Originally Posted By: gporter
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Thanks Doug, I agree with you.
–
Gary Porter
GLP’s Home and Mold Inspections LLC
Orlando, Fl 32828
321-239-0621
www.homeandmoldinspections.com
Thanks Doug, I agree with you.
www.homeandmoldinspections.com
Originally Posted By: rcooke
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| porter wrote: |
| Thanks Doug, I agree with you. |
why not ask your lawyer and see what he says about could you be getting in to deep by exceeding the SOP.
I did and do try to always follow the sop.
--
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: rmoore
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
| Quote: |
| Give your clients the same information you would want to know if you were buying the house! |
| Quote: |
| Worth the 2 minutes it takes to do a pressure check. |
  
| Quote: |
| The sop is to try and help us stay out of court.
All H.I. Associations use a similar SOP for our protection. Some inspectors could be jeopardizing them selves and others by continuing to raise the SOP. |
Covering our assets may be a side benefit of the SOP but isn't it also true that the SOPs were designed to protect the homeowner from drive-by inspections? In other words, they define the MINIMUM a client should expect from a good home inspector. We are supposed to meet the minimum standards...not match them! Big difference!
If my dedication to my client dictates that I always (emphasis on always) exceed the SOP in some areas, it's because I have chosen to be more thorough than those who use the standards to do the absolute minimum. That doesn't "raise the SOP" for others any more than a high-end builder raises the standard requirements for all other homes. "A job woth doing is worth doing well" may, unfortunately, be an outdated concept but there are still a few of us out there who feel that quality is more important than quantity.
If you don't want to do a simple pressure test...fine. You don't have to. Just don't suggest that others are doing you disservice by doing so!
--
Richard Moore
Rest Assured Inspection Services
Seattle, WA
www.rainspect.com
Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
| rmoore wrote: | ||||||
  
Covering our assets may be a side benefit of the SOP but isn't it also true that the SOPs were designed to protect the homeowner from drive-by inspections? In other words, they define the MINIMUM a client should expect from a good home inspector. We are supposed to meet the minimum standards...not match them! Big difference! If my dedication to my client dictates that I always (emphasis on always) exceed the SOP in some areas, it's because I have chosen to be more thorough than those who use the standards to do the absolute minimum. That doesn't "raise the SOP" for others any more than a high-end builder raises the standard equirements for all other homes. "A job woth doing is worth doing well" may, unfortunately, be an outdated concept but there are still a few of us out there who feel that quality is more important than quantity. If you don't want to do a simple pressure test...fine. You don't have to. Just don't suggest that others are doing you disservice by doing so! |
Please do not think I am, worried about you doing a disservice.
I charge more and get more inspections then I need .
I could care less if you wish to exceed the SOP, that is your choice .
You have made up your mind.
I am worried about the new Inspector who takes the info you give as gospal and could end up in Court .
Please read my last post .
Talk to your lawyer do not take what is said here as gospal.
There is much great information on this board but some that should be looked at very close .
Many areas have different rules.
Write Hard talk soft and miss nothing.
--
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: jwilliams4
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SOP=Minimum inspection. I am NOT a MINIMUM Inspector.
I'll leave being minimum to the code builders and code inspectors.
--
"not just an inspection, but an education"
Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
| jwilliams4 wrote: |
| SOP=Minimum inspection. I am NOT a MINIMUM Inspector.
I'll leave being minimum to the code builders and code inspectors. |
Please show me whereNACHI SOP it says minimum.
I looked and can not find it .
The building code says
The Code is essently a set of minimum provisions
Thanks Roy sr
--
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: mcyr
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Hopefully this is not taken to oddly, but I do not really want to be to Frenchly bass ackwards to you all.
Obviously, water pressures talked about here seem to involve a well pump considering, observations of the pressure gauge. Fine, but if you are reading 105 psi. I believe your well pump is oversized and your well pressure tank in undersized.
Pressure reducing valves are for city water and not for well pumps if it was properly designed.
I agree with Roy Cook as to why some try to exceed the SOP as far as inspections. Has it gone to some's head, that they are (Inspectors) and they should know it all and I am it as they would say?
The SOP's were written up for home Inspectors with a certain training and educational limit expected. It was not expected for them to be State Inspectors, Code Enforcement Inspectors, or Governmental Inspectors. Do not get or try to be on that High Horse of glory, for you probably have far to go.
Listen to the wise people on this Bulletin Board, share the knowledge and grasp to the parts that further suit your needs. Some will help and some will fill you with bureaucratic @#!#$. Unfortunately that happens in everyday life.
