Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Could someone please tell me if Barometric dampers are required on every oil burning boiler & furnace?
I've run into several boilers lately that do not have these installed. Are they installed only when drafing problems occur or are they considered a mandatory installation?
Originally Posted By: chorne This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Hi David,
I do not know if they are required, although I think that
they are.
I just replaced my forced air furnace and the technician
said that I should have one, the old furnace did not have
one and I think that caused some of my problems with
the old furnace. ??
Ps. I just purchased a new pontoon boat, (of course for island
inspections/taxes)  and it has stars and stripes graffics. Think I
should name the boat the patriot? From one fan to the other!!
Originally Posted By: dbowers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
David - The answer is yes. Look back in your books from wherever you went to HI school and you’ll find this. Many national HI tests have this question and the one about is a Steam Boiler supposed to have a sight glass, or what type boiler uses a Hartford Loop.
Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Carla,
Pontoon boat? For island inspections? Sounds like adventurous Inspections to me. It must be nice to hop in your boat to go to work. The Patriot sounds like an award winning name to me. Go for it!
Dan,
I've only attended two courses in HI school, I decided to drop out. The instructor was reading HI books to the class (word for word) every time we attended. I wasn't there to learn how to read, I was there to learn the aspects of HI's. When you sit there and read books to me, I'm not interested. I can read books at home by myself. So I never returned.
Gerry B. finally took over that class as an Instructor and turned it into a real HI course. By that time, I was on the road doing my State required time.
I've always inspected for these dampers, but lately I've seen too many newer boilers installed without the damper. A damperless vent, right into the chimney. I thought I had missed something new that came out on the market to replace these.
Just made me curious as to why so many are missing. Are todays installers that idiotic?
Originally Posted By: roconnor This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Quote:
IRC M1801.2 Draft requirements
A venting system shall satisfy the draft requirements of the appliance in accordance with the manufacturer's installation instructions, and shall be constructed and installed to develop a positive flow to convey combustion products to the outside atmosphere.
Quote:
IRC M1802.3 Draft regulators
Draft regulators shall be provided for oil-fired appliances required to be connected to a chimney. Draft regulators provided for solid-fuel-burning appliances to reduce draft intensity shall be installed and set in accordance with the manufacturer's installation instructions.
Notice the requirement for a chimney connection, and that direct vent heat plants would be vented per the manufacturer's instructions.
-- Robert O'Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee
I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong
Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Robert,
Now what? Thanks for the information.
I see that we must now read the manufacturers directions. 
I'll be honest, I've reported several missing dampers lately. I haven't received any call-backs stating that I was wrong, Yet.
Ok...Now we're back to my original question...Could someone please tell me if Barometric dampers are required on every oil burning boiler & furnace?
I could use more opinions please. Do you tell your client to find the manufacturers directions? Or just note it on the report as I?ve been doing? Maybe request that this damper be checked by the technician on the service call?
Originally Posted By: jsavino This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
David,
You had question back in Feb. about draft regulators. I installed oil fired boilers and furnaces for 30 years. They are required. I installed them right out the chimney, with a smoke tee not at the boiler breeching.
They are made to equalize the pressure in the heating equipment. They should open when the burner comes on and close when off. They should be balanced by using a draft gauge and with the use of weights. They may open and close with the wind blowing across the top of the chimney. You will notice this on a windy day, if its set up properly.
Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
John,
Thank you kindly.
A "smoke tee" damper on the chimney or at the breeching is definitely required.
So the next time I see a damper-less oil fired furnace or boiler, I will inform my client that this is an improper installation and I will report the missing damper as "Missing, recommend heating contractor evaluate and install a required damper on vent connector or chimney."
Again, thank you for your solid answer. Very much appreciated
Originally Posted By: roconnor This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
John … I understand that for a while manufacturers started making direct vent high-efficiency oil fired heat plants that were not installed with the barometric draft regulator. Also why the IRC only requires them on oil fired equipment connected to a chimney (natural draft). Besides the condensation issues, are there draft problems with those units installed without the regulator I’m not aware of?
– Robert O’Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee
I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong
Originally Posted By: kluce This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
David
Hook the shop vac to the fill pipe and put tape around it to hold it in place. Tape up the vent pipe and turn on the vac. This will create a neg pressure in the tank. When you go to take off the shut off valve, the suction will draw air from the 3/8 pipe that the valve threaded into. It's really loud and of course, you have a lot of oil in that tank.
You have to have the right shop vac. If it's not strong enough, you'll loose the oil. If it's too strong, it will suck the oil into the shop vac.
There was only 275 gal tanks in basement around us. I did use the same method on an outside tank but it was only a third filled.
Originally Posted By: jsavino This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Kevin
That's scary. It has never happened to me. The tank valve was brass? The brass is soft. Use even pressure. We stopped using them and installed 1/2" black nipple, black elbow and a 1/2" IPS ball valve rated to use with oil. The rating on the side will say "water, oil , gas (WOG). Also when using the shop vac, slowly loosen the valve, do not take it out , then turn the vac on the air will pull through the threads. then remove the valve. Be careful you can collapse the tank.
John
Originally Posted By: jsavino This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Robert,
I never installed a direct vent heating unit, but what I see is they use recirculated exhaust that is pulled back to the burner. Most of the manufactures make a retro fit fresh air intake for Beckett, Riello, Carlin...
We used them if the boiler room or basement didn't have enough combustion air. A condensation problem is from a cool chimney. The Blue-Flame burners were known for that. There wasn't enough temp. going up the flue. The older boilers (American Standard, Weil-McClain 357, U. S. Nation) were all big open pass boilers that needed a 700-900 degree stack temp. so the protectorelay would operate normally. The price of fuel oil when these boilers were manufactured was $.14 a gallon, no one cared. The newer boilers are running a stack temp of 200-350 degrees.
Boilers without a draft regulator will not be able to equalize and it will pull the draft through the burner making a sporadic flame and a high CO2 and poor efficiency.
John
Originally Posted By: kluce This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
It’s been too many years, it might have been 1/2 pipe but I thought I remembered 3/8 black pipe which went to the valve then the oil filter which then converted to 3/8 copper pipe to the oil burner. O-well. I live in an area now that has zero oil furnaces. From what I remember the sides would suck in a little when the vac was turned on. It sound worse than what it is. Never had a problem with it but only did it about a dozen times.
20 years ago I thought a beckett burner was a nice burner, have they changed much? Some models I didn't like as much but over all I liked them at the time.
Originally Posted By: jsavino This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Kevin,
Check out Reillo. It’s a completely enclosed burner. The least amount of soot on start up and shut down. They can be set up off site and installed with very little adjustments. The pump is connected directly to the motor, they use a capacitor instead of a ignition transformer. A builtin delay valve that holds back firing 9 seconds. Running off the pump is a tube that opens the air shutter when the burner comes on. I installed one in my boiler 5 years ago, and it has not been in need of service since.
Originally Posted By: janderson This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
I do see quite a few of the barometric dampers that are installed without the weights on them. These are not new installations and I don’t know why anyone would remove them as they usually have an adjustment mechanism on them.
– Within the seeds of ignorance lie the fruits of denial
From what I remember the sides would suck in a little when the vac was turned on. It sound worse than what it is. Never had a problem with it but only did it about a dozen times.