Where does NACHI get Licensing Favor?

Originally Posted By: msaari
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The following was emailed to me from a real estate friend from Keller Williams Realty.


Looks to me like NAHI is getting the special treatment for licensing requirements and not NACHI OR ASHI... Did we fail???


Mike, this came through the Keller Williams e-mail.



Dear Colleagues,

I would like to let everyone in our office know that I am working on a piece of legislation on behalf of a member of Michigan House of Representatives that will require all home inspectors in the State of Michigan to be licensed.

The bill, HB 6187 is currently held up in the Committee on Regulatory Affairs, which is chaired by State Representative Sal Rocca. The requirements of licensure for home inspectors will be implemented according to the National Association of Home Inspectors' (NAHI) standards.

A home purchase is a major investment in one's life and we need to protect all future homeowners by passing this bill and enacting it into law. Anyone in Michigan can be a home inspector. We need to set the bar high and require licensing. The bill's primary sponsor is State Rep. Ken Daniels, District 2 (Detroit).

I welcome your support for HB 6187 and urge you to write to your lawmakers to have this measure heard and passed.

If you have any questions about this legislation or any other legislative matter, please don't hesitate to contact me at (517) 373-0106. Take care everyone!!!


Originally Posted By: Nick Gromicko
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NACHI lead this legislation. ASHI was involved too. NAHI only recently got involved.


Legislation signed off by NACHI is already going thru: http://www.nachi.org/semichiganchapter.htm

Every change we wanted... we got. We had 5 separate meetings with Michigan legislatures.

It is good legislation.


--
Nick Gromicko
Founder
dues=79cents/day.

I much prefer email to private messages.

Originally Posted By: pmooney
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Nick, this isn’t the same legislation we met with Accavitti about; that was HB5587. A different Rep altogether is behind this. Something funny is going on here. This bill was only introduced last month. Check it out: http://www.michiganlegislature.org/mileg.asp?page=getObject&objName=2004-HB-6187


It's very similar to HB5587, with a very disturbing difference:

"... The license qualification and educational standards, as well as the examinations, of the national association of home inspectors, as they exist on the effective date of this article, are adopted and incorporated by reference for use by the department for the licensure of applicants under this article. The department, upon the advice of the board, shall determine whether applicants not affiliated with the national association of home inspectors otherwise meet the standards adopted under this subsection."

That last section concerns me. I'll see what I can find out from this end.


--
Paul Mooney
Southeastern Michigan NACHI Chapter President
heritage@se-michigan-nachi.org
www.se-michigan-nachi.org
Heritage Home Inspection
Waterford, MI

Originally Posted By: msaari
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Paul Money, thank you for not dismissing my letter so easily… The letter I had submitted came strait from Kelller Williams office. I sent it to Nick with hopes that he would answer it with some kind of legitimate response… I thank you for stepping forward with your responsible responce… The letter clearly stated that NACHI would be heading the state testing here in Michigan… Should we switch to NACHI ???


Originally Posted By: cmccann
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NACHI or NAHI. Your last statement puzzles me.



NACHI MAB!

Originally Posted By: Nick Gromicko
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ASHI & NAHI each separately made the mistake of trying to introduce their own association-biased legislation. Silly. Nowadays it throws up a red flag and doesn't get anywhere. You just can't get the votes for such nonsense these days. Every legislature is on to it. So again, if you want some legislation passed, and you think you have good legislation... propose something that isn't association biased, or else it will die like a "purple ribbon sky diving" bill.

I don't fight licensing. ALL NACHI MEMBERS GET LICENSES ANYWAY. Better yet, most non-NACHI inspectors who get licensed later join NACHI anyway. Everywhere licensing goes thru, NACHI wins. Licensing turns the whole established free-market cart on upside down and diminishes what little equity ASHI has left in their brand by creating a new list... the list of licensed inspectors. This 30 year old brand equity, or what little is left of it, is totally destroyed by licensing. Age is the only and last small advantage ASHI has over NACHI. Licensing eliminates this last advantage by creating a new list (the list of licensed inspectors). NACHI is much stronger than ASHI on every other front (about a dozen major ones, and about 100 or more minor ones). We simply overpower ASHI everywhere else. Furthermore our weapons (marketing, internet, etc. for instance) are undiminished by governmental licensing. It's like we have immunity. Legislation or proposed legislation is like a surgical strike against established non-NACHI inspectors. Governments don't market licensees and never will.

