Violation of Ethics, Violation of Fair Information Practices

Originally Posted By: Jim Russell
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



There is nothing unethical about offering services as a home inspector.


Radon testing is an added service and renders a labratory result.
Water testing renders a labratory result.

Unuathorized distribution of confidential information is unethical.

Our real value as inspectors is increased with education not from large numbers of inspections under the belt. Your first fee paid inspection should be as thorough as your 250th. Real certifications are acquired through class room attendance, training, participation and testing.

Many people have strong opinions which may appear to be brash, negative or even mean spirited. They may even appear to be just plain stupid. However, it is our experience that most folks who seem to be overly negative or argumentative are simply uneducated.

Through honest education, we see a different meaning of things. The lights may be on, they're just not alligned.

In the effort to conserve energy, houses are built tighter today. The jury may still be out on house wraps. In high humidity conditions, the structure simply cannot dry properly. And just forget about stucco esp. when applied over a wood substrate.

So the mold becomes an issue. If you think "selling" a client on a mold test is unethical, then simply inform your client that you provide the service. Your client may not share your opinion about mold testing. To your client, it could be of high concern. Many clients today expect inspectors to provide mold testing.

The real crime here is lack of education. It is the responsibility of the inspector to educate the client on things observed so the client can make a more informed buying decision. If mold is a concern of the client, down playing mold testing or pooh poohing the process might actually be considered cheating the client out of a complete investigation of the property.

Get Trained, Get Tested, Get Certified, Get Good.

If you think selling someone the need for any added service is wrong, simply inform your client what services you do provide and let your client decide.

Otherwise, tell your client up front,"I don't do mold testing. If you have any mold concerns, you need to hire another inspector."

There are many many highly regarded professional inspectors across the country who offer mold testing (gathering, the lab does the test) as an added service. Time is of the escence in a real estate transaction and inspectors who provide intelligent services benefit everyone in the deal.

Best to you all,

Jim Russell
Atlanta


Originally Posted By: slanicek
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Jim,


I'm curious. How did you obtain your status of "Inspector General"? Is there some organization that has bestowed this upon you? Oh, wait, wait wait........of course there isn't. After all, you wouldn't dare lower yourself to any such affiliation now would you? After all, if you did you couldn't really promote your own schooling system, right?

http://www.hihq.com/checklist.html

http://www.hihq.com/agents.html

Now I'm not only curious, but also confused. On the link above you make many of the same statements as in your original post of this thread. But on the link above there is no mention of ASHI anywhere? Yet when you posted here.....there is. ![eusa_think.gif](upload://lNFeGuTetUAtwNVgUSOuUzgrGGK.gif)

http://www.hihq.com/instructors.html

Funny how the ASHI logo is at the top of the page where you're also listed as a salesman/marketing for the organization.


Originally Posted By: slanicek
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



, when you successfully complete the course.



![icon_question.gif](upload://t2zemjDOQRADd4xSC3xOot86t0m.gif)


Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Quote:
I would like to thank Jeff, David, Blaine and Joe for responding to this very important message. The exchange of good ideas and opinions will always sharpen our resolve.


You know, I'm never one to turn down a compliment, but in this case I feel I must. This was the response I made, which will help to sharpen our resolve:

Quote:
Dan, Joe, Blaine...

Like laser guided missles... Boom, boom, boom...

Good job guys.


Now, just in case I wasn't the JOE that Jim was referring to, here's what the OTHER Joe had to say to him:

Quote:
I personally believe you are one seriously misguided individual about a few of those statements that you made.


I assumed it was me he was speaking to, as he felt the need to call me and want to talk about my response. I didn't remember who this guy was, or what either of us had posted. I certainly didn't know I was speaking to a General.

Ten-Hut!!! ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: ekartal
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



I would much rather refer a client to a mold specialist if they desire this service. I know many of inspectors who gave this service the boot. There is no way I’m going to tell a client if they have mold or not. Doesn’t matter if a lab tested it.


Erol Kartal
ProInspect


Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Interesting…


Is Jim's school an ASHI affilliate? Is Jim an ASHI member? Has Jim gone after ASHI for requesting information from its members as a matter of violation of the public trust?


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: jpeck
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Jim starts out with a major whiz bang against unethical conduct in his first post in this thread …


"Candidates and members of Associations and Societies are probably in violation of the Public Trust."

Then ends up trying to sell his mold certification and other training.

Was that first post just a 'come on' post. Bait and switch?


--
Jerry Peck
South Florida

Originally Posted By: slanicek
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Quote:
Was that first post just a 'come on' post. Bait and switch?


That's all I'm getting from the whole thing. I think the only reason he has ASHI included in his rant is because of where he is posting, on the NACHI site. Bash inspection organizations on one hand and after he's got you mad at all of them the other hand comes out from behind his back with the offer of his school being the best (for roughly $1,850 bucks ![eusa_dance.gif](upload://s9dv24YwSSRLNpgOOSxL1BkwUQ9.gif) ) because they are endorsed by one of the aforementioned inspection organizations.

I do like the Inspector General label though. Maybe we should go with that instead of CMI?


Originally Posted By: Jim Russell
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Joe .


I understand you. You're just uneducated.

Jim
![icon_cool.gif](upload://oPnLkqdJc33Dyf2uA3TQwRkfhwd.gif)


Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Jim,


You may think I'm uneducated, But I can assure you I am not. Regardless, it doesnt take a Phd to figure out where you're coming from. Remember the Beatles' "Nowhere Man" ?

