secure wire?

Originally Posted By: nbhi
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http://wire routing ]



“I have not failed I have just found a thousand way’s that didn’t work” Thomas Edison.

Originally Posted By: jpope
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gschering wrote:
I failed the electrical for this and many others items.


That's a pretty bold statement. Care to elaborate?


--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738

Originally Posted By: nbhi
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Hey, If you first don’t succeed try try again! Anything wroung with the way they have the wire secured?



“I have not failed I have just found a thousand way’s that didn’t work” Thomas Edison.

Originally Posted By: jpope
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gschering wrote:
Anything wroung with the way they have the wire secured?


Most certainly.

I was questioning the statement you made that you "failed the electrical."


--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738

Originally Posted By: nbhi
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The wire is taped to a water pipe, along with a host of other issues, doublr tapes, grounds missing, loose wires in panel, etc.



“I have not failed I have just found a thousand way’s that didn’t work” Thomas Edison.

Originally Posted By: nbhi
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First time I have ever seen this. My common sense tells me this can’t be right?



“I have not failed I have just found a thousand way’s that didn’t work” Thomas Edison.

Originally Posted By: jpope
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anything. My question is - How (exactly) did you word this in your report?



Jeff Pope


JPI Home Inspection Service


“At JPI, we’ll help you look better”


(661) 212-0738

Originally Posted By: nbhi
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[b]DEFECT! Recommed futher evaluation by a license contractor



“I have not failed I have just found a thousand way’s that didn’t work” Thomas Edison.

Originally Posted By: jpope
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Got it. icon_biggrin.gif


Now, if I may, I'd like to suggest that you avoid using the "F" word whenever possible (Further Evaluation).

You have already "evaluated" the condition and determined that there is a problem. "Further" evaluation is a waste of time and money.

Repairs are needed. Recommend "repairs" by a licensed contractor (electrical contractor in this case).


--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738

Originally Posted By: Jay Moge
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Jeff. that sounds like some well seasoned advice. I’ll take it. icon_cool.gif


Originally Posted By: nbhi
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Good point. Iam taking out the F word. Thanks Jeff[/b]



“I have not failed I have just found a thousand way’s that didn’t work” Thomas Edison.

Originally Posted By: bkelly2
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jpope wrote:
Got it. ![icon_biggrin.gif](upload://iKNGSw3qcRIEmXySa8gItY6Gczg.gif)

Now, if I may, I'd like to suggest that you avoid using the "F" word whenever possible (Further Evaluation).

You have already "evaluated" the condition and determined that there is a problem. "Further" evaluation is a waste of time and money.

Repairs are needed. Recommend "repairs" by a licensed contractor (electrical contractor in this case).


Jeff it is interesting that you do not like the term further evaluation, I was specifically told to use this term in my reports at HI school to help deflect litigation. I am not arguing with you but if you could flesh out your reasoning I would appreciate it.

BK


--
"I used to be disgusted, Now I try to Be amused"-Elvis Costello

Originally Posted By: ecrofutt
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I agree with Jeff. You’ve already evaluated it and know it needs repair. I use:


List of problems Here

I recommend that you consult with a qualified licensed electrician to determine the best repair methods, to estimate costs, and to perform the necessary repairs.


--
Erby Crofutt
B4U Close Home Inspections
Georgetown, Kentucky

www.b4uclose.com

Originally Posted By: Steven Brewster
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I will sometime use Needs Further Evaluation/Repair by… I always list the defects or concerns prior to this recommendation.


Also use Needs Immediate Repair....dangerous findings, safety/fire hazards.


Originally Posted By: Steven Brewster
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This may be off the topic but is relevant. I have a small construction company in which I do remodeling/repairs. I have been contacted by realtors to make necessary repairs indicated by an HI. I have seen some inspection reports that make the following statements in bold print (part of printed form).


Recommend licensed electrician evaluate the electrical system.
Recommend licensed plumber evaluate the plumbing system
Recommend licensed HVAC pro. evaluate the HVAC system
..........
..........

