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Originally Posted By: bkelly1
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I know what your talking about icon_biggrin.gif


Originally Posted By: pabernathy
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Actually…all crap aside I think the board is being revamped is why their is limited access to places Bob…starting our I was kinda teasing and standing behind my fellow electrician…lol…BUT I can see things get taken WAY to personal in these forums so I will simply cut back on my posts and pop in now and then…but I just wanted to say that is probably why your access was limited…


But anyway I think everyone is seeing those messages I believe and they are updating something.........


--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com

Originally Posted By: bkelly1
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Your right, way to personally icon_wink.gif


Originally Posted By: joetedesco
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I just joined the doityourself board, very nice and I will generate questions and try to help answer questions. I am sure that the electrical information below can be helpful.


The Breaker Box
Tools and Materials Checklist
Connecting Electrical Wires 1
Connecting Electrical Wires 2
Wiring in Older Homes
How to Install Home Wiring
Introduction
Preparation
Rough In and Box Replacement
Stud Preparation for Wiring
Placing the Electrical Terminals
How to Install a Doorbell
Installing Surface Wiring
Install a Door Chime
Cut Hole for "Old-Work" Electrical Box
Wiring Your Home For the NET
Hassle Free Home Wiring
A Short Lesson in Basic Electricity
Checklist for Electrical Projects
Switches, Outlets and Fixtures
Outlets and Switches
Question Concerning Color Coding for Electrical Wiring
Do It Yourself Circuit Breaker Box
Wiring and Lighting Q and A 1
Home Wiring Q and A 2
Properly Adding New Electrical Circuit Breakers
Wiring and Lighting Q and A 4
Wiring and Lighting Q and A 5
Wiring and Lighting Q and A 2
Wiring and Lighting Q and A 3
How to Install Electrical Wiring
Home Wiring Q and A 1


--
Joe Tedesco, Massachusetts
Home Inspector Provider
www.joetedesco.org
necmeister@gmail.com

www.nachi.org/tedesco.htm
www.nachi.org/tedesco2.htm
www.nachi.org/illinoislicense.htm
www.nachi.org/jtarticles.htm

Originally Posted By: pabernathy
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lol…Not sure I follow you Joe…lol…the DIY forum is just a place people come to ask questions when they are doing their own projects…true world experience is if people think they can do it they are going to try and do it…we are just their to help them get it done and stay alive while trying it…



Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified


Electrical Service Specialists


Licensed Master Electrician


Electrical Contractor


President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter


NEC Instructor


Moderator @ Doityourself.com


Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com

Originally Posted By: joetedesco
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I have a question:


What does the rule in 410 mean, where for a recessed fixture that the box shall be placed at least 1 ft away?

You know what they mean when used "placed"

Also, are you a member over on the ICC board? and lastly what do you look like?

![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif) ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)


--
Joe Tedesco, Massachusetts
Home Inspector Provider
www.joetedesco.org
necmeister@gmail.com

www.nachi.org/tedesco.htm
www.nachi.org/tedesco2.htm
www.nachi.org/illinoislicense.htm
www.nachi.org/jtarticles.htm

Originally Posted By: pabernathy
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Joe…are you bored…


I will assume you are refering to 410.67 (c) regarding taps and junctions and nope.....have nothing to do with the icc personally....I teach how to find things in the code...not to go around cut and pasting it.

What do I look like.....well I am 6'1" and am always in a pissy mood....![icon_smile.gif](upload://b6iczyK1ETUUqRUc4PAkX83GF2O.gif)

P.S. More reading for you joe

410.67 Wiring.
(A) General. Conductors that have insulation suitable for the temperature encountered shall be used.
(B) Circuit Conductors. Branch-circuit conductors that have an insulation suitable for the temperature encountered shall be permitted to terminate in the luminaire (fixture).
(C) Tap Conductors. Tap conductors of a type suitable for the temperature encountered shall be permitted to run from the luminaire (fixture) terminal connection to an outlet box placed at least 300 mm (1 ft) from the luminaire (fixture). Such tap conductors shall be in suitable raceway or Type AC or MC cable of at least 450 mm (18 in.) but not more than 1.8 m (6 ft) in length.

The higher temperature tap conductors must be in a tap box placed 12 inches away from the fixture and the fixture must be fed from tap box to fixture by a whip that is at least 18 inches to six feet long


Ok...How does this help HI's with random code questions?


--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com

Originally Posted By: rbennett
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A little electricity 101


1 For work to be done there must be a complete circuit
2 Every thing we do, think, see, hear, speak is electrical
3 Communication is electrical
4 E=IR ---same formula as D=RT and the list goes on


rlb


Originally Posted By: joetedesco
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Cut and Paste?


You have done that here too. What is wrong with that. You did not answer my question, I knew you would know the section --- but what is meant by "placed" and again where will I find you in Virginia?

