Ufer is good but this this exterior ground wire is cut?



2006 townhome. The ufer in the garage is intact. This ground below the meter can and main disconnect is cut. This exterior cut ground has a ground wire attached from a nearby TV cable box. Is the cut ground just an auxiliary ground for the purpose of the cable box? I feel the SEG is ok because of the ufer. I am right or wrong?

I think you are right.
Appears to be for the low voltage box.
I’d be okay with it especially if you got your eyes on the ufer.
Cheers.

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Thanks Patrick!

Is the garage attached or detached?

The grounding should be at the service. Is the service on the garage?

No, the ufer is in the garage (front), the SEC and meter rear of the home. This is not unusual for me to see here in GA for more modern service where the service and the ufer are not very close to one another.

If there is a concrete encased electrode (CEE) then no other grounding electrode is required. Hard to tell from the photo what the function of the cut conductor actually was.

@bcawhern1 Have you researched the origins of Concrete Encased Electrodes? You may find it interesting.

There is a CEE (same as ufer?). I’m feeling more confident this is a auxiliary electrode or ground for auxiliary equipment such as cable boxes. Hopefully, I have a little more time to do more research.

@afrydenlund honestly, I have never considered the history of this device. But now you have piqued my interest and I’ll be digging in. Thanks!

Yes CEE or concrete encased electrode is the proper term from the NEC. It is possible that the CATV system was connected to its own ground rod at one time. Those rods are no longer permitted for that purpose.

It is similar to this new construction. In this photo, the home also has a CEE or ufer connection in the garage on the other side of the home. But as you can see, in my original post, that ground electrode does not have that “connector box”. I am just trying to figure out what that is as well.

That box is the required intersystem bonding terminal strip. I5 allows all the utilities to connect to a common ground point.

Thank you :clap: :clap:

I had one pop up yesterday that looked exactly like the one in your last photo. Right down to the IBTS, and the Eaton surge protector and panel. I don’t think I’m a big fan of the UFER’s. For one thing, you can’t see how good or bad of a job someone did when encasing the electrodes in cement. And the GEC is typically hidden in the wall. You’re supposed to encase the electrode at or near the exterior surface of the bottom of the casing, so it will maintain good contact with the soil and the water in the ground. What if the ground was saturated with a lot of rainfall (like we’ve had this year) while the footings are being poured? Then when the earth dries you can have pockets of shrinkage of the earth where the connection between the electrode and the earth are minimized- or lost. I was testing the GFCI’s throughout the home when I found that the GFCI test buttons on my devices required a “long press” to make the combination AFCI/GFCI devices trip. (I also don’t like the idea that a steam explosion from a direct lightning strike can fracture or shatter the footing where the UFER is encased.)

A CEE is by far the best electrode and far superior when compared to two ground rods. As to whether or not it was installed properly they’re supposed to be inspected before the concrete is poured. I prefer a CEE that is made from the 1/2" or larger rebar where you would have hundreds of feet of rebar embedded in the concrete.

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Hi, Robert! Any ideas on why there would be a 2-second delay when tripping the GFCI’s manually or by using the instruments to trip?

Hi David, I went down this rabbit hole once before. UL has requirements. The lower the voltage, the slower the trip time. Detecting the cause of excessive trip time is beyond me, but according to this article, 2 seconds may not be out of compliance. Of course, just as you, I would like to hear from an electrician.

Inspectapedia covers it briefly here:

Ground Fault Circuit Interruptors, GFCIs Definition Peformance Electrical Codes.

Thanks, Brian! That’s a tingle at 6 milliamps. It’s the shock of a lifetime at 15 to 20 amps or more.

I also found this. 15mA approx.1.5 seconds, 20mA approx 1 second.

So, according to the chart, any voltage higher than 1/20th of 1 amp should trip in less than half a second.