that the strategy in Iraq is working. They report that Al Quieda has over played it’s hand. There was a news story about a Saudi man who was duped into driving a suicide truck in Iraq, he was to drive a fuel truck loaded with 2 or 3 tons of explosives, and park it in front of the Jordanian embassy, then get out and run!. His 2 Al Quieda guides who rode with him, jumped out about 100 yards before the target and ran, when he got about 60 yards from the target, the back of the truck exploded. He said he looked down and his fingers just turned black, and melted and everything inside the truck started melting, he jumped out and ran, and some passers by took him to the hospital. He later confessed that he was not innocent as thought, but was in fact the driver. After the great treatment by the American doctors, he said he realized that the Jihad that he had been drawn into did not exist, it was all lies. He decided to help prevent anymore young men from losing their lives needlessly. He teemed up with Saudi officials, and now he speaks on T.V. to warn people not to be fooled. He said most of the suicide bombers are not told they will be used for only 1 mission. Any way, the reason I’m writing this post is to say to all the anti-war people who post on this BB, please give this new strategy time to work, it is working, regardless of how you feel, we are over there, support our troops, and our government’s plan, only then can we pull out, and everybody will better off for it.
:shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:
Gee…I think I know, now, why Kamikazee pilots wore helmets.
This thread should probably be in the “Not for Everyone” category so as not to offend.
What will the Dems do now? They have invested so heavily in the defeat of the USA in Iraq that this must be very bad news indeed.
If this type if news continues they will have to come up with something other than the "hate Bush get out of Iraq B.S.
Maybe even talk about some real issues. Not that they have much to offer.
Maybe they need a new SOP to address that issue. :neutral:
7.1.1 - You may be used only once and once only. If used again, you SUCK as a suicide bomber and will be put to worldy torture in the NACHI MB under the thread, To License or Not to License. <----that’s for you Jim! 
Good idea.
License all suicide bombers and fire them when they renew.
How long do we need? A month? A year? A decade? A century?
How is CNN or any of the other major media outlets who slant and grossly over-simplify complex issues a credible source? A great and current example of the media’s gutter journalism is their coverage of the high profile double murder suicide of a pro wrestler …
What exactly is our government’s plan and how is it going to work?
How does one “reformed” suicide bomber prove our plan is working?
When are the Iraqi people, not just our troops, actually going to unite against the terrorists who are killing Iraqi civilians?
How are we going to force the Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds to coexist under a democracy without our military presence?
What do we have to gain from acheiving a successful Iraqi democracy free of terrorism, considering the rest of the Middle East is littered with terrorist cells?
Can the war on terrorism really be considered a success because our troops on foriegn soil, not our civilians here in the US, are the victims of terrorist attacks?
He was just an example Nick, the Iraqi’s are fighting back, and the point with Cnn is that they are usually far to the left on this issue. i think we are much better off fighting them over there. And as far as other terorist cells, you have to start somewhere.
Strong examples can be made on either side of a story, just ask Jim Bushart about how it is done with licensing. Regardless, it is nice to hear of that there are those over there that see the errors of their ways. If only more of them would realize the hypocracy and absurdity of their fanatical ways.
As far as CNN, FOX and and all the other biased medias, I never merit their “journalism”. All of there “news” is sensationalized, slanted and very poorly analyzed to be of any use. It does not even impress me when they break protocol by swinging to the other side of the spectrum. Heck, they probably do something like that for the mere sake of getting people to talk about it (and hopefully tune in as a result).
I agree that we are better off fighting them over there. I disagree with how we are doing it. I do not see how we expect to stamp out the terrorists by forcing three rival ethnicities to maintain a secure, democratic government. I do not see how we expect to wipe out the terrorists when there is an endless supply of them flooding in from the swiss cheese boarders along Iran, Syria, Saudi Arabi, etc. I do not see how a weak democratic government that has to pander to tribes and is frequently subject to internal sabotage is going to maintain national security by itself, ever. With the utter lack of citizens taking actions into their own hands with the terrorists, I just do not see a strong will by the Iraqi citizen. Heck, they don’t even protest the bombers.
I would like to believe that we will eventually win but it is impossible to with all the questions swirling around. Perhaps a feasible plan would be a start …
Please, can we call these people (suicide bombers) what they truly are and that is, homicide bombers.
Wouldn’t licensure flood the streets with under-qualified suicide bombers who would all be viewed as equal? Or could the general public sleep better at night knowing that the suicide bombers would at least meet a minimum level of education and standards of practice?
Agreed!
At yet look at us. We have a multitude of nationalities, religions and other categorized groupings. Somehow we manage. Democracy is very young in Iraq and that part of theworld. They desire freedom and will work it out with our help keeping the terrorists off balance.
This is a gross mistatment that you should recondsider.
Please read history. Ours plans are not telegraphed to the enemy before they are executed. To assume there is no plan is ridiculous.
War is dirty business and rarely goes exactly according to any plan. There is no reason for us to lose except certain politicians who are committed to making sure it happens. Nick, I suspect your too young to have been around during the Vietnam war. I suggest you read about it and determine for yourself who brought about our loss in that war.
