When mechanical equipment is in the attic...

I go above and beyond any standards to get the job done.

I agree. Our job is by its nature hazardous. That’s what they’re paying us for.

Before I was an inspector, I installed radon mitigation systems for many years (with Nick).
I was installing a radon fan in the attic space.
I fell through the ceiling (two legs).
The house was being sold, and closing was in one week.
The house painter was in the room below me, and he got on the intercom system, laughing out loud, telling everyone to run up to the bedroom ceiling and check out the radon guy falling through the ceiling.
I installed the system.
Patched the ceiling.
And changed from boots to sneakers - which was the lesson learned.

Man I hope a ceiling joist was not in the middle of your legs…oooocch.

On one inspection, I entered an attic cavity door through a master bedroom closet over a garage. I traversed the ceiling joists over the garage and explained a few items to her then exited the attic cavity. I then turned around to answer one of my clients’ questions and I see my female client inside the same attic space standing on top of the drywall (between the ceiling joists). I quickly yelled to her to step on the wood joist, quick. She then made it to the joists safely, maybe due to the thickness of the firewall. I tell my clients to stay out of these areas but they refuse to listen. Thank GOD she never fell through.

OSHA is a “standard” just as HI has a standard.

Building codes are just a “standard” for the HI, though there are many Barney Fifes here.

Less than 30" in the attic is a “confined space”. Can’t you figure that out Joe?

I didn’t say not to inspect. If it is not “Safe” don’t do it. If someone asks why, OSHA defines confined space.

How do you intend to justify to your Insurer how you fell through the ceiling way out yonder…?

If there is “sufficient” insulation in the attic, your are “damaging” the sellers house walking around in it.

Everyone needs justification in this business. What makes this so different?

They are not paying us to damage the property.
They are not paying us to get killed. There are a lot to things like bare wire connections in those confined spaces.

So you think this is just a bunch of Bull *****?

I’m sure the CMI program requires you to know these things…

???

Oh dear…

I’m concerned about stepping upon fire sprinkler system pipes when the attic is filled with blown-in fiberglass insulation, and not being able to return the insulation after disturbing it.

residential-fire-sprinkler-under-the-insulation.jpg

You gave no indication in your earlier post that you meant attics that were indeed access limited. I read your post to say that you don’t traverse any attic spaces unless there is decking. If that’s not what you meant, then I apologize for reading it wrong.

You have no idea what an OSHA defined confined space is…and an attic is for darn sure not one!!

Confinded spaces require permits, a spotter and other items before entry. I have never seen and most likely will never see an attic that requires a permit and a spotter to enter.

Chuck

I have worked in commercial attics and they sure as hell were regulated by OSHA!

You know darn well that OSHA does not hang around residential construction sites, but have an employee die on your job site and see who shows.

If you want to disect the definitions and add your own spin then go ahead. Still does not apply to attics!

Chuck

Attics are not considered confined spaces.

1910.146 Confined space means a space that:
Is large enough and so configured that an employee can bodily enter and perform assigned work; and
2. Has limited or restricted means for entry or exit (for example. tanks, vessels, silos, storage bins, hoppers, vaults, and pits are spaces that may have limited means of entry); and is not designed for continuous employee occupancy.
Non-Permit confined space means a confined space that does not contain or, with respect to atmospheric hazards, have the potential to contain any hazard capable of causing death or serious physical harm. :slight_smile:

Personally if does not feel safe to enter i will not. I do the best for my client. but i will not risk life or limb. It has kept me alive doing it this way most of my life , Not just doing Inspections but in ever thing.

Wayne,

I fully agree with you. However I am not gonna cry “I can’t or won’t go here or ther due to OSHA standards” as they have no place or bearing during a home inspection.

Chuck

Neither does swinging across trusses comply with Home Inspection Standards.

I didn’t say it is an OSHA violation, you spend too much time trying to enforce these codes and regs.

My point is IF you were not inclined to enter a 16" attic space and someone asked you why…

“I just don’t feel like it”, don’t cut it!

I am not implying we fall under these regs, but have you ever found a detached furnace flue, bare wires, gas leaks in an attic?

I have (ever have bare romex hit you in the forehead as you climb into an attic? If not, Give it time.), and if I feel that a piece-of-crap house may have these in a place where I have no requirement to go I won’t.

Call it “spin” if you like. If you can’t enter confined spaces IAW OSHA regs for a specific reason I have no problem using them if they parallel these safety standards.

I posted 10 reasons above why you don’t have to enter a dangerous space IAW HI SOP, especially when your working alone! I know your superman and this doesn’t apply to you though!

Where is he I would like to meet him :mrgreen:

Chuck

Last I saw him he was traipsing through my attic over to where I keep the kryptonite! :wink:

BTW, I own a Cape Cod style home without a 30 inch attic! :slight_smile:

:-k :mrgreen:

The code section is IRC M1305.1.3

There are a couple of exceptions…

Beyond the basic objective of providing access for servicing equipment the basis of the requirement is for safety of service personnel. Because attic spaces may be subject to extreme temperatures the thinking is that the risk to service personnel being exposed to extreme heat is reduced if suitable access is provided. This is why one of the exceptions extends the maximum distance to 50 feet if the headroom is at least 6ft, allowing the service people to walk upright rather than crouch or crawl to and from the equipment.

We don’t do fire sprinklers in attics here, unless you don’t mind flooding your home in the winter months from freezing/bursting pipes.

I agree David .

http://www.nachi.org/forum/f52/accesible-roof-heights-52018/

I’m not the only one that uses OSHA “excuses”!