What to say on the 4-point

I just inspected a home and the owner put on his own shingles, so there is no permit. How do I address this on the 4-point form?
Thank you!

Was it a total re-roof?

No sir it was 3/4 re-roof.

What’s a 3/4 re-roof?
Not allowed, so no permit would have been issued.

Don’t overthink it, “No permit data” “Date unknown”

You can list the approximate install year in the Comment Section, if your confident or comfortable, really could go either way.


Perfect, thank you!

That was Dominic :cowboy_hat_face:

I appreciate you, thanks

Thanks for the assist !

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I did a 4 point last week and the realtor called me because I put “unknown” on the permit date. They said citizens was denying insurance if there was no permit on file…
Not sure if that’s true, but is interesting if they start going that route

@dhorton2 yes it is true. I’ve had multiple four points kicked back already. Multiple agents have told me it’s something new from citizens, if there’s no roof permit or no invoice or some kind of paperwork to show when the roof was replaced they are not writing the policy. So they’re no longer accepting our estimated roof age on the form.


That is interesting as I would think that if they denied insurance for lack of proof then it could cost them business. An unusual business model. I wonder how they expect we would know if someone pulled a permit 10 years ago? Sometimes I think someone like a secretary was charged with a task of making a form and they just put a bunch of junk on it to make it look like they did something.

Insurance in Florida is a headache right now. Lots of carriers have left, gone out of business, and rates are increasing.
I think some carriers are just finding ways to deny new clients. Some dont even insure homes older than 15 years old.

But for citizens to do it is odd, because they are sometimes the last resort for many older houses with old wiring and galvanized water lines.


There are a few municipalities that keep building records for ten years only, in my area.
South Palm Beach, Palm Springs, City of Atlantis; come to mind.
I’m sure there are more.
There are many good roofs out there over ten years old.

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I asked a respected ins agent this & he said:
If date of last update and/or permit says “unknown” or “estimated”, it will not be accepted & forwarded to some other dept for further review.
Then they will not offer a policy OR will offer it if you purchase flood insurance.
WTF! I am not in a mapped flood zone but will be forced to sped half a grand or more upon my renewal??
He said is was approved by our State Legislature.


It may be possible to get the roof permitted retroactively, with the help of an engineer.

I have seen a couple older roofs with newer permits, so I’m suspecting this is what happened. Don’t know for sure though.


That’s ridiculous

Roof permit is now required on the 4pt. If no roof permit , in your case, put na in the roof permit section and just put whatever year of last update , partial replacement,75% and complete the rest of the section