Hot Receptacle

Originally Posted By: jpope
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Any ideas as to why this would be this hot?


![](upload://8X7bKkLUfgUzW2YIoI2aoxchjAH.jpeg)



The was for the FAU in the basement. It had only been running for about five minutes before I got this reading.


--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
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Originally Posted By: Steven Brewster
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Really got no clue but:


The plug connection appears to be backwards (reversed polarity)

What size is the cord, what is the demand by the unit? Possible undersized appliance cord. 110V/220V? Receptacle improper 15a?

Is the infrared temp gauge sampling possibly a hot water pipe behind the junction box, or the pipe beside?

What's the answer?


Originally Posted By: lkage
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What is the cord to?


Is there a small hole in the duct blowing on the outlet?


--
"I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him."
Galileo Galilei

Originally Posted By: jpope
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Steven Brewster wrote:
Is the infrared temp gauge sampling possibly a hot water pipe behind the junction box, or the pipe beside?


The plug was hot (I felt it first) that is why I checked the temp. Wired properly and grounded.

My assumption is that the appliance cord was undersized for the FAU.


--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738

Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
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This might just be a worn outet. Resistance in the socket makes heat.


Steven, why do you think this is reversed polarity?


Originally Posted By: jpope
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This was a relatively new installation (less than two years) and the plug fit tightly (if that matters).



Jeff Pope


JPI Home Inspection Service


“At JPI, we’ll help you look better”


(661) 212-0738

Originally Posted By: psabados
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Could be an undersized cord. A couple of questions that come to mind are, what size is the fixture? A std 48 inch or a 72 or 96 unit. What power rating, HO. VHO? Couuld be a bad transformer or starter getting ready to blow causing a high draw. The use of incorrect rated bulbs would also cause a high draw. Also, how many units on the circuit?


Paul


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NACHI Vice President

NACHI Foundation, President

Convention Coordinator

Originally Posted By: Joey D’Adamo
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My money’s on a loose connection inside the box.


Originally Posted By: Steven Brewster
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Greg,


The appliance connector plugs Iv'e seen have the ground toward the cord side. See pic. If that holds true for this cord, the ground would have been removed and the plug forced into the receptacle, thus reversed polarity for the appliance.


[ Image: http://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/usrimages/2/297457_front500.jpg ]


Originally Posted By: psabados
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Right angle grounds can go both ways


![](upload://dspcWHX3f7jEbNF7CmNjUhGwGzy.jpeg)

Note the ground position on the lower picture

Paul


--
NACHI Vice President

NACHI Foundation, President

Convention Coordinator

Originally Posted By: Steven Brewster
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Learn something every day. Thanks!! icon_lol.gif


Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
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Heat is usually something loose, Joey may be on it or you could still have a bad contact in the receptacle. If 2 are tight the plug could be hard to pull out but the 3d could still be loose.


Originally Posted By: pdickerson
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I am skeptical that the issue is an undersized cord. In order for the cord to transfer a substantial amount of heat into the plug blades and then into the receptacle and then into the box in 5 minutes, it (the cord) would have to be extremely hot. I think you would have noticed that. Also, the cord looks to be about a 16 AWG. Even 20 amps would not heat it up that much, and anything more would (hopefully) trip the breaker. I am betting on a loose neutral or hot connection at the outlet. Is it possible that the outlet is backstabbed?


Originally Posted By: wdecker
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Jeff;


Did you check this outlet and one downstream for voltage drop. I see this a lot in newer construction. Most times it is because of a loose connection or a back stab.

Around here, some of the 'electricians' do not first twist connect wires together becore putting on the wire not. They thi8ng that the twisting of the wire not will suffice to make a physical connection. Thus loose connections, thus overheating, thus voltage drop detected.


--
Will Decker
Decker Home Services
Skokie, IL 60076
wjd@DeckerHomeServices.com

Originally Posted By: chorne
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Hi Jeff,


The bx cable feeding the box looks big. What size wire was
feeding it? (maybe that's just the picture)

Carla


Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
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Will, the manufacturer instructions say twisting is not necessary.


110.3(B) still applies.


Originally Posted By: wdecker
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I have made test circuits, some physically twsited and then the nut put on and some just twisted with the nut. I also used different sized nuts, different gauge wire (14 and 12 AWG) and different length runs (50, 75, 100 and 125 ft). I did the testing with the help of a friend who is a master electrician and an instructor in the loocal IBEW school.


Overall, there is less voltage drop when the splice is first physically twisted with a linesman's pliers and then the nut put on.

It is very common to see new construction around here with as much as a 15 - 19% voltage drop on 2nd floor outlets in a 4200 SF house (15 amp with 14 AWG wire). NEC calls for no more than 5% at 12 amps.

The usual cause is the 'twist with nut' technique, with punch-down attachment 2nd.

Again, I don't quote, nor am I constrained by, code. Out state mandates that we call out safety hazards.


--
Will Decker
Decker Home Services
Skokie, IL 60076
wjd@DeckerHomeServices.com

Originally Posted By: Joey D’Adamo
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I think when a lot of people think of using nuts without pretwisting they miss a very serious part of most manufacturers directions: keep twisting until at least two twists are visible on the wire insulation itself. If you do this, the wire will be perfectly twisted inside the nut.


Installing a wirenut and screwing it on so that the connectors are still parallel and just gripped by the spring alone is never correct!


Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
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I guess the manufacture doesn’t have a clue how to install his product.


Originally Posted By: wdecker
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Greg;


Wouldn't be the first time.

Ever try putting a Barbie House together on Christmas Eve?


--
Will Decker
Decker Home Services
Skokie, IL 60076
wjd@DeckerHomeServices.com