SOP...or not SOP

I was at an inspection today, and if the SOP was strictly adhered to, the signficant mold and water leakage would never have been noted. There were no signs of the water leak without moving the refrigerator and the oven and then moving the dishes and looking at the back of the cabinets.

So here is the question, I know the SOP protects “US” but isn’t our purpose to protect the buyer?

I am not saying move everything and look everywhere, but the person buying this was a single mom with two small kids. What if a person who strictly abides by the SOP did this inspection? The inspector would have been legally covered, but what about the buyer?

I was thinking of this because of Erics earlier post where the guy didn’t have attic access, but a 6’2", 275lb guy could access it with a will and some passion in going the extra mile.

Should the SOP be updated and more of a demand put on us so that we can elevate the profession and give our clients more?

I am not saying I have the answers, just think that people actually hide behind the SOP instead of it being a guideline, they use it for a reason not to do whatever they don’t want to do.

Just a discussion…what if your family member bought this house unknowingly with the mold? I can hide behind the SOP and my PIA, but is that we are about?

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The SOP will never be changed because there are too many A$HI members and members who are total idiots that belong to NACHI. They whine when NACHI even hints on improving itself.

Well let me ask you James. Should it be updated?

Yes, but years ago, Keith Swift tried to propose a new SOP and he was pushed out of NACHI by the same old crowd. Nick just stood there and let it happen. Sad but true.

Here is the thread http://www.nachi.org/forum/f13/keith-swift-and-proposing-new-standards-practice-industry-18168/ .

In all fairness, we don’t know “why” the other inspector was not able to access the area in question, so I don’t think that’s relevant to this thread.

To your question;

The “problem” with attempting to move this imaginary SOP line is that it’s difficult to know where we should stop. It has been a “national standard” since the inception of our profession and is really just a “minimum standard of care.”

Next we would be “requiring” inspectors to remove all panel covers (even on the foreboding FPE and Zinsco panels), and even requiring all inspectors to walk the roof (I know, OMG :shock:).

The reality is, the inspector who uses the SOP to “hide behind” will not be in business for very long - you just can’t provide quality service if you’re looking for every opportunity to not-do-your-job.

Those of us who are serious about this profession know that we will make every attempt to do right by our client and provide the most thorough inspection possible, but when I can’t access something, I’ve got the “backing” of a nationally recognized standard that recognizes there are limitations.

I am also of the “school” that if we are unable to perform a portion of an inspection due to our own physical limitations, we should either opt-out of the business, over-come our limitation or hire someone to complete that portion of the inspection.

I see inspectors in my area hide behind their SOP all the time.

I see people hiding behind the SOP in these threads.

Here is OUR SOP verbatim for the AC Cooling Mode.

3.5. Cooling
I. The inspector shall inspect:
[INDENT]
[LIST=A]
[li]***the central cooling equipment using normal operating controls.***[/li][/LIST]This is the National Stardard for checking the cooling mode of an AC…can we get more vague?

My point isn’t that those who use this as a real standard won’t be in business long, my point is what about the 500 people they inspect for, BEFORE they go out of business. Our job isn’t something that we can just . OOOOPS on. Some people are spending life saving and going into debt for 30 years based on what we say.
[/INDENT]

Russell writes:

Changing the SOP to require us to move large kitchen appliances so that we can note mold??? We’d have a better chance at amending the U.S. Constitution.

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

LMAO…we look behind these all day long if not built in.

Nick, I totally understand your position, as a person who wants as many home inspectors in the profession as possible. But some of us do not think that way.

I realize your “keep it simple and stupid” makes people feel they are qualified to perform Home Inspection, but the reality of it is that the clients get screwed and I take that serious. Why? Because this is my chosen profession. Your chosen profession is to exploit what I do for a living and make everyone who ever walked into Home Depot feel qualified and sign up with INACHI.

Same field just a different view.

I have seen over the years where you will never increase the standard, because God Forbid, you lose members over it. We can’t have that.

Nice SOP for the cooling mode on the AC, make that up yourself? People make fun of the $149 inspection. If I did a strict SOP inspection I feel that I was ripping the person off at $149!

