Recently I inspected a new construction condo. Besides regular defects where builders cut corners, there was a factory-built gas fireplace. There was no glass door, no venting of any kind, no outside chimney. The fireplace is in the living room, about 5 feet from the nearest window. I noted it in the report. The client called me and said that the seller said that it’s ok and it should be this way. I referred to known standards and said that unless some manufacturer came up with a fireplace that doesn’t need any outside air or ventilation without any CO emission, than I’d be wrong. Is there anything I don’t know? Please tell me!:shock:
You need to check the plates on the inside of the unit and see what is called for.
Do you have model (and or ) serial number info?
Unfortunately, I couldn’t locate any visible service plate.
This may be an acceptable fireplace. I know of certain models that exist in the U.S. marketplace that meet the non-venting criteria. I know this through personal experience through a family member. It was installed by a licensed gas fitter, and was deemed acceptable in Michigan.
As noted - it is important to find out the manufacturer and model, and the legality of installation in your area.
zero clearance non vented gas fireplaces are common here and are not allowed to have glass doors…they have oxygen depletion sensors and generally work pretty well, however they give off tons of heat and lots of moisture…jim
About the craziest piece of heating equipment I’ve heard of…like there’s no other pollutants in natural gas!!!
pretty much just a newer version of the old time gas space heaters…like it or not they have been around for many years…
Will Decker once suggested to me to suggest a carbon monoxide detector be placed fro safety near the unit, and of course most guidlines suggest a detector be placed in all bedrooms.
Do this and you have done your job.
Next time look at the plate and it will tell you what it is rated for.
Will , Joe .T and my self saw one not being used as rated on a Inspection we did together last month.
Are you talking smoke alarms or CO detectors in bedrooms?
Smokes in bedrooms won’t do jack for CO detection or poisoning.
Here’s a few that have been recalled
NEWS from CPSC
U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission
Office of Information and Public AffairsWashington, DC 20207
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
April 27, 2005
Release #05-162 **Heat & Glo Recall Hotline: (800) 215-5152 **
Heat & Glo Media Contact: (952) 985-0103
CPSC Recall Hotline: (800) 638-2772
CPSC Media Contact: (301) 504-7908
**CPSC, Heat & Glo Announce Recall of Gas Fireplaces **
WASHINGTON, D.C. – The U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission, in cooperation with the firm named below, today announced a voluntary recall of the following consumer product. Consumers should stop using recalled products immediately unless otherwise instructed.
**Name of Product: **HEAT-N-GLO® Gem 36 and Gem 42 gas fireplaces
**Units: **About 7,800
**Manufacturer: **Heat & Glo, of Lakeville, Minn.
**Hazard: **Gas in the fireplace can accumulate prior to burner ignition. When ignition takes place, it can cause the glass window to shatter and create a risk of burns or lacerations from broken glass.
**Incidents/Injuries: **Heat & Glo has received 21 reports of shattered glass, including four minor injuries.
Description: The recall involves all HEAT-N-GLO® Gem 36 and Gem 42 direct vent gas fireplaces. The model number is located on the rating plate inside the unit on the base pan in front of the gas control. The rating plate can be accessed by removing the lower grille on the fireplace. This recall also includes Gem 36 fireplaces that recently received a replacement burner assembly.
**Sold at: **Dealers and distributors of Hearth products nationwide sold the fireplace from July 2002 through April 2005 for between $2,380 and $2,700.
**Manufactured in: **United States.
**Remedy: **Consumers should stop using the fireplaces immediately and contact Heat & Glo to make arrangements for a free repair. To be sure that no one uses the fireplace by mistake, consumers should shut off the gas supply to the fireplace by removing the lower grille on the fireplace and turning off the ball valve (red lever) on the gas supply line.
Consumer Contact: For assistance in turning off the gas and arranging for a free repair, contact Heat & Glo at (800) 215-5152 between 8 a.m. and 10 p.m. CT Monday through Friday or log on to firm’s online registration page at www.gem3642.com or www.heatnglo.com.
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
September 9, 2002
Release # 02-248 **Valor Recall Hotline: (866) 541-0930 **
CPSC Consumer Hotline: (800) 638-2772
CPSC Media Contact: Ken Giles, (301) 504-7052
**CPSC, Valor Heating Announce Recall of Wall Mount Gas Fireplaces **
WASHINGTON, D.C. - In cooperation with the U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission (CPSC), Valor Heating Ltd., of Birmingham, United Kingdom, is voluntarily recalling about 730 direct vent wall mount gas fireplaces. A design defect in the gas control assembly can allow main burner gas to prematurely enter the firebox during lighting. The ignition of this excess gas can cause the glass window to shatter, presenting the risk of burns or cuts from broken glass.