Back in 1985, I was a Resident Construction Engineer for the General Services Administration on a Construction Project for the Houlton, Maine Border Station to Canada. I had the power of Attorney over the Architect, Clerk of the Works and all the subsequent contractors on the site. You know what? To have that much power and not know everything, sucks.
I did my job as I thought it should be done. I was further given a $500 bonus for the deed, my job was made permanent and I resigned 18 months later. Figure.
Take heed to titles that one wishes to have. Life is a learning experience of no end. Once you think you have got the monkey by the tail, experience has not yet started.
Beware of the endeavors you take thinking you no and are experienced in that particular subject, it is only a feather touch of what you need to know to be a professional clear and blue, and no I am not talking about myself, I have failed yet to claim that I am the best Construction Superintendent around, but I am still working on it. ha. ha. I have gotten some pretty good reviews in the past, but now I have to start applying that to Home Inspections.
Ah well. Time will tell.
Thanks for the ones that read this and yes I have broad shoulders for criticism.
Marcel
Originally Posted By: gporter
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
S.O.P.'s are a guide. It gives you something to follow. It is not black and white. I have had them guide me in my current full-time job at a jail for 20 years. It does not say we have to talk to an inmate but we do. An S.O.P. tells you what you have to check not what you can’t.
–
Gary Porter
GLP’s Home and Mold Inspections LLC
Orlando, Fl 32828
321-239-0621
www.homeandmoldinspections.com
Originally Posted By: jwilliams4
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
If you inspect in strict adherence to the SOP, you will short change
your client in many respects. I'm not doing this because it's an easy
way to make a living....most people my age are playing golf or fishing
everyday. My objective is to help folks truly understand the house
they are buying and I frequently go beyond the SOP to do so.
You have your way and reasons for inspecting and I have mine.
My clients frequently have experienced other inspectors, and they
tell me they got a lot more information from my inspection that
made them feel so much better about their house.
That's my story, and I'm sticking to it...for my clients.
--
"not just an inspection, but an education"
Originally Posted By: bkelly2
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I use a pressure gauge and defect over 80 PSIG. In my neighborhood all of the water comes from storage tanks higher up on the hill. If there is no regulator on the water line you will easily find over 100 psig at the hose bib.
The pipes and valves can usually take the increased pressure, but the appliances and other things attached to the plumbing do not respond well to the higher pressure. 
--
"I used to be disgusted, Now I try to Be amused"-Elvis Costello
Originally Posted By: jwilliams4
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
In the case of this thread, water pressure, I check the pressure at many
spigots and explain it's value to the client. They really would like to know
and it helps them to make a decision. But then, after all, that is exactly
why they hired me.
--
"not just an inspection, but an education"
Originally Posted By: ecrofutt
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Marcel,
Your problem seems to be very common to those who learn a lot.
The more I know, the more I know I don't know.
Sometimes I fell like a dog chasing his tail and never, ever, ever, catching it.
--
Erby Crofutt
B4U Close Home Inspections
Georgetown, Kentucky
www.b4uclose.com
Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
| jwilliams4 wrote: |
| If you inspect in strict adherence to the SOP, you will short change
your client in many respects. I'm not doing this because it's an easy way to make a living....most people my age are playing golf or fishing everyday. My objective is to help folks truly understand the house they are buying and I frequently go beyond the SOP to do so. You have your way and reasons for inspecting and I have mine. My clients frequently have experienced other inspectors, and they tell me they got a lot more information from my inspection that made them feel so much better about their house. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it...for my clients. |
I guess I just might be a little older then you .
I to inspect for my customers and do also exceed the SOP b .
My written report is 30% of my inspection .
My verbal is 70 % ( my gestimation ) of my report .
I tell people this will not be in to report but &^%%(*&(*& .
My written report is SOP no more no less.
CYA use the SOP and stay out of court.
CYA = Cover Your A$$
--
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: gporter
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Verbal things can still land you in court. Your word against theirs but you can still be there. My wife is studying for the Florida Bar and I have heard the taped lecture on verbal contracts until I want to scream. Please pass the damn bar so I can burn the tapes, Cd’s and those dumb Barbri books.
–
Gary Porter
GLP’s Home and Mold Inspections LLC
Orlando, Fl 32828
321-239-0621
www.homeandmoldinspections.com
Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
| gporter wrote: |
| Verbal things can still land you in court. Your word against theirs but you can still be there. My wife is studying for the Florida Bar and I have heard the taped lecture on verbal contracts until I want to scream. Please pass the damn bar so I can burn the tapes, Cd's and those dumb Barbri books. |
You can go to court for any thing the only time some stop being idiots is when the die.