Oh Russell, do you have to conjure up some silly plot using my name every time you are trying to make a point? Changing a standard doesn’t change the number of people who decide to become home inspectors. That’s idiotic.

Anyway… InterNACHI’s Residential SOP almost isn’t ours to change anymore (at least not as drastically as you propose).

It’s too ingrained in legislation, courses, E&O insurance companies, licensing boards approvals, legal documents, government regulations, websites, text books, reporting software systems, etc… all over the world.

BS…people read our SOP and hide behind it all day long. There are many who look at it, and think that is REALLY how the inspections are performed so they get in the business. You are too happy to have your hand out and welcome them in. But it’s not you getting screwed over, its the client. I know that there is no way to stop all poor inspectors, but there sure as hell are ways to slow it down.

Once again, it was a topic for conversation and to see what others think. I never expect you to do anything that would up the profession, I just like that it in public threads, that we can never up the proceedures and we are using the same standards that were used 20 years ago. Newer equipment is available, newer procedures are available. more knowledge is out there and yet we never change.

When was the last time you read the SOP? In 90% of the sections that “The inspector is not required to”: is larger than what we are suppose to do! Is that not wrong?

I just took one line…and laughed.

A representative number of doors and windows by opening and closing them;

What the hell does that mean? I know, whatever the inspector WANTS it to mean! Is it 1,2,3,4, all, all accessible.

You stole a standard that was written 20 years ago and then want it to last forever as the “standard”. So what your telling me is that it will never change. Nice!

I didn’t write our Residential SOP and was never on the committee who did. Sorry.

However, I am the lead author of the International Standards of Practice for Inspecting Commercial Properties, so if you have an issue with that Standard… I can probably help.

I’ve been in this profession since before the internet, cell phones, or digital cameras… and since that time… I think I’ve done a few things for this profession.

So you take credit for all the good aspects and pawn off the crap? Nice leadership! Its yours, deal with it.

You are the one and only decider in NACHI, so whatever you want to happen, can happen and if it does not happen, one can come to the conclusion, Nick does not want it to happen. Flower it up all you want and sprinkle it with BS.

If it has the name NACHI on it, and it is the way it is, it’s because you want it that way. We both know that to be the fact.

Have been many of times, I have given you praise and accolades when I feel they are warranted. But Nick, I am not one of your Sheeple. I am not a 100% take it or leave it. I have seen the ton of great stuff you have done. But stop patting yourself on the back and continue forward.

I realize that upping the standards may lose a few people, but is it not worth it?

I explained why we can’t change the SOP as you propose. InterNACHI’s Residential SOP almost isn’t ours to change anymore (at least not as drastically as you propose).

It’s too ingrained in legislation, courses, E&O insurance companies, licensing boards approvals, legal documents, government regulations, websites, text books, reporting software systems, etc… all over the world.

And even if I could lead a movement to change it… I wouldn’t. I don’t see anything wrong with the way it is.

You’re free to move refrigerators to look for mold (how do you know it’s mold btw? :stuck_out_tongue: ) if you want. Knock yourself out. Bring a mover’s dolly with you on your inspections if you want to.

How do you know its mold? Are you serious? Did you look at the pictures? LMAO…Please don’ tell me you’re one of those people who never use the word “mold” without getting it tested! Too damn funny. I always that was a joke! “I see some type of discoloration noted where the active water leak was getting to the cabinets, but cannot say if its mold without getting it tested”! Too damn funny! No wonder there are so many people who don’t make it past three years, they listen to that crap!

Well sir, that green hairy, fuzzy growth where the prolonged water leak has been taking place could be something else, like…ummmm…like…old spinach stains or maybe Brocolli.

I tested a refrigerator…or maybe it wasn’t a refrigerator. Maybe I should send it to an appliance repairman to have him test it and tell me its a refrigerator.

Too damn funny…

But to stay on track. I did not SAY move all heavy appliances. It was just a point of topic and a conversation starter.

I did not say. Rewrite the SOP to move all appliances, like your gonna try to spin it into.

You really do crack me up though.

What you propose would be impossible to get through, even with my help (which I’m not offering). Requiring that we look for mold behind kitchen appliances??? Attorney Joe Ferry is on the Board of Directors of InterNACHI. Propose it to him.