Bored, not me just having fun.

Before the electronic code became available, and around the TRS 80 period I sent my students home with a list of words, such as "starwashers" "BIL" and other one liners, not found in the index and they were forced to read the code and try to find the words, now search and find and there it is.

One of the reasons this place has slowed down with restrictions, is because the place was Hacked around 6 PM last Thursday. I was on Amtrak on my way to Albany and the message was not very nice.


--
Joe Tedesco, Massachusetts
Home Inspector Provider
www.joetedesco.org
necmeister@gmail.com

www.nachi.org/tedesco.htm
www.nachi.org/tedesco2.htm
www.nachi.org/illinoislicense.htm
www.nachi.org/jtarticles.htm

Originally Posted By: pabernathy
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



hell Joe…Placed is not in my code book as definitions…lol…I think of placed as " Installed " or " located ". I choose to teach the student what they need to learn to work in the industry…not lose interest in it.


Now it MUST have some special meaning to you that the standard NEC does not observe in mandatory rules such as "shall not be required " or " Shall be permitted " and such....either way you can trust I do not teach " Placed" to apprentices..but again it must have some extra hidden meaning I am sure you will share with us.

As for cut and paste.....yep....and you know what I am going to start using it more and more...lol.. I was refering to questions like this...is your intent to seem wise...lol.....The point of cut in paste is fine if it answers a question...not to post rambling code idle topics that wont effect the HI's daily encounters....This is not an electrical forum website...lol

hmmm..Joe my address is clearly on my website posted in my profile...IN fact come on down and bring your tool belt..I can put you to work if you can still cut the mustard....lol...![icon_smile.gif](upload://b6iczyK1ETUUqRUc4PAkX83GF2O.gif)

P.S...I did not hack the site...I log in as a member..tehhehehee


--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com

Originally Posted By: pabernathy
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Another question came to mind…How come you are not a member of NACHI Joe?..any particular reason?


You do post quite a few items and donate alot of stuff...A book I believe. How come you have not joined NACHI as of yet?

I am new here so I kinda would like to know?


--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com

Originally Posted By: dduffy
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pabernathy wrote:
Another question came to mind....How come you are not a member of NACHI Joe?.....any particular reason?

You do post quite a few items and donate alot of stuff...A book I believe. How come you have not joined NACHI as of yet?

I am new here so I kinda would like to know?


I'm new also, and was wondering the same thing?????

Pretty wild....


Originally Posted By: jhagarty
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Paul & Dale:


There are factions that choose to discount the Level of Expertise and Professionalism that Mr. Joseph Tedesco brings to the table with the NACHI Organization.

For many Individuals, that have chosen to be NACHI Members from the early stages and remain today, the contributions of Joseph Tedesco are Welcomed and Recognized.


--
Joseph Hagarty

HouseMaster / Main Line, PA
joseph.hagarty@housemaster.com
www.householdinspector.com

Phone: 610-399-9864
Fax : 610-399-9865

HouseMaster. Home inspections. Done right.

Originally Posted By: joetedesco
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Thanks again Joe! I do have a membership card that will run out in February, and await an Honorary Membership.


JLC Online has me as a member for "Life"

Paul, now for the rest of the story, and why my question is HI related, and I do have an article written during the 50's about a "floating" or "throw away" box - that was the reason for use of the word "placed" in the section you posted.

Think about a ceiling, where there is no access, such as in a hotel lobby or in front and around our living room, the customer wants "Hi-Hats" installed.

The "home run" is installed from the panelboard, wherever it may be and to the first open hole that was cut out for that first fixture.

The cable or "rope' is installed into a 4 inch square, or "1900" box and from it daisy chained to all of the of the openings in and out etc.

This 4 inch square is now hanging a bit out of the open hole the electrician installs the "whip" with the fixture tap conductors into the box, makes up the splices, and puts the cover on and passes the box through the hole and "throws" it away into the ceiling.

I hope that makes it clear now. ![icon_cool.gif](upload://oPnLkqdJc33Dyf2uA3TQwRkfhwd.gif)


--
Joe Tedesco, Massachusetts
Home Inspector Provider
www.joetedesco.org
necmeister@gmail.com

www.nachi.org/tedesco.htm
www.nachi.org/tedesco2.htm
www.nachi.org/illinoislicense.htm
www.nachi.org/jtarticles.htm

Originally Posted By: dduffy
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



joetedesco wrote:
Thanks again Joe! I do have a membership card that will run out in February, and await an Honorary Membership.


Honorary membership? Maybe I'm missing something? I paid the membership dues and took a simple test........

What are all the nachi.org titles below your name for ?????


Originally Posted By: jhagarty
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



dduffy wrote:


What are all the nachi.org titles below your name for ?



