Concrete Foam Forms

[rcooke (Roy D. Cooke, Sr)]

I am starting to see this product used in My area .
We do not have Termites if our area yet .
I think these forms would be a great highway for termites and other unwanted critters to enter.
Am I missing some thing or are these as good as they say

[FONT=Times New Roman]KEEVA ® CONCRETE FOAM FORMS
[/FONT]http://oikos.com/keeva/photos.html http://oikos.com/keeva/pumping400.jpg Roy Cooke

[phinsperger (Paul Hinsperger, CMI)]

Hi Roy,

I promised my self a few years ago that my next house will be an ICF (Insulated Concrete Form) house. There are many different styles with different benifits. In general, they are much better sealed as far as air leakage goes.

This is the ICF association
http://www.forms.org/

These are only a very few of the styles available
http://www.standardicf.com/photo_fork.php
http://www.quadlock.com/
http://www.azargroup.com/products/azarblock/designguide.html
http://www.buildingscience.com/sitemap.htm
http://www.iceblockicf.com/ice_block_system.htm
http://www.concrete-home.com/

[clawrenson (Claude Lawrenson)]

I have designed and seen many homes built with the ICF system. I have seen them in my area of southwestern Ontario and observed construction in my teaching sessions in regions such as Edmonton alberta and Val’dor Quebec. Actually many northern communities are now using this because of its ease of use and material cost issues.

Its a great product that permits easy erection and forming of wall systems both above grade and below grade. I have yet to see an issue with termites, primarily because of the way most of these ICF systems are detailed. With a poured concrete and reinforced wall system the wood is generally out of reach of termites.

Above grade the system can be clad with a variety of materials including masonry - they have a ledge block form that provides for such construction. My architectural design class is currently detailing a 3 storey commercial building with a similar type of product.

Edited to add: Suggested resouce: http://www.logixicf.com/client/LogixICF/LogixMain.nsf/WebPages/technicallibrary.html
View the videos - they will give you a good overview of the construction

[rcooke (Roy D. Cooke, Sr)]

@clawrenson

I have designed and seen many homes built with the ICF system. I have seen them in my area of southwestern Ontario and observed construction in my teaching sessions in regions such as Edmonton alberta and Val’dor Quebec. Actually many northern communities are now using this because of its ease of use and material cost issues.

Its a great product that permits easy erection and forming of wall systems both above grade and below grade. I have yet to see an issue with termites, primarily because of the way most of these ICF systems are detailed. With a poured concrete and reinforced wall system the wood is generally out of reach of termites.

Above grade the system can be clad with a variety of materials including masonry - they have a ledge block form that provides for such construction. My architectural design class is currently detailing a 3 storey commercial building with a similar type of product.

It looks like they are going to take of in my area .
Thanks Claude .
I am still nervious about this in a termite area. Roy Cooke

[roconnor (Robert J. OConnor)]

ICF foundations, and even ICF walls, have become very popular in colder regions of my state.

It generally has no permanent structural value, and I think the same pest/termite precautions related to standard formed conrete walls would apply (e.g. soil treatment, termite shields, etc.).

What are your concerns?

[phinsperger (Paul Hinsperger, CMI)]

…

[jcote (Jeannot G. Cote)]

I inspected one this summer with a lot of water problem in the basement, they’ve changed the weeping tiles previously to solve the problem, it didn’t work, maybe it was not built right
The lot slope was not that good. I would make more research before using this system.

[roconnor (Robert J. OConnor)]

P.S. Here is a link to some basic ICF information … http://www.toolbase.org/Building-Systems/Foundations/Insulating-Concrete-Forms

[phinsperger (Paul Hinsperger, CMI)]

From http://www.forms.org/index.php?act=faqs

1. What ways can the foam be protected from termite infestation?
The best method to protect against termite infestation is to eradicate the colony and prevent them from setting up shop on your property. The National Pest Management Association recommends preventing termites by: “Removing the conducive conditions termites need to survive.” Termites love moisture; avoid moisture accumulation around the foundation of your home. Divert water away with properly functioning downspouts, gutters and splash blocks. Reduce humidity in crawl spaces with proper ventilation. Prevent shrubs, vines and other vegetation from growing over and covering vents. Be sure to remove old form boards, grade stakes, etc., that was used during building construction. Remove old tree stumps and roots around and beneath the building. Most importantly, eliminate any wood on the building from contact with the soil. An 18-inch gap between the soil and wood portions of the building is ideal. It doesn’t hurt to routinely inspect the foundation of your home for signs of termite damage.” Additionally, the Insulating Concrete Form Association recommends soil treatment and re-treatment over the life of the home. Just because the home is built of concrete does not mean the termite will give up trying to get to its food source: wood! When using ICFs below-grade, the International Residential Code calls for chemical treatment of the soil and an approved method for protecting the foam. This can include chemical treatments fused into the ICF form, such as Perform Guard®, as well as physical barriers.

