May I recommend, no predicting, guessing, assuming.
It is or is not a defect or deficiency.
Inspectors Observe called Observations.
Inspectors Recommend called recommendations.
Inspector limit/omit comments on structures or parts of structurer’s, systems and components not visible called. Limitations. You will have a SoP waiver in your contracts explaining this.
Observation: Roofing. Inspected from the ground.
Plane Two sided Gable roof. Wavy roof deck sheathing.
Roof covering; Composition shingles. Wavy by appearance. Buckled composition shingles next to the chimney and main plumbing vent stack.
Metal flashing painted black. Chimney sidewall flashing not flat, sung to the roof deck sheathing. No visible chimney counter flashing. No visible Apron flashing. Composition Shingles are secured on top of the metal Apron flashing, not under the flashing.
Metal plumbing vent pipe flashing and base. Visible damaged. Visible staining, corrosion. Bucked at both bottom outer edges creating a visible gap. Visible dents and repairs with plastic cement. Suspect: Old original main plumbing vent metal flashing.
Note: Galvanised steel flashing can last up tp 100 years or more under ideal conditions. In usual/typical/normal roofing applications, the average lifespan of galvanized steel flashing is generally anywhere from 25 to 50 years realistically.
Recommend: A licensed roofing contractor; further evaluate the roof covering, and service any areas of concern. Timeline. Immediately. Act upon any recommendations therein.
Limitations: Inspected from the grounds. Attic was not entered.
Thank you for the advice. I was going down the rabbit hole for one reason to gain the experience that will stop me to question what do I have to look for next because of the observation found. Thank you for correcting me on this, because I was going down the rabbit hole.
Well appreciated for your time and sharing of your expertise. I too hope to share my expertise in the future!
Morning, Peter. Once again, hope to find you well.
You are quite welcome.
Peter, I feel you were not going down a rabbit hole . You were thinking out loud. Hypothesize why defects exist.
Next step is buying and learning how to operate home inspection equipment, if you feel you wish to go that route. Moisture meter. Hygrometer. Non contact voltage meter. Combustible sniffers.
One last thanks to all of you that contributed to my topic. Very well appreciated. And also, Ryan thank you for the information on the chimney/chase cap; that will go into my data base.
Good morning to you too Robert. Yes, I actually own 99% of the equipment needed, except for the drone. I most likely will go the drone route, because I will not go onto roofs that are greater than what is comfortable. And yes I was thinking outloud, but it did draw some good criticism, and that helps steer me to think!
Thank you for helping me Study and THINK about the process, and the end result.
My advice; don’t get a drone! Read the archives here about drones. With the limited roof knowledge you demonstrated, you are going to miss a lot of important roof issues! I know I would miss important issues with a drone, and I have well over 35 years construction experience. I know where to look when inspecting a roof. Inspect from the roof edge with a ladder. Get a 12’ extension ladder that will get you up 20 feet. Eyes on the roof are way better than looking through a screen. Walk roofs at 6/12 slope or less. It’s way faster to inspect walking the roof, vs using a drone or a ladder from the roof edge. Less a drone, you will have to disclaim some areas on some roof configurations, but that’s rare. With a drone, you won’t disclaim but you are very likely to miss a critical issue or two. Roofs are a critical inspection system to get right.
Maybe after a bunch of years inspecting roofs, you may decide to get a drone. Don’t do it now.
“Could not”, or you chose “not to”?
This is one of many potential decisions you will need to make in real life as an Inspector.
How do you intend to handle this scenario while on the job for a paying client?
You can be the best inspector in your area, but if you make the wrong decision here, you could be out of business in ‘short order’ from a bad reputation.
Lot’s to think about beyond “observations”.
Question: Are you an Internachi Member, or simply a “Messageboard Member”?
You have been around here since March.
It is assumed you are new to this job, but you state you worked for a roofer for a long time. You also train Code Officials and Fire Marshals?!
You say, “I make an effort to read extensively”.
When was the last time you read the home inspection SOP applicable for your location?
This is not a job you found out about at 2:00am watching TV where you can just jump right in without knowing anything about construction. As you continue to post, it appears this is not the case, maybe.
Can we assume you spent most of your life hopping around roofs, and you’re asking about a roof?
As Michael pointed out, your focus needs to be with report writing.
When I first started out, a friend looked at my business plan and stated that the only tangible thing you have to offer to a client is a written report.
So let’s start there.
You don’t need help with narratives. If you can’t write down what you see and put it on paper, you’re not qualified to write the report.
Go read your SOP and follow it. It tells you what and how you inspect, what you must write in the report, what legal requirements are required of you.
