Undersized entrance cables

Hello everyone,
I am hoping someone can verify I am correct with my finding. Thanks for the help in advance. I opened up a service panel which is right next to the sub panel. The subpanel disconnect is in the service panel. This conductor is oversized for the 50amp breaker as shown in photos(top left breaker, below is 60amp breaker). This, however is not what the question deals with. But it does add to the problem. Looking at the entrance cables to the service panel they are labeled as shown, AWG 2/0. This would be undersized for this panel. The main disconnect is 200amps. I looked up the cable and it says 2/0 - Aluminum - 150 amps. Am I missing something here or is it as simple as that? It is undersized? Sorry if this seems like a silly question, I may be thinking to hard.



You have a bigger problem with that cable than what you are asking about…!!

6 Likes

The three finger out of focus cartoon pointer or the cut cable?

6 Likes

Hey now. What’s wrong with my finger pointer? :laughing:

2 Likes

That is a big one, and it is called out as such.

The neutral is allowed to be a size smaller. What size were the 2 ungrounded SECs’?

And loose the finger pointer thing. :sweat_smile: :wink: :grin:

2 Likes

Nobody likes the finger? It saves me soooo much time.

I used my handy dandy cable gauge and measured those at #4/0. I did not measure the neutral. When I was compiling my report I noticed the labels on the neutral (#2/0). That really threw me for a loop. I have always confirmed with SEC’s so I guess have not ever thought about the markings on the neutral. Thanks for help Ryan!

2 Likes

What software do you use? Don’t they have an easy annotation capability? The one I use, you take the picture and it immediately opens up an annotation window where you can add arrows, lines, shapes, etc, and caption the picture.

I see you are In SD. I’m in MN. Hello neighbor!

FIXED!

4 Likes

I use “The Finger” all the time on the MB.
NEVER in a report!!

4 Likes

I’m an “ARROW” guy myself.

ALWAYS in my reports!

:rofl::rofl::rofl: nice fix!!
The photos I put on here are not the ones used in the report. I dont actually use the software in the field. I take photos using the “finger” then compile report in the office. If I need the arrows I will use them.

2 Likes

I use Spectora. First software I purchased so I dont know any different. In the field I do not use the software. I can move faster taking photos with “the finger” then comoiling the report at the office from the photos. When I point at something in the field I know what it is. I dont need to type notes into my phone and fumble with all that. At the office photos go right into the report with no edits at all. Just trying to be more efficient.

3 Likes

I use Spectora as well. But unlike you, I do use it in the field. I finish and proof reports on the desktop writer though. It does take a little more time to add arrows and such on the desktop.

I agree with Ryan the ungrounded conductors look like #4/0 which is good for a 200 amp service. The neutral is permitted to be smaller based on the calculated load.

3 Likes

Is there any thing stating “one size smaller” in the NEC Robert? I have always heard that rule of thumb, but based on your comment, is it purely determined by calculated load? Is there a quick/dirty way for us to verify appropriate neutral SEC size during a home inspection?

Without knowing the calculated load on the neutral there is no way to know absolutely.

1 Like

Correct.

image


image

1 Like

For a dwelling IMO the quick and dirty way is too ensure that it’s not more than two sizes smaller than the ungrounded conductors. If you look at some of the Southwire AL SE cables you’ll see that the neutral is 2 sizes smaller from the factory.

https://assets.southwire.com/ImConvServlet/imconv/7f1133975e3e4b8c5ab3ee2f1881b50f3d3d4ef8/origin?hybrisId=otmmHybrisPRD&assetDescr=Aluminum%20Service%20Entrance%20(SE)%20Cable.spec

4 Likes