20. How do ICF walls fare with termites and other insects and even rodents?
EPS provides no food value for termites or rodents. Whether wood frame construction or ICFs, local building codes do require methods for protecting foam below-grade in high termite areas, which are specifically outlined in the International Residential Code. The same prevention measures used for wood frame construction can also be used for ICFs. The advantage with ICFs is that the termites can’t affect the structural integrity of the building since it is made of concrete.

Paul Hinsperger
Hinsperger Inspection Services
Orangeville Ont
www.hinsperger.com

[phinsperger (Paul Hinsperger, CMI)]

The 2006 version of the Ontario Building Code addresses your very concern of termites with ICF construction.

Paul Hinsperger
Hinsperger Inspection Services
Orangeville Ontario
www.hinsperger.com

[roconnor (Robert J. OConnor)]

@phinsperger

The 2006 version of the Ontario Building Code addresses your very concern of termites with ICF construction.

I am curious since ICF construction isn’t really used here on Long Island (common upstate). What are the special termite prevention measures used that vary from the standard soil treatment and sill plate shield provisions for frame construction? And why would ICF construction need special precautions over conventional framing with no food value for the pests?

[phinsperger (Paul Hinsperger, CMI)]

9.15 and 9.20 of the 2006 OBC effective Dec 31, 2006 deals specifically with ICFs. We were told that 9 3.2.9 applies to ICF just as it does to other foundations that have the insulation added.

See the yellow metal flashing. That is the termite barrier.

Paul Hinsperger
Hinsperger Inspection Services
Orangeville Ontario
www.hinsperger.com

[phinsperger (Paul Hinsperger, CMI)]

Breif overview of the changes to the new code in slide show presentation format.

[Introduction (color)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/139511_OBC_Intro_color-aug-29.pdf), [Introduction (black&white)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/3681748_OBC_Intro_b&w-aug-29.pdf)
[Part 3 (color)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/2825546_OBC_Part_3_color-aug-29.pdf), [Part 3 (black&white)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/1951950_OBC_Part_3_b&w-aug-29.pdf)
[Part 9 (color)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/1066208_OBC_Part_9-color-aug-29.pdf), [Part 9 (black&white)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/3875534_OBC_Part_9-b&w-aug-29.pdf)
[Part 4 & 5 (color)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/3784958_OBC_Part_4-5-color-aug-29.pdf), [Part 4 & 5 (black&white)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/638657_OBC_Part_4-5-b&w-aug-29.pdf)
[Part 6, 7, 8, 11, 12 (color)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif

](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/2027817_OBC_Part_6-7-8-11-12-color-aug-29.pdf), [Part 6, 7, 8, 11, 12 (black&white)

http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/re/inc/pics/pdf.gif](http://www.obc.mah.gov.on.ca/userfiles/page_attachments/Library/4/511215_OBC_Part_6-7-8-11-12-b&w-aug-29.pdf)

[Vera_M.Novak]

RE: Termites
this is a hot topic!!! The ICFA has recently done a full review -you can get a copy through the CONTACT ICFA at www.forms.org
Basically, the code has termite provisions to protect the structure IRC320, and additional provisions regarding foam plastic. IRC R404.4.7.2. However, individual states and location jurisdictions often have their own interpretations. Generally, the goal is to protect the structure from being eaten and collapsing. This can be accomplished by having all structural elements termite proof (ie concrete, or steel), or keeping the critters in the ground where the belong. This can be done with a physical barrier (ie termite mesh), by termite resistant foam, or also by forcing them out to the surface/ daylight. Termites don’t like air or light and it is easier to apply preventive termiticides to reinforce this protective band. ICFs have been used very successfully in termite areas Feel free to contact us for more info. www.forms.org