Aging Electrical Wiring

Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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I tried to get a link to this but only an abstract is available.


An article in the spring 2004 nec digest states the following:

"Most of the electrical wiring systems that went into homes in the 1960s, '50s and '40s are at - or close to - the end of their design life."

Also "Some electricians use a rule of thumb that says 30-year-old wiring should be replaced since it is difficult to predict how badly it may age."

Now that you have this information are you going to pass this on to your clients? ![icon_question.gif](upload://t2zemjDOQRADd4xSC3xOot86t0m.gif)

nec digest is the Official Magazine of the NEC.

Mike P.


Originally Posted By: jpeck
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Mike,


Guess I was the first voter, 1 vote, 100% yes I will use this.

I've always considered the life to be about 40 years for the electrical system. Which puts us at the mid-60s and older.

Are they saying that the newer thermoplastic insulation will also need replacing in 30-40 years?


--
Jerry Peck
South Florida

Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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Jerry


I hope not. That 30 year mark means 1974. I think that is a little extreme.
I reread the article tommorrow and see if there are any other points that I should make.

Mike P.


Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
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I think that there needs to be a 3rd choice, which is not that it will be a deal killer or will you use it, byt in what light will you present it.


It is impractical to consider completely re-wiring a NYC brownstone, without considering possibly gutting a good portion of the structure. It is something I would consider informing my client of, but not as an absolute. I cannot say that the wiring is bad, as I cant determine it as so.


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: roconnor
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I agree with Joe that there is a middle ground, and that is not necessarily a “deal killer”.


The design life of most buildings is around 50 years. Does that mean all buildings older than 1954 should be torn down and rebuilt, or presenting this information would be a deal killer? ... No. Do older buildings and systems need a closer evaluation periodically, and more maintenance and repairs? ... Yes.

Those things should be pointed out to the clients, so they are aware that the maintenance and repair costs will most likely be more than on a newer home.

Just my 2-nickels


--
Robert O'Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee

I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong

Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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I agree there should be a middle ground.


I am just trying to show what I believe is the real world. I believe that most people would see this as a big negative and I doubt if I would recieve any referrals from Realtors should they see that I am telling buyers that the wiring is at the end of its life.

Mike P.


Originally Posted By: Bob Badger
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Mike Parks wrote:
I hope not. That 30 year mark means 1974. I think that is a little extreme.


We agree again Mike what is happening to us. ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif) ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)

If you say even 40 year old wiring is shot what do you say when you get to the 60 year old house?

Bob


--
Bob (AKA iwire)
ECN Discussion Forums
Mike Holt Code Forum

Originally Posted By: jpeck
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I don’t think it’s the “40 year old wiring” as much as the wiring of 40 years ago (going back from when I started using that age factor, meaning 40 years back from 1990, or about 1950).


I believe it is like K&T, it is outdated, not safely added on to, and the wring itself is suspect.

Starting about in the 1950s the change was made from rubber insulation to thermoplastic insulation. The rubber insulated wiring needs to be changed (most likely does), the thermoplastic does not (most likely does not). So, it not really the 40 years old, but prior to the mid 1950s.

In 50 years, 1970 thermoplastic NM cable will probably still be good (only time will tell). My house is from 1975+/- and I don't see that wiring "going bad and needing to be replaced" for decades, and it is already 30 years old.

Thus, instead of using '30-40-50 year old wiring needs to be replaced', I guess it would be better stated 'wiring from before 19XX should be considered for replacement'.

FEMA uses 70 years as the life of a house.

I'm not sure there is a middle ground. Either it will need re-wiring or it won't. If it needs re-wiring, it will likely be a "deal killer", if it does not need re-wiring, there is no major problem. I just don't know what "middle ground" you could be referring to.


--
Jerry Peck
South Florida

Originally Posted By: ekartal
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“Now that you have this information are you going to pass this on to your clients?”



Absolutely. We have a professional and moral obligation to tell our clients.

Thanks for your contributions.

Erol Kartal
ProInspect


Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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I like the honesty on both sides of this.


This is a hard pill to swallow. I believe as the homes get older the need for HI's will increase.

Mike P.


Originally Posted By: dbowers
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I can’t answer the question as written. I would not report it as a defect unless there is a defect or in poor condition - BUT it has nothing to do with killing a deal; it has to do with being a KAMIKASE pilot.


The bathtub is 40 years old - replace it;
The floor joists have a little sag and are 50 years old - replace them;
The paint in the 1950's house is probably lead based - replace it.

Where do you stop and look at whats there.

My dad was born in the 1920's he's getting worn out - lets shoot him.

IMHO, where some of these questions come from are out in lala land.