We actively took up arms to acheive our freedom. We actively fought to acheive equality. Where are there examples of this happening in Iraq?
I stated the lack of a feasible plan.
Very true.
The lack of reason to lose does not assure victory.
Explain to me how Vietnam applies to this war? Where are the indications that the the terrorists are nearing their breaking point like the Vietcong suppossedly was? Yes, it appears we could have won Vietnam but we were fighting guerrilla communists, not fanatic secularists.
Bears repeating!
Nick,
The world is not as it was in our early history.
The Vietnam reference is to the politicians and many people loosing their will and insisting on the pullout of troops before victory was complete. Sound familiar?
You mention a “feasible” plan. What would you do?
No doubt will is in decline. Yes, the “media” plays the biggest role in this and that is a disgrace. Then there are those hypocritical neo-hippies driving $50k gas guzzlers, drinking plastic wasting bottled water and live in oversized homes who ejaculate over “fighting for peace”. But I imagine there are many like me who lost confidence in the current “plan” due to a lack of indications of progress and a very questionable administration that promotes it. If I had indications of progress, perhaps my perception would change.
Either rule the country with an iron fist, as that seems to be the only feasible means of a stable government in the region, or fully withdrawl within a narrow timeline giving the Iraqis the ultimatium of cleaning up their own house or facing endless airstrikes until such is acheived. As evident with Palestine and Gaza, the middle eastern muslims simply do not accept the concept of freedom. As evident with Saddam and all the current corrupt regimes, they accept oppression.
I don’t know if I am a liberal or a conservative, anymore. I find myself rapidly bored by many of the discussions like these…where everyone has to be placed in a box and play a certain role expected by the box they choose to speak from.
But I do know this.
I know that whenever a person dies as a result of government action…whether it is a cop that shoots a man in the act of a crime or a soldier that dies in battle…our media has a duty to question it. And they should question it hard and refuse to accept rhetorical sound bites in place of real answers.
Many don’t agree with me, but it is as essential for a free society to have a free press to hold the leadership accountable for their actions as it is to hold elections.
There is certainly bias in the press, which is why only a fool would accept his news from only one source.
The greatest modern day president, Ronald Reagan, was in office when one of the first terrorist attacks took the lives of over 80 U.S. Marines in Beirut. A very liberal media took him to task and held him personably accountable for every single life that was lost in a mission that appeared to have no value.
He did not duck his responsibility. Instead, as the coffins arrived at an Air Force base in Deleware to be taken by the surviving families, President Reagan was there to meet them. He gave a eulogy for the families and, against the advice of his political insiders, he stayed and met with every single grieving mother, father, wife and child who showed up and did not leave until he had the opportunity to hear from each one.
He hugged them, wept with them, and listened to them and I have no doubt that he heard from a few mothers that day. But it comes with the job. If you are man enough to send a boy to his death…you better be able to take the heat from his survivors and from the press and from anyone else who you are accountable to.
Reagan went back to Washington D.C. and, after review, determined that “peace keeping” was not a good mission for our armed forces…and we left Beirut to others to “police”.
I was still on active duty when that happened. I can tell you that it is that kind of a leader that men will fight for and never question. I was there (but not in Beirut), and I know.
Trouble is, we seldom hear of our real sucesses in Iraq so I wonder if we really know what is happening there. This administration has done a lousy job of communicating our goals and setting reasonable expectations with the American public. My chief irritation is with those who do nothing but complain and offer no better way than get out. I would remind all that we are still in Germany, Korea, Japan, and some 700 other bases scattered around th e world some 50+ years after hostilities ceased. This is a long haul operation and we should not be surprised by that.
Isn’t that what dictators do?
What targets would be appropriate?
You have forgotten Turkey. People with choose freedom when they come to understand it is a real possibility. Why else do people from all over the world desire to emigrate to the U.S.A.?
I ask myself that question too James. The distinctions have become blurred. I do think we should always error on the side of freedom.
Fair enough. The media gives us little else than sound bites perhaps because we want everything now and refuse to take the time to understand an issue well enough to make wise informed choices.
Absolutely but all political leaders need to be held to the same level of accountability.
No kidding. You have to work a little harder to find out what is really going on.
He was indeed a class act.
Peace keeping alone is not sufficient motivation to put American lives as risk.
Contrast that with the morale of the military during the years preceding and following the Reagan era.
Exactly! I do not hold out the prospect of progress or even success but I just do not see it with this “Stay the Course” mantra. Its time we get hard facts, straight answers and clear expectations.
It is the new American way to simply complain about things instead of taking action. Gouging oil companies, gouging health insurers, crooked politicians, etc all just get complained about. Doing something other than participating in meaningless protests is almost unpatriotic.
We are still there because of the strategic military bases we built. That and we are insuring the nutty Northerns don’t drive their tanks across the world’s most armed border.
Yep.
Infrastructure.
I am sure the middle east muslims would, if we could end the secular brainwashing by the clerics. I have no idea how that would happen.