Turmoil At The Top?

I’m baaaaaAAAaack! We had nearly two inches of rain down here last night. Kept making the power flicker on and off so I just gave up! ( Now the bloody lawn will start to grow again:roll: )

“Turmoil” was the word used by the ‘mole’. It appears that there is serious unrest in some quarters over this issue as it brings to mind other past glories such as the insurance disclosure fiasco and a couple more.

"Mole, Mole, Moley, mole, mole, mole . . . . . . ":mrgreen:

Ray - my comment regarding a “team of lawyers” was used to reference the fact that it’s unlikely to see a “team” of lawyers agree on this document.

Other observations include a few “redundant” clauses in the agreement that need not be included in this agreement - that are already stated in the SOP.

If OAHI goes ahead with its own method of self-insuring its members, similar to the model setup in CAHPI-BC, it is likely all practicing (OAHI) members will be mandated to use a standardized contract. That is the case for CAHPI-BC.

The issue respecting insurance disclosure is based on the by-laws of the association; I see it simply as “due diligence” by OAHI, passed down as a requirement in the interim to its memebers to satisfy the requirements of the by-law.

As General Contractor I Carry Liability Insurance It Used To Be $1 Mill Was Enough,now $2mill Is The Norm,i Did A Job For One Of My Clients In A Major Shopping Mall And They Required $5mill One Time Thing No Big Deal Broker Added The Extra$3mill.guess What Guys,it Cost Me Less Than $1000.00 Per Year To Carry.e&o At $5000.00 Per Year No Thanks.it’s Not Like We Are Charging $1000.00 Per Inspection And Justify The Cost.i Agree With Roy,advertise That You Carry E&o And You Might As Well ‘paint A Target On Forehead’ And Ray I Think Paul’s Inspection Agreement Makes Sense,up Front,‘i Don’t Carry Insurance So Don’t Even Think About Suing’

Mario,

I “think” you made good sense but reading it gave me a headache.

What was it you said??

Not nice but I loved it. A good laugh . Roy cooke

I’m Talking About Liability Insurance Costing Less Than $1000.00
Vs.e&o Insurance Costing $5000.00

DO YOU CARRY E&O INSURANCE? MY POINT HERE [AND I DON’T WANT YOU TO GET A HEADACHE NOW] IS THE COST OF E&O INSURANCE.WHY DOES IT COST SO MUCH?
AND I WAS JUST COMPARING THE COST OF LIABILITY INS.
I DON’T CARRY E&O BECAUSE OF THE COST.

Stop Mario, Its a long wet week end and many have not much to do and look on the BB to see how we all can enjoy our selves .
I understood exactly what you said and meant and others did to we are all just going from post to post to pass the time and enjoy it .
Wait till a blizzard comes and we all get even more stir crazy.
I have to go out now in this wet miserable day and Cook T bone steaks on the BBQ mushrooms cauliflower and baked potatoes .
Life can be so cruel some times . TTYL Roy

Sheesh Mario, calm down.

I was just referring to your lack of spacing, running everything together, capitalizing everything.

Makes it hard to read and confuses your message.

“I’m Talking About Liability Insurance Costing Less Than $1000.00
Vs.e&o Insurance Costing $5000.00”

E&O Costs suck. I get it.

Claude,

If OAHI or CAHPI goes the route of self insurance and a standard contract is to be used, I think you will see many inspectors opt out of OAHI-CAHPI. These are business decisions to be made by members. Not business decisions for members based on what the Association thinks best. Self insurance yes, mandatory contract no. But I would not have a problem with association providing advice as to what should be required on the contract.

Roy and George,

I didn’t get heavy rains just steady gentle rain and no winds. But the hydro went out. But I got a chance to try my new tractor driven (PTO) generator. :slight_smile:

ERBY

I keep the ‘caps lock’ on and capital everything when I submit it, just caps the beginning of every word!!

