The rich are paying way more than their "fair share" in taxes

No kidding. It’s not fair to any women that may be on this thread.

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That’s a good one Ryan! :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

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As I said. The super wealthy pay less than 10% tax rate.
This is very easy to verify, just do a little quick research. Buffett often talks in interviews about the unfairness of paying a lower percentage in tax than his secretary.

I have read in many different places that the best way to save money on taxes is to start a business. Workers pay a high tax rate.
Investors pay very little.

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NO HE DOESN’T!!! That’s absurd! Where do you get this nonsense from?

You’ve made two absurd claims. I’ll give you $1,000 if you can explain why Warren Buffet either pays less tax than his secretary or less percent on his income than his secretary.

Take my $1,000.

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Take the money @bhull1 :sunglasses:

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Yes, take it. I’ve given you two avenues to get to my $1000, each based off of your two claims. I’ll give you $1,000 if you can explain why Warren Buffet either pays less tax than his secretary or less percent on his income than his secretary.

I don’t want Bert’s owed money, but here is the opinion piece Buffet wrote himself where he made that claim (originally in the New York Times) in 2011.

2nd page, 3rd paragraph.

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Read his comment slower. He didn’t say he paid less tax than his secretary and he didn’t say he paid less percent on his income than his secretary. He said he paid a smaller percent of his total income plus capital gains (effective rate) than the percent his secretary paid (effective rate) on her total income plus capital gains. Yes. It’s very likely his effective tax rate is smaller than hers because he has huge capital gains and capital gains is taxed at a lower rate than income. But his capital gains rate is the same or greater than hers (capital gains rate is slightly progressive) and of course his income tax rate is greater than hers (income tax is very progressive). So he didn’t pay a smaller percent on either and admittedly didn’t pay less taxes in dollars.

Buffett pays both more in taxes than his secretary and pays equal or higher percent on them. Now if most of her income is from salary and most of his income is from capital gains, then yes, his effective tax rate paid will be lower than hers simply because capital gains is taxed at a lower rate than income. Not because he is taxed at a lower percent rate than her.

Compare his capital gains tax rate to hers. His is not less.
Compare his income tax rate to hers. His is not less.

In fact, if he chose to take his compensation in a modest income and she chose to sell her Berkshire stock, she’d not only STILL pay less tax than him, STILL pay less percent on her income than him, but she’d also pay a lower effective rate as well.

No, he didn’t qualify anything with that statement by differentiating between types of taxable income and why some of his types of income are taxed at lower rates. He just referenced his total taxable income compared to his office staff’s total taxable income. On total taxable income, he claimed to pay less than half, as a percentage, then his office employees did.

But what I paid was only 17.4 percent of my taxable income — and that’s actually a lower percentage than was paid by any of the other 20 people in our office. Their tax burdens ranged from 33 percent to 41 percent and averaged 36 percent.

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If Warren Buffet wanted to be truthful, he should say this:

“I pay less effective tax rate on my capital gains than the effective tax rate my secretary pays on her income.”

Then we could reply:

“Duh. Capital gains is taxed at a lower rate. What’s your point? If she sells her Berkshire stock and retires, her capital gains rate isn’t going to be higher than your capital gains rate. So stop playing word games Warren.”

Yes. But he’s being dishonest. The reason he pays less effective rate on the total of his income and capital gains than the effective rate his secretary pays on her income and capital gains is that he has absurdly large capital gains which is taxed at a lower rate than income.

It has NOTHING TO DO WITH HER BEING A SECRETARY. It has to do with income and capital gains being taxed at different rates. And there is no way that those rates are ever better for him than her. And he doesn’t claim that in his article because if it were true, he would have.

I would rather have a more detailed explanation on why threads and post are being censored than someone trying to “explain” taxation inequalities on us.

Funny how one was skipped around and over, but the other has more “importance” for forum members…

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THERE IS NO INEQUALITY!!! His secretary is NOT paying a greater percent on her capital gains than Buffet is on his capital gains. And she isn’t paying a greater percent on her income than Buffet is on his income.

In fact, since both taxes are progressive… she’s paying a smaller percent on both.

What is capital gains? It’s both profit and income, right? Why is that rate lower?

Well, I don’t really know all the reasons that capital gains is taxed at a lower rate than income, but it is. I’ve read some articles as to why it is good for the economy to not tax people on gains created mostly by inflation, but I really don’t know why they are different.

My point is that Buffet’s rates FOR EACH TYPE OF TAX are no lower (and in fact, very likely higher) than his secretary’s for every type of tax.

This is just a matter of basic math since both income and capital gains are progressive taxes.

And his overall taxes he pays are likely hundreds of times his secretary.

I have a very good suspicion. Because the people who benefit from this are in charge :sunglasses:

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Missed my point Nick. You are more consumed with a topic like this, than addressing concerns from members who have concerns about being censored on the forum… You do dance a lot. I’ll give you credit for that and you should run for a political office. :wink:

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I don’t know anything about censorship. I had to delete a post once years ago and had to get IT Dept to do it for me. I can see all recently deleted posts and there are none. Furthermore staff, knowing that I’m big on free speech, would likely call or SLACK me to tell me they had to delete a post and they’d explain why… it’s such a rare event.

Warren Buffet (as I’ve shown once again on this thread) is not the most forthright person in the world. He doesn’t quite lie, but he bends the truth to the point where he has to then explain himself later. Not a person I’d want to do business with.

I remember when just after he bought or sold (can’t remember which) some big huge asset (an entire Canadian railroad or something), he and Bill Gates’s father went to Congress and tried to get Congress to raise the capital gains rate (that’s when he first started telling his lie about his secretary). Now that he and Gates are two of the richest men on earth and got there enjoying low tax rates, he wants to close the barn door behind him so that no one else can ever catch up to his wealth and bid against him on other railroads or whatever. Anyway, he’s not what he pretends to be IMHO. And he can never get out from under his “I pay less taxes than my secretary” lie that he made up to try to increase everyone else’s taxes now that he’s ultra-rich from the low-tax environments he made his wealth from.