Wind mit Scenerio #8

And we are just getting started. It would be good if a few more people took part. We get a lot of views, but minimal input. Sometimes its good to hear the wrong answers so that those that know the correct answer can explain why. To the viewers out there, don’t be afraid to ask this forum for input, we are all just trying to make the best educated guess

great post john, we all need to add posts such as this to bring out the gray areas of 1802.
i would say that from the pictures I woud rate the connection as other in that a strap or clip while providing uplift must also provide lateral support. Because the strap is not shimmed solidly to the truss it has no lateral support.

Here is another interesting topic. Why does OIR-B1-1802 require that a strap be bent over the top of a truss and have at least one nail in the oppisite face when that is not required by the building code.

Florida Building Code Residental 2007
Chapter 8
Code Artical

A continous load path shall be provided to transmit the uplift forces from the rafter or truss ties to the foundation. For rafter construction, straps and or clips shall extend such that the top nail is within 1" of the top of the rafter, or shall be wrapped around the top of the rafter with one or more nails installed on the oppisite face of the rafter

Many of those ‘views’ may be from inspectors not in Florida, such as myself. I suspect many don’t post due to the fact that we tend to get ‘bashed’ by a handful of Florida inspectors with attitudes because it’s a “Florida issue” and doesn’t concern us. So, why bother. Personally, I don’t give a damn what those “my sh*t don’t stink” inspectors think. If it’s related to building science, I’m gonna read it, educate myself, and offer my opinion whenever I feel compelled to do so, as witnessed earlier in this thread.

Jeff

Keep reading and posting is not that the purpose of the these forums to gain knowledge, I personally like reading about what is going on in differant regions of North America

Exactly Mark.

As for Wind Mits, Florida may be the only state with a wind mitigation program, but I guarantee you that Florida does not have a monopoly on high winds, or the need for high wind resistant construction. Ever hear of tornado’s? Ever visited the East slope of the Rockies? Or the High Plains of the Upper Midwest? Many areas of the country deal with high winds on a daily/weekly/monthly basis, not just when the occasional tropical depression/hurricane force winds move in, a few months of the year. Not belittleing what you guys have to deal with, as I know it’s severity first hand. I’d love to perform a follow-up inspection of a few of the aforementioned inspectors on a home outside of their own backyards.

Wind mitigation is not limited to Florida, Florida was the first for obvious reasons. I heard that NJ was looking at also. I personally like to see other points of views. Other areas of the world have different construction issues they have to deal with, many of, I am glad I do not need to be concerned with.

After living in the North East for many years I am glad I do not have to inspect those home. I have nothing but respect for those that inspect those older homes. I assure you it is much easier to inspect a newer slab on grade home here in Florida, no basement, no, crawl, and next to no attic. All that being said there are several unique items we pay attention to and may seem to do some items backwards. When you build in a hot and humid environment some things have to change.

Wind Mitigation reports are unique to the fact that they are not about building codes, but statistics. These are the items that insurance companies track. It is about loss prevention and not if the proper code or better than code being followed. Anyone doing insurance inspections must just accept it.

John you hit the nail on the head. The Wind Inspection is an Insurance inspection. Insurance is about statistical data and loss prevention.

The Insurance Industry has designed the form to represent statistical data of expected losses related to their understanding of struction details.

In the Insurance world, an inproperly nailed Strap, is equal to a Clip.

It does not have to make sense to us. We simply have to be aware of the requirements for each rating and be as accurate as possible.

Just did a check of the IRC and found that there are 26 states that have “Special Wind Zones”

Thanks for the research Mark. I remembered seeing the info somewhere, but couldn’t remember where, and didn’t want to post info as fact that I couldn’t support.

I’m glad you are not effected by the bashers as I don’t take offense or care what these individuals think either. There will always be those that post negative and condecending comments, and while doing so simple show their ignorance. The purpose of this message board in my opinion is to share views, gain knowledge in our weak areas and educate when and where we can. If the bashers understood this, maybe they wouldn’t be so quick to ridecule.

Clips

I’m changing my answer because I didn’t see the pics. They are clips because there not enough nails.

Send the pictures to Bill York I am sure he would love to have them for his next training course. I personally would put F since you don’t know what type of wind those trusses can take with the crappy installation of those straps

Just a thought; what if the trusses were “toenailed” when the trusses were first set, then clips were added later. Which is it? If you have to use the “weakest” condition observed as the default, then by the letter of the law all the trusses are “toenailed”. I bring this up because I used to be a Public Adjuster and I know how insurance companies work and will fight the homeowner (and their inspector) over the cost of a door knob. This program is a huge cluster **** and froth with potential problems yet to be discovered. Kinda like ObamaCare.

Honestly, I believe this is the one case where you would over look the toe nail and go directly to clips.
Here’s why, Toe nails are just nails. They could have been part of the truss stablization during layout of the house before the clips were installed. I would completely over look them.
However, if it were clips and straps. I’d go with clips. There is a difference between between temporary nails and overtly installed clips.

I would argue that it is not the weakest individual link of a fastening system, it is the weakest combined link of the system. Otherwise you would have to call a double wrap a single wrap, since it is made up of two weaker single wrap links.

How did class go Dennis?

Not great - Still no definitive date on when the reinspections will start, they were suppose to start july 6 th. We were all being thanked for our patience and understanding, but quite honestly, i think many are running a little low on patience. We were just informed that EM Solutions has partnered up with DSI Management Co. (out of Tallahassee) for reasons one can only speculate about. I think Citizens is initiating some sort of zero tolerance approach for the reinspections, and the partnership was necessary to assure quality control — perhaps — but I really don’t know —I heard rumors that a Management Vendor had recently performed a couple thousand reinspections and the quality assurance was not acceptable as too many reports were rejected. Perhaps this is the cause for the delay and the Inspection Depot training. There was quite a motley crew of contractors there – I don’t see all of them panning out, but thats kinda stupid for me to say, i looked just like them. lol

I would also choose F (other), and provide an explanation in the space provided (in addition to photos). The insurance company would then have the info they need without subjectivity (as the connections shown are clearly deficient single wraps).

According to the training instructor yesterday from Inspection Depot - This would be considered a clip.