Licensing is like "being up to code." it is such a bare minimum standard it's not UP TO at all. It should be called down to code. Licensing is similar in that it sets such a bare minimum standard (you can buy the answers to the NHIE on ebay for $15) that any idiot can get licensed... and when licensing goes thru... many idiots do get licensed. Many more than were in the industry before licensing (just look at states that adopted licensing). Licensing brings inspectors into the industry, it doesn't keep them out like the dummies incorrectly predicted.

Even where licensing is tough (like Texas with their 300+ hours of continuing education)... it's tough on all inspectors, not just NACHI members. The good ones all join NACHI (see all the TREC#'s in NACHI's list of featured inspectors. A Texas license, TREC#, and all that continuing education can't provide them what NACHI can.

A government license demonstrating that you've fulfilled some bare minimum standard is not going to make you any money or do what NACHI does for you. Never will. Goverments don't and can't do what NACHI does... actually no other organization can (and certainly not for $289). When you have a bunch of licensed inspectors... the NACHI members win.

A licensed inspector is a free inspector and of the whole population of all free, licensed inspectors... the subset that is dumb enough to pay to join an association that gives them nothing in return... is... well... made up of inspectors too dumb to be much competition to our members. Look at NAHI's (note I said NAHI's, not NACHI's) membership benefit list ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif) .

So don't look too harshly on licensing... home inspection legislators (regardless of what association is buying their airplane fuel) are like NACHI's Bombardiers... destroying all existing market strongholds while our tanks (marketing power) lead the way for our massive infantry invasion.


--
Nick Gromicko
Founder
dues=79cents/day.

I much prefer email to private messages.

Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
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Nick,


I believe his point was to point out that legislation has been sponsored, and is supported by some, which clearly puts NAHI in the drivers seat. The legislation is not fair and balanced to home inspectors at all. I believe it should immediately be brought to the attention of Accavati. If it gets any traction, it will hurt the industry, and put US Inspect inspectors and other NAHI folks in control of licensing.

I believe this was the purpose of the post. At the end of the day, it appears that NAHI has done an end-around, and has placed itself squarely in control of legislation which is apparently being pushed by realtors, and perhaps the state board of realtors.

It doesnt matter if we beleve it wont pass. If NJ has taught us anything it's that ANYTHING can pass. And, once done, its very hard to undo it. The fight isnt over by a long shot in NJ.

It doesnt matter what benefits thay do not have, and what benefits we have. It does not matter about our marketing. You cant market if our association is not recognised legislatively in any jurisdiction. Membership will swell for NAHI in Michigan if it means getting a license or not. It's common sense. This needs to be stopped right now...

The Michigan issue needs our immediate attention, IMO


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: cmccann
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Wow, Thanks Joe. Nick is there anything I can do, and how would I go about doing it?



NACHI MAB!

Originally Posted By: Nick Gromicko
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Joe, you are a bit off-base and Chuck, you need not do anything yet.


NAHI is just trying to do something to get any attention they can after NACHI put through good legislation. That is why they emailed it to everyone and his uncle.

BIG DEAL, they proposed legislation in a state that NACHI already has a bill introduced.

NAHI has about as much chance of getting their dumb proposed legislation passed as the Association of Lefthanded Fishermen do, especially in Michigan where we already have a Legislator-proposed, unbiased bill introduced, fully supported, with no projected opposing votes.

It is designed only to trick the stupid into thinking they have something going on. They don't. If it wasn't for USInspect NAHI would have gone under this year.

Now that NAHI is no longer an association and merely an arm of USInspect, expect them to follow our legislation around with more publicity stunts like this.