As for your OP question where you can’t see the interior view of the roof, you simply state you didn’t go in there, and why. Done! You may need something more to do that (like permission to be on the property).
As for your roofing questions, the SOP says you report defects. What is the defect? Does the roof leak?
You talk about that it was not installed correctly, “the installation may not follow best practices”. How something was installed when the house was built does not go in the report if it is operating as intended (not leaking), regardless of its appearance.
You do not predict the future. It’s only what you see today.
You do not enforce building code.
But you can add extra stuff, if you’re qualified, which you apparently are not (see the SOP).
We do not care about moss, granules, sagging, chimney pointing, unless it is associated with a previous observed defect (like a leak). What caused the shingle condition, and what it talked to correct the observation, is not your job (see SOP). Your job is to look at the house and report what you see. You need nothing more than a flashlight and a screwdriver to do this job (no drone). Walking on a roof in this condition is a safety issue to you and will likely damage the roof, causing leaks which you will be responsible to repair, and potentially more (see SOP).
Trespassing by the way is against the Code Of Ethics.
You need to read that one also.
Almost every HI goes outside the SOP. Some know what they are talking about, many do not. You can not write about what you do not know. The canned narratives talked about are fine, but may not fully address what you’re trying to say. If you don’t know what to say about something, how do you select the correct one to use? So if you don’t know the fact, don’t write or speak about anything if you do not know the answer. We are not here to impress the client.
There are three people you should consider who will be reading your report. If you step on their foot with wrong information, causing a financial deficit, they are the one’s that will be coming after you, not just your client.
I hope this gets you on the right tract.
Back up for a minute and consider what is required of you, not just what defects there are out there to address.
I tend to disagree. Anytime one doesn’t walk the roof, there should be some limitation disclaimers in the report, in my opinion. Heck, even when walking the roof, there can be limitation disclaimers. For instance, I have one when the roof is partially covered with snow/ice that I use even if the roof is walked.
Interesting. The NACHI SoP states the roof is to be inspected from the ground or the eaves.
I describe my method and what was not inspected and why. I do not say that I didn’t walk it, didn’t use my binoculars, didn’t use a drone, didn’t fly a broom, didn’t inspect from Google Earth etc.
I have a limitation that I put in when I am not able to open the electrical panel cover. Is that something you do? I just always assume I should add a limitation when I can’t inspect something the best way.
The opportunities are limitless on things we do not inspect the “best way.”
My argument for your statement is not “ because it is the best way” but rather your common practice.
For you would not want to be in the hotseat and it be determined that you are not consistent with your method. That one client got the roof walk and the other did not. You may be accused of bias or gross negligence.
Many many many inspectors do not walk roofs or open panels, no need to disclaim this.
Interesting that you don’t disclaim not opening a panel. I disclaim it because it is contrary to my typical/standard preferred inspection practice. Same with roofs. When I can’t walk the roof, I disclaim why I deviated from my typical and preferred inspection practice and also note the methods that were used instead.
Returning to the topic, I was jotting down my thoughts quite loosely. I’m trying to determine when to classify something as a defect to ensure my reports remain fair and balanced. My observations were limited to the exterior only, because I was unable to access the attic.
The following are my notes; they are not a Narrative.
From the exterior, I noted a localized area of curled shingles they were not observed throughout the roof. I also observed minor lifting at the shingle edges. To me these conditions raised a concern for potential water intrusion, particularly during wind-driven rain events. I would call this as a DEFECT and RECOMMEND FURTHER EVALUATION of the entire roof by a licensed, and insured roofing contractor prior to the closing on the home.
Should my call differ?
Also, the visible sagging of the roof deck between rafters suggested to me that a possible structural or moisture-related issue was looming in the attic. If attic access were available, I would have conducted an inspection of all areas to identify any signs of active or past moisture intrusion and or signs of structural issues.
So, let’s hypothetically say the sagging between the rafters were present, and I walked the roof to find the decking stable, and no moisture or structural issues were observed on the inside. I would write this as a cosmetic defect.
Should my Call Differ?
Thanks for your input and sorry for the confusion.
I realize the chimney will require repointing a few times in the life cycle, and it appears to be ready. I am trying to gauge my perception on a few items that I have not had extensive exposure to make decisions about. Once I have a gauge I can work with it.
Thank you for your repeated inquiries. It shows that you all care enough to take some time to work with each other in an industry that appears to work together towards the betterment of whole industry.
Defect recognition is a skill that requires training and experience. Keep coming up with the questions. But don’t be defensive; it is exhausting to those trying to help. For example, everything Jeffrey stated was spot on.