Dale:

The links are recognitions for the contributions that Joseph Tedesco has made to NACHI.


--
Joseph Hagarty

HouseMaster / Main Line, PA
joseph.hagarty@housemaster.com
www.householdinspector.com

Phone: 610-399-9864
Fax : 610-399-9865

HouseMaster. Home inspections. Done right.

Originally Posted By: joetedesco
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



I am also a Provider in the State of Massachusetts. As a Provider, and as an Individual I will be available as the instructor, or can have instructors fall under my umbrella for part of the 24 hour requirement that is related to the SOP as follows:


http://www.mass.gov/dpl/boards/hi/index.htm


Rules and Regulations - 266 CMR

1.00: Reserved
2.00: Definitions
3.00: Procedure For Registration
4.00: Associate Home Inspector Training and Registration Requirements
5.00: Continuing Education
6.00: Standards of Practice
7.00: Reserved
8.00: Professional Competence and Conduct
9.00: Complaint Process
10.00: Procedures For Hearings and Appeals
11.00: Insurance Requirements For Limited Liability Corporations and Limited Liability Partnerships
Disclaimer:
Regulations appearing here are not the official version. The Secretary of State maintains the official version. For an official edition, please call the Regulations Division at 617/727-2831.


--
Joe Tedesco, Massachusetts
Home Inspector Provider
www.joetedesco.org
necmeister@gmail.com

www.nachi.org/tedesco.htm
www.nachi.org/tedesco2.htm
www.nachi.org/illinoislicense.htm
www.nachi.org/jtarticles.htm

Originally Posted By: bbadger
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:
Paul & Dale:

There are factions that choose to discount the Level of Expertise and Professionalism that Mr. Joseph Tedesco brings to the table with the NACHI Organization.


Paul and Dale take the above with a grain of salt, it's never wise to take one guys word for anything.

If you want to know the 'whole' truth I suggest you research past posts about this issue.


Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



jhagarty wrote:
Paul & Dale:

There are factions that choose to discount the Level of Expertise and Professionalism that Mr. Joseph Tedesco brings to the table with the NACHI Organization.


Thanks for your post Joe, Some of your posts make me think you could be talking about your self.

Many of your posts are very helpfull, but some make me wonder.

Roy sr


Originally Posted By: pabernathy
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Joe,


I have to be honest with you....again an electrician who is retrofitting a set of recess lights and using AC or MC flex at lengths over 6' is in violation as well but regardless the box would not be supported which in itself is a violation ( much less readily accessible ).

I have to say I do not see where a HI is going to be able to have anything to do with this.....after all if it is placed in and thrown in the HI will 1.) never see it and 2.) should never attempt to remove a recess light can cover or screw with junctions in the ceiling that are not accessible or cant be seen.

Is the 410.67 a violation if it is done other than the related way the code inplies....YEP.....But in HI's cases they will most surly not be able to see it.

The large issue is the rating of the wire going into older style recess lights that are not rated for the temp increase of todays rated cans which also fall under that article and to me is more important of a issue.

As to the comments....Jow I have no beef with you I understand your attempts to post questions but I can assure you I do not have 40+ years in the industry but I have nearly 20 and seen more than my share of violations.

As to Mr. Haggerty....never questioned JOE or his ability to teach as I said I do not know him but I did read past posts and I did read comments made on OTHER forums and came to my own conclussion.

I think joe can be a wonderful asset to NACHI as everyone is, but rather than simply posting NEC Code...how about actually posting it in layman terms so the HI's actually can relate to something rather than simply posting random articles or questions that will simply confuse the HI's..........

Anyway...I have no beef with you Joe T. and honestly could careless what you do and how you do it as my world revolves around other issues most certainly and I do not need to get into a pissing contest with you as I am sure I could post some questions that YOU would not understand and relate to....but it would be pointless and again" Placed" is a relative term that is not code specific....unlike" Listed, Labeled, Shall Be and well the code goes on.......

Lastly.....I happen to believe that relating code to everyday life for the HI is a far better function than just giving code refrences and posting code specific ramble.......that was the function of the NEC forum which has been closed....go figure but in the electrical forum I think it is a given that if people are going to help they help by giving answers to posted questions versus spitting CODE to them ( sure some code is fine for a reference ) and knowing they can't go back to the client and quote code without running into issues.

Just to clear it up...I never said JOE was a discounted asset or what have you....Joe H implied that..I did not......I think Joe T. could be a great asset and is......as long as the understanding is HI's are not Electricians and never should be.....they are generalists and need to know little about everything rather than alot about one thing.

And I have done the research......I have reviewed posts on other boards and I have read comments......I just choose to not get involved in that pers say directly...my question to Joe T about membership was to just see why he was not listed as a member...and that was all....no hidden agenda at all.


--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com