Newer stuff

First time that I have seen the plastic trac used for the wires. Keeps them nice & tidy. The surge in the panel was a nice touch as well. Does this eliminate the need for surge protectors through out the house?



Nice to see some new stuff instead of the old, outdated and you know!!

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Still needs to be mounted outside the cabinet.

I agree out side the Cabinet thats why they have a thread end and a lock nut on it .
Question ( Does this eliminate the need for surge protectors through out the house? )
I do not think so even though some manufactures say the do .
I took a presentation on these many years ago ( unless they have been improved )
the sales person finally admitted they did not do as well as the advertising said .
He also said he had done many presentations and was surprised at the questions he was asked he could not answer many .
This was his first time to face a group of HIs and he said how impressed he was to meet such a knowledgable group…
They where fairly expensive and the guarantee then was LOUSY.( None )

Roy Cooke sr …


Why does the surge need to be mounted on the outside? I have seen other types installed in the box as well.

In the photo are the wires for a home entertainment system? I couldnt read the info on the covering.


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You really need to read the manufacturer’s instructions about mounting. I don’t see this particular one as posing a “space” problem.

As for surge protection, this is just the first layer of protection. If you really worry about lightning you need point of use protection too, along with ensuring your grounding system is up to snuff and that everyone is using it (phone, cable etc)

There is no surge protector manufactured (that I am aware of) that is allowed to be mounted inside the cabinet.

The POCO here mounts one in the meter, but like Greg said, it’s just a first line of defense. They still should be used on senstive equipment in the house. Our back-up batteries for our computers have 'em.

What was installed in the Plasti-Trak?

Quick comment about “Surge Protectors”

Remember that they are only good for 1 (one) use only! That is one surge up to their rated protection level! After that they have to be replaced. That is why they have that light on them that you see flickering all the time. They are protecting against small surges all the time. If that light is not on then your surge protector is no longer protecting anything… It is just a cord strip then! They also burn out after a very long time of use with small surges. (Some Surge Protectors do stop working a cord strips when they receive their final surge, they are usually the more expensive ones.)

Surge Protectors are designed to fail to protect something more valuable then themselves. They are not a plug-in and forget about it device! You should be checking them after every storm, power outage, and at least monthly to see that they are still operational.

*** That is why they are not to be mounted inside any panel box. You should not need to remove the cover to check that the device is still working! Also if it has no light on it how would you know if it is still in working order? ***

Thanks for the replies.

The trac was used for supporting the wires instead of drilling thru the joist. First time I have seen this system. It had a label on the trac giving some specifications. I was glad it was labeled so if I was asked I could give some information. Do you see this system in newer construction?

Any other electrical newer installs I should be aware of in newer construction.

Thanks again


The grey pipe tells me that it is a roughed in central Vacuum system and the wires are to start the Vacuum up when the hose end is plugged in .

Roy Cooke Sr …

One issue with the panduit is derating. Once you get over 9 current carrying conductors you can’t use NM-b or THHN at the normal 240.4(D) rating (15a-14ga etc). If this is an older wiring method the derating bites you earlier. With the old NM and TW cnductors it happens over 4 current carrying conductors.

Exactly, and if that track has a large number of NM in enclose then the wire would have to be upsized to account for the derating. This applies in all types of bundling. I have found a lot of instances where electricians run a section of conduit from the panel into the attic and crawl. If they stay under 24" it’s not as bad, but longer than that it becomes a raceway and full derating applies.

Please explain about derating.


De-rating is when the capacity of the conductors are reduced due to effects like heat and other factors which reduce the current carry capacity of a conductor based on a certain condition.

For example, A conductor is rated to have an ampacity at a certain temp. rating but if it is installed in a condition that is above or below the listed temp. rating of 310.16 in the NEC for example a correction factor is needed and will be applied…this “derates” the current carry value of the conductor.

Basically derating is an adjustment factor placed on the conductor based on certain conditions.

Another condition is when you have more than 3 current carry conductors in a raceway, you have to derate ( reduce ) the conductors current carry capacity based on the sec 310.15(B)(2) because remember the more wires…less air space…more heat…this creates resistance(heat) for the conductor…so you thus would have a lower ampacity rating on the conductors within the raceway…thus you derate the wires (lower) their capacity or amps they can handle.

Wow…did I make that confusing or what…way better to explain in a classroom…lol

Nope that was great. I have an excellent electrical back ground but wanted to hear an explanation of this because I don’t recall ever hear one.

Yours was well done! Thanks.