Is this a common practice? I do not recommend if not warranted. ![icon_question.gif](upload://t2zemjDOQRADd4xSC3xOot86t0m.gif)


Originally Posted By: dedwards
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I don’t either if not warranted. But if I find a system that is screwed up from stem to stern I do recommend further or more correctly “thorough” evaluation by a licensed tradesman. I do not have the time or the inclination to do a full analysis of the system. I recently did a home that had two full pages of just electrical discrepancies. Pretty much can determine the entire system is hosed. I have had to have a licensed professional completely evaluate systems that have been pieced together by incompetent homeowners and or their “friends” that think they know what they are doing. It is only a 'recommendation" but I believe it is warranted in some instances. Others will certainly disagree but w/o this caveat in the report real estate agents have been known to downplay the condition or importance of professional repairs. I can only speak from 11 years experience doing this. I have been called back to do re-inspections only to find the condition worse after “someone” brought in “their handiman” to do repairs beyond their abilities. More times than I care to remember. I do believe “further evaluation” is overused particularly if an inspector is uncomfortable with their own findings or training.


Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
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Do clients have a right to a re-inspection when you flag stuff like improperly supported romex as a defect?


Originally Posted By: pdickerson
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When I find a home with a rash of electrical issues, I list each individual item found, the I use the following language: “Due to the large number of electrical issues found in the home, recommend further evaluation and repairs as necessary of the home’s entire electrical system by a licensed electrician.” If the electrical is really messed up, there is no way I am going to identify 100% of the issues in the 20-30 minutes that I dedicate to electrical. Maybe 5-10% of the home I inspect get this statement. Incidentally, I rarely use this type of statement for any other system in the home, although I regularly recommend an annual service of the HVAC if I don’t see a service sticker.


Originally Posted By: wdecker
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Jeff;


I agree with you, if we see a defect, we should report it and recommend repair. But I always include the 'evaluation' part against the concept that I may have missed something. In other words, if I see double taps and a mismatched breaker, I write those up, but also recommend evaluation because there may be other things wrong with the panel.

Counterpoint?


--
Will Decker
Decker Home Services
Skokie, IL 60076
wjd@DeckerHomeServices.com

Originally Posted By: jpope
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Greg Fretwell wrote:
Do clients have a right to a re-inspection when you flag stuff like improperly supported romex as a defect?


The client can have the property inspected and re-inspected as often as they are willing to pay for. When repairs have been agreed upon by both parties in the transaction, the buyer can, at their additional expense, have a re-inspection prior to signing closing documents (at least in CA).

bkelly2 wrote:

Jeff it is interesting that you do not like the term further evaluation, I was specifically told to use this term in my reports at HI school to help deflect litigation. I am not arguing with you but if you could flesh out your reasoning I would appreciate it.


Making the statement that something needs "further evaluation," (in legal speak) implies that you don't know what's wrong or you don't know the extent to which the deficiency exists.

"Further evaluation" should be reserved for items that can't be seen. A common example would be a temperature differential of 8 degrees in the cooling system of the home. I don't know for sure why the split is improper (although I can guess), so I recommend "further evaluation" and appropriate repairs.

When I see a double tapped breaker, I don't need an electrician to confirm my findings.

Speculation, as in Williams post, is also an area that should be considered carefully.

When a large quantity of deficiencies exist in a particular system, speculation could warrant "further evaluation" of the entire system.

Example? If 90% of the accessible receptacles tested to be ungrounded and/or have reverse polarity, I can reasonably "speculate" (assume) that the ones I could not test may have problems as well, therefore, I recommend further evaluation of all receptacles based on my findings.

"Further evaluation" based on speculation (assumption) may not be warranted if only one or two deficiencies are noted in a particular system. This is where experience becomes a factor.

HI training is simply a beginning where they teach us to "protect" ourselves from ourselves. As we gain experience and knowledge, we should also gain the confidence to make decisions and statements that are more definitive and better serve our clients.


--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738