To all reading this, I would suggest that the best way to forget about old Jim is to ignore this thread. Which is what I am about to do.


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: jmyers
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Jim R.


If you were looking for someone that is uneducated, look no further you have found me. I am overly negative and argumentative. I believe that you seem to be a little confused though, uneducated people tend to be more violent than their educated counterpart, not more negative or argumentative. ![icon_biggrin.gif](upload://iKNGSw3qcRIEmXySa8gItY6Gczg.gif)

With every word that is uttered from your mouth, you just have a tendency to PI** off everyone around you. Not a very good way to promote education and/or your services if I do say so myself, and I do say so.

When I think of education, I think of people that really want to make me better at what I do, not come in and bust some chops of those around me that have helped me to become what I am today.

While I may not always agree with the Joe F's and Jerry P's of this board, one thing that I always show them is respect. While I agree that I am certain there are unethical inspectors out there, there is this thing that is the law in America Land of innocence until proven guilty. Most inspectors really want what is best for their clients but they just are not all that good at conveying those realistic expectations to their clients, which lead them into a false sense of security. Many of the cases which I hear about are not that the client got a bad inspection, just the inspector did not relay very well what the client should and should not expect.

NACHI does promote better inspections through disclosure, limitations of liability and defining expectations. I don't believe that any are here just to rob clients of a fee, they are here to make a living.

Since we obviously started out of the wrong foot, I am offering this suggestion. Go take a few good communication courses and brush up on your social skills. After that, change your name and come back with your new wealth of knowledge and re-post that sales pitch. Try to keep the sales pitch to one subject and not venture off on that unethical, voice of the people, our associations are condoning illegal activity line of crap.

Ethics would dictate that our inspectors follow their state law, if that state law states they have to turn that information in, then they are just following their state requirements. According to the NACHI code of ethics, they would be in ethics violation if they were not to follow their state requirements which would be grounds for them loosing their membership to our association. If you want to save the world, go fight with the states that write those requirements into law, our inspectors are just following the law.

Best wishes.

Joe Myers


Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



icon_smile.gif icon_smile.gif



Joe Farsetta


Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: dvalley
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.







David Valley


MAB Member


Massachusetts Certified Home Inspections
http://www.masscertified.com

"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go."

Originally Posted By: jmyers
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



David, Joe F.


Thank you, thank you, thank you! ![icon_biggrin.gif](upload://iKNGSw3qcRIEmXySa8gItY6Gczg.gif)

You know, I think people seriously blow this school sh** out of proportion. While I agree that it is good for inspectors to be educated, it would be equally, if not more important for the school to teach them how to cover their butts by disclosing what is and what is not covered in the inspection. Many of the cases that I have heard about were not about bad inspections, with exception of a rare few, they were about non disclosure on the part of the inspector, where he failed to report that it was not inspected and why.

People ask me if I am going on the roof which is covered with ice and snow. My reply...sure, I will follow you!

I call it the DUH factor!

Joe Myers


Originally Posted By: slanicek
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



icon_eek.gif




Go back and check the links I posted earlier........

Notice any differences !?!?!?!?!??!?



the ASHI logo............gone

the ASHI affiliate verbiage........gone

Jim on the 'Instructor' page described as 'Sales/Marketing'.......gone


Originally Posted By: dvalley
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



I went back, because I was curious as to your insinuation of something drastic being changed or edited. I’m not quite sure what you?re referring too…


ASHI affiliate logo....still there ![](upload://aknpuDfhccrZKRyjQTQQ4l0sais.gif)
Jims? name.............still there ![](upload://aknpuDfhccrZKRyjQTQQ4l0sais.gif)


http://www.hihq.com/instructors.html


--
David Valley
MAB Member

Massachusetts Certified Home Inspections
http://www.masscertified.com

"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go."

Originally Posted By: Blaine Wiley
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Dave,


I just followed your link and didn't see anything about ASHI or Jim's name on the page. ![eusa_think.gif](upload://lNFeGuTetUAtwNVgUSOuUzgrGGK.gif)


Originally Posted By: slanicek
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Dave,


Their gone. I think your browser might not have updated the page. I follow both the links I posted as well as yours, as well as enter them in manually and they all show the same thing.

I just think it's funny how the things I pointed out to him that made him seem some what of a hypocrite suddenly disappeared from the web site within 24hrs. The ASHI affiliate thing is kinda odd because currently the company is listed on ASHIs site as an affiliate. If it's a move to become more neatral when it comes to HI organizations, that's great! I don't mean to hound the guy and drive him away if he has some constructive input but I just wanted to know what the deal was on some obvious conflicting information. Especially when he came outa nowhere with that original post of his.


Originally Posted By: jmyers
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Steve,


Maybe he is following my suggestion and coming back as someone else, along with a new sales pitch. Hopefully when he does he will be smart enough to just provide the sales pitch and SH** CAN the rest of that crap-o-la he was spreading around. I am sure there are some of our inspectors that are interested and would take that type of course since some do offer those kinds of services.

Joe Myers


Originally Posted By: dvalley
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



,


Where?d you go? ![](upload://1DxZYofTwXNZTfZ4i6tcmLMn3aS.gif)
Can you explain what happened to your infamous status?


--
David Valley
MAB Member

Massachusetts Certified Home Inspections
http://www.masscertified.com

"Some cause happiness wherever they go; others, whenever they go."