That Is Because In The Message Board World All Caps Implies That You Are Shouting.JUST HIT THE ENTER KEY EVERY NOW AND THEN TO LEAVE SOME SPACE.BY THE WAY I AGREE WITH YOU THAT E&0 COSTS SUCK AND PAINTS A TARGET.I DON’T SEE IT CHANGING ANYTIME SOON THOUGH AND I REALLY DON’T LIKE MANDATORY E&0 AS IT PUTS THE INSURANCE COMPANY IN CHARGE OF WHO IS IN BUSINESS AND WHO IS OUT OF BUSINESS.VERY FEW PROFESSIONS ANYWHERE ARE “REQUIRED” TO CARRY PROFESSIONAL LIABILITY INSURACE.IT MAY BE A GOOD IDEA BUT I DON’T THINK IT SHOULD BE A REQUIREMENT FROM THE GOVERNMENT.WHY WOULD WE WANT TO GIVE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES ANY SAY OVER WHO CAN BE IN BUSINESS AND WHO CAN’T.

I hope you get my point.

THAT IS BECAUSE IN THE MESSAGE BOARD WORLD ALL CAPS IMPLIES THAT YOU ARE SHOUTING. JUST HIT THE ENTER KEY EVERY NOW AND THEN TO LEAVE SOME SPACE. BY THE WAY I AGREE WITH YOU THAT E&0 COSTS SUCK AND PAINTS A TARGET. I DON’T SEE IT CHANGING ANYTIME SOON THOUGH AND I REALLY DON’T LIKE MANDATORY E&0 AS IT PUTS THE INSURANCE COMPANY IN CHARGE OF WHO IS IN BUSINESS AND WHO IS OUT OF BUSINESS. VERY FEW PROFESSIONS ANYWHERE ARE “REQUIRED” TO CARRY PROFESSIONAL LIABILITY INSURACE. IT MAY BE A GOOD IDEA BUT I DON’T THINK IT SHOULD BE A REQUIREMENT FROM THE GOVERNMENT. WHY WOULD WE WANT TO GIVE THE INSURANCE COMPANIES ANY SAY OVER WHO CAN BE IN BUSINESS AND WHO CAN’T. I DON’T THINK A REQUIRED (GOVERNMENT OR ASSOCIATION) INSPECTION AGREEMENT IS WORTH A DAMN EITHER.

I hope you get my point.

E&O is economics 101 for insurers. It is cheaper and expedient to settle out of court for less then the amount the complainant is seeking. If its a very large amount the claimants are seeking it is likely the insurer will fight provided the inspector can substantiate through his report and first hand account of the matter in dispute, and providing the claimant can not substantiate 5 points required as set by Queen vs. Cognos (neglegent misrepresentation)

An earlier standardized contract. Never utilized.

Bill Mullen put together this survey on E&O insurance. Its quite revealing.

Thank you Bill Mullen.

Government mandated E&O leads to 3 things:

  1. Insurance companies will raise rates because they know you have to buy their product to be in business. How would you like to own a pizza shop in a town where everyone by law must buy a pizza from you every week. You could charge $50 for a pizza.

  2. Insurance companies will settle quick, never let you have your say in court, then dump you, even when you did a perfect inspection for a nutcase.

  3. Insurance companies, after they settle a frivolous claim and dump you, will share that information with other insurance companies, effectively black listing you. If you can’t get government required insurance when you have to by law… you’re out of business.

Take a tip from us right-wing Yankees… and keep the government out of everything except national defense and space exploration.

Not entirely true. Realtors in Canada are a perfect example. They must carry E&O but they pay an annual fee of approx. $150. Also if the legislation hopefully through lobbying cap inspectors liability, which would reduce premiums.

That happens now, and has happened and will continue becuase its economical for the insurance industry to do so.

That is not true either. Especially if liability is capped or the government sets up self insurance or insurance fund as they do with other government agencies.

Also associations have historically failed to provide sound solutions in over the decades as it applies to Canada.

Not entirely true. Realtors in Canada are a perfect example. They must carry E&O but they pay an annual fee of approx. $150. Also if the legislation hopefully through lobbying cap inspectors liability, which would reduce premiums.

That happens now, and has happened and will continue becuase its economical for the insurance industry to do so.

That is not entirely true either. Especially if liability is capped or the government sets up self insurance or insurance fund as they do with other government agencies. The black listing is and is happening. I know of many members in OAHI who could not get insurance through no fault of their own.

Also associations have historically failed to provide sound solutions over the decades as it applies to Canada. NACHI will not change the equation in my opinion.