Valor has received one report of cuts to the consumer’s face when the glass front of the fireplace shattered after excess gas ignited.
This recall includes model 837AN (natural gas) and 837AP (propane) direct vent wall mount fireplaces made in the United Kingdom. The fireplaces have a glass front and an imitation wooden log set. The “Valor” logo is printed on the bottom front of the fireplace. The model number is printed on a plate in the lower control area.
Specialty fireplace dealers sold these fireplaces nationwide from September 1997 through January 2002 for between $1,700 and $2,400. Consumers should stop using these fireplaces and shut off the gas immediately. To arrange for a free repair, consumers should contact Valor at (866) 541-0930 between 8 a.m. and 4:30 p.m. CT Monday through Friday or visit the firm’s web site at www.valorflame.com
Your killin’ us with those big cut and paste photos.
Barry I said C/O, I think.
opps better check
edit…yep sure did.
Just copied and pasted the page, ooooooooooooppppppppppppsssssssss:roll:
I think they’ll have to check the link
Did you ship my copy of Cut and Paste 101 yet?
Thanks for all the suggestions, guys! I spoke to the client and he said he’d ask the builders for the manufacturer’s specifications and if the unit is legal in Chicago. He’s going to have renters there so to avoid any accidents, he’s going to disable the unit and use it for decorative purposes. I found at least 2 hybrid smoke/CO detectors in the same room. So, I think he’s going to be fine.
In the state they must be within 15 feet of bedrooms.
Not quite what we recommend.
Vent-less gas logs** (often referred to as “Vent-Free” gas logs) have specially designed burners that burn the gas cleanly and produce almost no exhaust—somewhat like the way a gas range in a kitchen works. Since there is little or no exhaust, they can be burned with the damper closed.**
The beauty of this type of system is that 99.9% of the heat produced by the gas logs goes into the room, so they produce substantially more heat than their vented counter-parts. However, there are many negative features commonly associated with vent-less logs that one must be aware of before deciding to purchase them:
**Positive Features of Vent-less Gas Logs: **
**1. ****Much better heat output than vented gas logs **
**2. ****Less pollution **
**3. ****Slightly less gas consumption **
Negative Features of Vent-less Gas Logs:
**1. ****Since the byproduct of burning gas cleanly is water, vent-less logs will introduce excess moisture into your home which can result in mold or mildew. **
**2. ****Vent-less logs should not be burned for extended periods of time with windows closed, otherwise they will deplete the oxygen in your home. **
**3. ****If vent-less logs are burned for more than an hour or so, a window must be open a crack to allow air into your home to replace the oxygen burned by the vent-less logs. This will introduce cold air into the room and offset some of the heating benefits that vent-less logs claim to have. **
**4. ****Vent-less logs produce an odor that some equate to the smell of burning kerosene. If one has a keen sense of smell, the odor may be greatly dissatisfactory with vent-less logs. (On the other hand, some people like the smell because it reminds them of their childhood days at Grandma’s house.) **
**5. ****Vent-less logs are not legal in California as well as some cities and municipalities in other states (check with your local building department). However, one can still purchase vent-less logs in California—they will have to be used with the damper open (which really defeats the purpose). **
**6. ****Vent-less logs are required to have an ODS (oxygen depletion system) as well as a CO detector, which might tell you that there are some risks involved in operating them in the event of system failure. **
**7. ****The flame pattern with vent-less logs pales in comparison to vented logs. Because the gas must burn cleanly, the flame height is very low and most of it is blue. **
**8. ****Also, one may find that the flame does not “dance around” like a real wood fire and very little of the flame actually touches the logs. The reason for this is that when the flame touches the logs, it gets cooled off and does not burn cleanly and starts to produce soot and exhaust gases. **
Huge amounts of water vapor are produced by Vent free gas logs. It is estimated that 1.5 gallons of water is produced for every 100,000 BTUs of gas burned. As these systems burn around 30,000 BTUs per hour, it requires only 3 ½ hours to produce such an amount of water. In the case of Vent free gas logs, these vapors can condense on windows and other cold surfaces present in the room which can create severe moisture problems. Hence, these products come with directions for leaving a window slightly open during use.
How can they claim that they burn cleaner and with less pollution???