Write hard talk soft miss nothing.
--
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: jwilliams4
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Two scenarios–
I inspect the house and don't check water pressure. Client depending on
my report buys the house--moves in. Water all over the place--seals
burst in the Jacuzzi and the washing machine. Plumber comes out and
finds 110PSI water pressure. He says "Man, your inspector should have
told you". Client makes two calls. First call to the inspector who says
"Oh, I don't inspect that. SOP says I don't have to." Client says "What
DO you inspect" and makes the second call--to the attorney.
Sure, you can hide behind the SOP and probably win in court--
that is if your insurance company doesn't settle first--
but it still is going to cost you...money for court and no referrals.
Scene two
I inspect and measure pressure--110PSI. Explain orally to the client
what that means and how to remedy. Put it in the report.
Client buys the house--moves in--hires plumber--installs regulator--no
leaks--and they live happily ever after.
Oh yeah, they make one call--to me. Come on over for a cook-out
Saturday and meet our friends...
...who are looking at houses to buy.
Hiding behind an SOP will not keep you out of court--a solid.
thorough inspection with information and education will.
Happy clients don't sue--they refer.
--
"not just an inspection, but an education"
Originally Posted By: jwilliams4
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
I do not inspect houses to keep out of court.
I inspect houses to inform and educate.
If clients are satisfied they will refer me.
If they are not satisfied......
--
"not just an inspection, but an education"
Originally Posted By: rcooke
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Do you inspect the voltage and put down what you find.
At what voltage do you tell the client it is to high or too low .
Do you check the wire sizes going from one receptacle to another.
Do you check all plugs for grounds.
These are just some of the things you could be missing .
You have now established you do exceed the SOP where do you stop and why do you stop there.
How thick was the dry wall in the Basement and the garage.
I do not check this but did find one last week where the home owner had used 1/4 dry wall in a ceiling area he had done himself.
This showed up on a visual inspection. I might have missed it on a wall.
Once it is confirmed in court you have exceeded the SOP the questions could go on for a long time .
I still can not find where the SOP is a minimum inspection.
I only bring this information up to try and help new inspectors stay out of difficulty.
As I said if I exceed the SOP I never put it in writing.
I have confidence in my report and I try to make sure I miss nothing that I do not carry insurance.
Remember Insurance is only for the Home Inspector not the purchaser.
–
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: rcooke
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
| jwilliams4 wrote: |
| If you inspect in strict adherence to the SOP, you will short change your client in many respects. . |
Can you give me some of the respects where I am short changing my client by not exceeding the SOP
--
Roy Cooke Sr.
http://Royshomeinspection.com
Originally Posted By: jwilliams4
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Roy,
Yes, I inspect for voltage drop, but some drop at a distance is to be
expected and may not necessarily be a hazard or safety factor.
Most appliances are equipped to handle this.
I will mention it in passing and include it as a disclaimer in the report.
This is for education, because occassionally someone's brother-in-law
is a hot-shot know-stuff who says "voltage drop!! head for the hills --
we're all gonna die!!!"
My client can explain that it is normal and they can get back to their
beer before it gets cold or warm or something.
Yes, I make a random check for wire size and outlet amp rating
and I check for grounding and polarity. If I find one wrong outlet,
they all get checked. (Found an ungrounded outlet in a 3 year old house
a couple of months ago. The buyer asked the seller to have it repaired
and when I went back to re-inspect it they were noticeably pissed at
me for catching it. About a week later the seller called me to inspect
their new house they wanted to buy.)
I exceed the SOP only if it is a safety or hazard concern, or if
immediate damage could result.
Where do I stop exceeding the SOP--where it isn't necessary to
get all excited about whatever I find.
How thick is the drywall--if I can see it somewhere as you did,
I'll mention it--if not, what is the safety or hazard?
An aspect of short-change? If I fail to include helpful information
because the SOP says I don't have to.
I think it was Erby who said to inspect as if you were doing it for
yourself. The client is no different than I am, and I think the things
I would like to know, they would like to know.
If I tell them something at the inspection, I will also put it in the
report as a reminder. If I can say it, I can write it. Like I said before,
I have nothing to hide and am not afraid of my information or my
knowledge.
BTW, it may be you're not older that I, you're just better looking.
--
"not just an inspection, but an education"