctored state beginner’s exam such as the NHIE and fulfill some other entrance requirements. InterNACHI’s voluntary requirements would be in addition to those.
As for our requirements being “minimal.” That has to be the craziest statement ever made. If you think www.nachi.org/rigorous2006.htm are “minimal” what do you call diploma mills like ASHI that have zero entrance requirements?
Perhaps you just think that online education is weak. I’m afraid you are almost all alone on that one. Harvard uses online education. Yale uses online education. The U.S. military uses online education. There were 40,000 Doctorate degrees earned online last year in the U.S. Nearly every home inspection association, government regulatory agency and home inspector licensing board accepts online education including:
Alaska Department of Commerce Community and Economic Development, Division of Corporations, Business and Professional Licensing, Home Inspector Program
Arkansas Home Inspector Registration Board
Connecticut Department of Consumer Protection, Home Inspector Licensing Board
IAC2
Illinois Department of Financial and Professional Regulation, Division of Professional Regulation*
Indiana Real Estate Commission, Home Inspector Licensing Board
InterNACHI
Kentucky Public Protection Cabinet Office of Occupations and Professions Board of Home Inspectors
Master Inspector Certification Board
Mississippi Home Inspector Board
Nevada Department of Business and Industry, Real Estate Division
New Jersey Office of the Attorney General, Division of Consumer Affairs, State Board of Professional Engineers and Land Surveyors, Home Inspection Advisory Committee
Oklahoma State Department of Health, Occupational Licensing Division, Construction Industries Board, Committee of Home Inspector Examiners
Oregon Construction Contractors Board
South Dakota Real Estate Commission
Tennessee Department of Commerce and Insurance, Division of Regulatory Boards, Home Inspector Licensing Division
Texas Real Estate Commission (TREC)
West Virginia Department of Military Affairs and Public Safety, State Fire Marshal’s Office
Wisconsin Department of Regulation and Licensing
Face it, classroom courses harm consumers.
Even the U.S. Department of Education, against their own best interests, released a 93-page report from their 12-year study which revealed that online education is better than classroom education: http://www.nachi.org/online-beats-classroom.htm
… and Rob, the reason InterNACHI has so many members might have a little bit to do with intelligence. Any reasonably intelligent businessman (and we are all in business) can’t help but join InterNACHI. InterNACHI offers a better value proposition than any other trade association on earth (and I’m talking all trade associations, not just inspection associations). What other trade association on earth even begins to come close to our benefit-to-dues ratio? AARP?, NAR?, The U.S. Chamber of Commerce (which by the way, comes with your InterNACHI membership), NRA?, AAA?.. Nope. None even come close. What other association provides you with hundreds of hours of free, online, approved and accredited education, 200 free business success tools, lists you on thousands of sites, gives you $50,000.00 worth of membership benefits](http://www.nachi.org/benefits.htm)… all for just $289. InterNACHI is arguably the best run, highest ROI trade association in all of human history and getting better every day.
Again, it boils down to intelligence. I don’t mean to be offensive, but when I see a non-member inspector, in the back of my mind I think… “dumbass.”