There was only one place on earth that membership in NACHI didn't qualify an inspector for a license and that was Alabama... and we fixed that last month: http://www.nachi.org/allicensing.htm

NAHI does not deny that they accommodated USInspect by weakening their own Code of Ethics to the detriment of Michigan consumers. USInspect bribed them with $ and a "corporate affiliation" at NAHI (something else NAHI up and invented one day to get USInspect $$$). This one sleaze ball act alone should be enough for any legislator to run from sleaze ball proposed legislation... and run they will.


--
Nick Gromicko
Founder
dues=79cents/day.

I much prefer email to private messages.

Originally Posted By: loconnor
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For my own peace of mind, I sent an email to Representative Accavitti on Friday evening regarding my concern, and hope to hear from him regarding this latest development.



Larry


Western Michigan NACHI Chapter


http://www.w-michigan-nachi.org


"We confide in our strength
without boasting of it.
We respect that of others
without fearing it"
Thomas Jefferson

Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



, IMO.


Please, let's stay on top of this...

Maybe its time to break out the big guns, Nick. You know... the one you and I spoke of last week.


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: loconnor
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.







Larry


Western Michigan NACHI Chapter


http://www.w-michigan-nachi.org


"We confide in our strength
without boasting of it.
We respect that of others
without fearing it"
Thomas Jefferson

Originally Posted By: cmccann
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Larry, I’m a little confused on what I’m reading here. Is this your view or is this something sent to you?



NACHI MAB!

Originally Posted By: loconnor
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Chuck


The writing in bold, which was not intended, are my concerns. Above that is from MAR's web site.

Sorry for the confusion.


--
Larry
Western Michigan NACHI Chapter
http://www.w-michigan-nachi.org

"We confide in our strength
without boasting of it.
We respect that of others
without fearing it"
Thomas Jefferson

Originally Posted By: loconnor
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Here is a reply I received from Representative Accavatti:


Dear Mr. O'Connor,

I received your e-mail concerning, House Bill 6187, a bill to regulate
the home inspection industry introduced by Representative Ken Daniels.
It is my belief that Representative Daniels introduced the legislation
after receiving encouragement from home inspectors in his district. I
do not believe that either bill (his or mine) will be acted on before
this Legislative Session ends, December 31, 2004. It is my intention to
reintroduce my legislation in the new term; however, Representative
Daniels being term limited will not be able to do the same. This will
not be starting from scratch, I plan to use the language from the
substitute bill that many of the players within the industry and I have
crafted over the last several months when reintroducing the bill. Since
all of the groundwork has been laid and the language is in place, I am
hopeful for a fair and timely outcome for all involved. I will keep you
posted on any and all new developments.

As always, if you have any further questions or concerns, please feel
free to contact my office.

Sincerely,

Frank Accavitti, Jr.
State Representative
House District 42


--
Larry
Western Michigan NACHI Chapter
http://www.w-michigan-nachi.org

"We confide in our strength
without boasting of it.
We respect that of others
without fearing it"
Thomas Jefferson

Originally Posted By: cmccann
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Wow, Good job Larry. eusa_clap.gif



NACHI MAB!

Originally Posted By: Brian A. Goodman
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[“gromicko”]


My advice to local home inspection chapters/associations: Never introduce something association-biased.

I agree for the most part, but if you're going to have an exam or standards they almost have to come from an HI organization. You could take someones standards are slightly reword them, but still... As long as the test and standards are genuinely meaningful, I don't think it matters which organization wrote them.


I don't fight licensing. ALL NACHI MEMBERS GET LICENSES ANYWAY. Better yet, most non-NACHI inspectors who get licensed later join NACHI anyway. Everywhere licensing goes thru, NACHI wins.

Ah yes, that special Nick gift for hype...I almost missed it.


Licensing turns the whole established free-market cart on upside down and diminishes what little equity ASHI has left in their brand by creating a new list... the list of licensed inspectors. This 30 year old brand equity, or what little is left of it, is totally destroyed by licensing.

I disagree. It would take a lot more than a license law to destroy the brand equity ASHI has spent 30 years building, client by client.


Age is the only and last small advantage ASHI has over NACHI. Licensing eliminates this last advantage by creating a new list (the list of licensed inspectors). NACHI is much stronger than ASHI on every other front (about a dozen major ones, and about 100 or more minor ones). We simply overpower ASHI everywhere else.

