Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Bob,
I agree....either way both the HI's and EC's have a win/win situation. The best advise I can give HI's is make sure they know which NEC is enforced in their state before they note anything on the report.
Everyone seems to foget that in the end it is up to the CLIENT and BUYER to have the issues checked.....HI's are only making observation.
The key here also is for HI's to NOT go beyond their scope of the SOP when doing a inspection unless they have special background in electrical but again some things are obvious.
You are SOOO right about some poor EC's......as their are good and bad professionals in every field.....
You can always find a good EC that takes pride in his work by visiting them on a rough in....look at how the wires are run, how the wires look above the panel ( spider web or neat and aligned ) but we know all are not created equal.
They way I see it.....HI's are not going anywhere ( i do both ) as well as being a electrical contractor and instructor and regardless of how some may feel.......Real Estate Agents demand the HI's and it is growing...
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: dandersen This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Quote:
In most areas electrical inspectors can only look at buildings that have a electrical permit open, and even then they are usually limited to things with in the scope of the permit.
On the other hand HIs can look at everything, they can even make recommendations for safety that go beyond the codes at the time of construction, that is something electrical inspectors can not do.
This is a good point of view!
Home inspectors can be considered a source of income!
Obviously, if an electrician is being called back on a job that they performed which was deficient they will be a little emotional, however if this is their first trip to the job siding they should welcome the service call!
I would be very appreciative if an electrician would recommend a home inspection to any of their clients!
When following up a home inspector, the client is dictating the code requirement (if it exceeds the existing code). Often subcontractors shun the recommendations of the home inspector instead of just performing the requested work.
I have had very little run-ins with subcontractors and contractors during my home inspections. My reports state the facts as observed and recommend remediation. When asked by a realtor how it should be fixed, I explain that there are a thousand ways to fix anything and that the ultimate goal achieved is the only concern. Leave it up to the contractor.
I avoid "recommend further evaluation by a licensed contractor" whenever possible. This opens the issue for debate, discussion and argument. The deficiency is noted, the required repair is dictating and anything further that the licensed contractor comes up with is up to them. I write it up, leaving this option open for the licensed professional.
It is often a home inspectors opinion that once the deficiency is located, the cause or supporting information to the deficiency is unnecessary. This takes a little more knowledge and sometimes test equipment, however it gives basis to the inspection report. When the licensed contractor comes in to follow up on the inspection report, there is a set of facts that must be addressed not merely an opinion that the system is not functioning or installed properly. Interpreting the building codes is viewed by some to be a liability on the home inspector. The home inspection report is not code enforcement so in my view I do not feel it is a liability. My client determines what repairs will be made and how they will be conducted. I provide the client with the information to determine if they want repairs done at all. If I viewed the building code requirement improperly, unless my client is requesting something illegal or a violation of a building code, the repair can still be requested. Anything can be contractually agreed upon (if it's legal).
Sorry for the redundancy, you guys slid your posts in ahead of me while I was working on something else! Well said! 
I agree that often seems to be a problem for the ECs to remember.
Maybe it is the word 'inspector' that throws them for a loop, perhaps it would have worked out better if Home Inspectors where called home observers. Maybe then the ECs could understand that the HIs reports are not binding and do not necessarily have to meet the same standards of an electrical inspector.
An example of what I mean is a HI could say that they recommend GFCI outlets be installed in the bathrooms of a 1940s home when we all know that home was in compliance when built.
-- Bob Badger
Electrical Construction & Maintenance
Moderator at ECN
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Quote:
An example of what I mean is a HI could say that they recommend GFCI outlets be installed in the bathrooms of a 1940s home when we all know that home was in compliance when built.
I agree.....It would however be wrong for a HI to not mention it in their report that they suggest a GFCI be installed in the bathroom for the added safety of the client as a recomendation...not a code enforcement requirement as the HI does not have that authority.
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
lol…I knew what you meant Bob…most certainly and you are 1000% correct.
EC's install to the minimum of code....HI's inspect to the maximum of safety in their observation.
Now many EC's treat a house as their own and go above and beyond the call of DUTY......just want to make sure HI's do not go beyond the scope of obervation....
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: bbadger This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Hey I do not mind being 1000% correct…if only it was true.
I consider myself lucky as many of the jobs the company takes have job specifications that go well beyond the NEC. So I have no choice but to exceed the minimum code requirements.
-- Bob Badger
Electrical Construction & Maintenance
Moderator at ECN
Originally Posted By: bkelly2 This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
pabernathy wrote:
lol...I knew what you meant Bob....most certainly and you are 1000% correct.
EC's install to the minimum of code....HI's inspect to the maximum of safety in their observation.
Now many EC's treat a house as their own and go above and beyond the call of DUTY......just want to make sure HI's do not go beyond the scope of obervation....
Maybe something like this
Quote:
Although not required when originally built, all of the kitchen countertop outlets should be upgraded to have ground fault protection by an electrician, which is mandated by current standards and is an important safety feature.
-- "I used to be disgusted, Now I try to Be amused"-Elvis Costello
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Brian,
That is a GREAT way to form a observation...nice !
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: tallen This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
bkelly2 wrote:
pabernathy wrote:
lol...I knew what you meant Bob....most certainly and you are 1000% correct.
EC's install to the minimum of code....HI's inspect to the maximum of safety in their observation.
Now many EC's treat a house as their own and go above and beyond the call of DUTY......just want to make sure HI's do not go beyond the scope of obervation....
Maybe something like this
Quote:
Although not required when originally built, all of the kitchen countertop outlets should be upgraded to have ground fault protection by an electrician, which is mandated by current standards and is an important safety feature.
Absolutely brilliant
-- I have put the past behind me,
where , however, it now sits, making rude remarks.
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Quote:
Just think, Todd. In about 85 to 120 years, you could find yourself sitting at the very top of a very tall oak tree.
Now that right their is funny....lol......Git-er Done !!!
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