More hype, with numbers. See the above. NACHI does have some significant advantages, but come on... Just out of curiousity, could you list the "about 100" minor ones? Love that last statement. I recall a thread about AZ before my absence; didn't sound overpowering to me. They aren't overpowered in either of the states I'm licensed in either. Come on Nick, try to restrain yourself.


Furthermore our weapons (marketing, internet, etc. for instance) are undiminished by governmental licensing. It's like we have immunity. Legislation or proposed legislation is like a surgical strike against established non-NACHI inspectors. Governments don't market licensees and never will.

Well, at least the first sentence is true. The last is silly, why would they?


Licensing is like "being up to code." it is such a bare minimum standard it's not [i]UP TO at all. It should be called down to code. Licensing is similar in that it sets such a bare minimum standard (you can buy the answers to the NHIE on ebay for $15) that any idiot can get licensed... and when licensing goes thru... many idiots do get licensed. Many more than were in the industry before licensing (just look at states that adopted licensing). Licensing brings inspectors into the industry, it doesn't keep them out like the dummies incorrectly predicted. [/i]

What affect licensing has depends entirely on the particulars of the law. I my state it greatly reduced the number of practicing HI's, no question. I can't imagine how it could bring more in, but I guess it's possible under some circumstances.

Even where licensing is tough (like Texas with their 300+ hours of continuing education)... it's tough on all inspectors, not just NACHI members. The good ones all join NACHI (see all the TREC#'s in NACHI's list of [i]featured inspectors. A Texas license, TREC#, and all that continuing education can't provide them what NACHI can.[/i]

The good ones ALL join NACHI eh? All?


A government license demonstrating that you've fulfilled some bare minimum standard is not going to make you any money or do what NACHI does for you. Never will. Goverments don't and can't do what NACHI does... actually no other organization can (and certainly not for $289). When you have a bunch of licensed inspectors... the NACHI members win.

We're repeating a lot here, but... If there is a license requirement in place, you sure aren't going to make any money without one. I don't think membership in any HI org has any great advantage in a strong license state.


A licensed inspector is a free inspector and of the whole population of all free, licensed inspectors... the subset that is dumb enough to pay to join an association that gives them nothing in return... is... well... made up of inspectors too dumb to be much competition to our members.

I doubt if members of those other orgs feel they're getting nothing, or they would move on. It all depends on what you're looking for, and how you see it.


So don't look too harshly on licensing... home inspection legislators (regardless of what association is buying their airplane fuel) are like NACHI's Bombardiers... destroying all existing market strongholds while our tanks (marketing power) lead the way for our massive infantry invasion.

Hoo boy. Is that what happened in NJ Nick?


Originally Posted By: Nick Gromicko
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After 30 years ASHI has managed to boost the total number of countries in the world, provinces in Canada, and/or states in the US that require membership in ASHI to a grand total of… drum roll please… zero.


Alabama is the only place on earth that requires membership in approved associations but they also approve of NACHI http://www.nachi.org/allicensing.htm and many other associations.

ASHI is doing no better in cyberspace either http://www.nachi.org/alexasitecomparison.htm Everyone is passing them up.

By their own numbers, ASHI has more Candidates than members. ASHI has become an association of the unqualified newbie.

Don't like these facts? Don't argue with me... I'm only the messenger. Go fight with the governments, Amazon's alexa.com, and ASHI... none of which are under my control.


--
Nick Gromicko
Founder
dues=79cents/day.

I much prefer email to private messages.

Originally Posted By: jburkeson
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Deleted… icon_biggrin.gif



Joseph Burkeson, RPI (Hooperette)


?Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.?
~ Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Originally Posted By: cradan
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You’ve got me chuckling, Joe. Reminds me of “Young, Dumb, and full of…” ah, well, you know.


![icon_cool.gif](upload://oPnLkqdJc33Dyf2uA3TQwRkfhwd.gif)


--
Chris
http://www.inspect4me.com
Chicago Illinois Home Inspections