Originally Posted By: rmeyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
(2) Type IC. A recessed luminaire (fixture) that is identified for contact with insulation, Type IC, shall be permitted to be in contact with combustible materials at recessed parts, points of support, and portions passing through or finishing off the opening in the building structure.
(B) Installation. Thermal insulation shall not be installed above a recessed luminaire (fixture) or within 75 mm (3 in.) of the recessed luminaire's (fixture's) enclosure, wiring compartment, or ballast unless it is identified for contact with insulation, Type IC.
From my experience they can be completely buried in insulation although I have had people claim shorter bulb life from the difference in heat retention??
As for the today's cellulose insulation, I believe the chemicals treatments are compatible with the housings. Early cellulose fire retardant chemicals reacted with metal parts in attics (Gussets on trusses).
Originally Posted By: Dennis Bozek This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Good job Russ…someone give that guy a kewpie doll. Never heard of the lamp burning out quicker but it makes sense…after all what does insualtion do in the first place!!!
– This information has been edited and reviewed for errors by your favorite resident sparky.
Originally Posted By: csewell This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
I am about to start my inspection business after training, etc. for over a year while doing some other consulting work.
I am curious, do you guys climb all over the attic to get to the canned light fixtures to see if they are IC or is there an easier way? I don't see any label visable on mine from the room space and some cans in some houses are 20 plus feet in the air in open living rooms of two story houses.
Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Charles,
I will advise my clients to remove all insulation from these canned light fixtures. There are not many fixtures that are rated for insulation to go over the top of them. New construction...maybe. But then you will see the label.
But if you recommend removing the insulation from above the light and they do not, you are covered either way. For the areas you can not get to or areas that are concealed, I recommend that these fixtures be evaluated for proper installation.
Originally Posted By: Russell Stephens This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
They can very easily make a Round tube out of sheet metal and place this around the recessed light to help prevent the insulation from coming in contact with the fixture after they remove the insulation. If you have a 3 inch diameter light I would make the tube at least 6 inches to be on the safe side.
Originally Posted By: nlewis This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Charles,
You don’t necessarily have to examine every light fixture to determine the rating. Most recessed lights in an attic will be the same type , so you can inspect one of the closer ones.
You really should be climbing around most areas of the attic, as long as you feel comfortable walking on the joists with no flooring. You will find the most interesting stuff in the hardest to reach places. Just don’t think about how high up you are when over the top of the 20’ great room ceiling.
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
All of the can lights that I have ever installed had the IC rating on the inside of the can, you just have to remove the diffuser and look on the inside of the can.
IC can lights differ from the standard can light because they must provide thermal protection if they get too hot the thermal protector trips shutting off the light. Once it cools it will reset and turn back on.
If you are removing the insulation from around the can to check the rating I would advise caution, they do get hot enough to cause you a severe burn.
Shortened bulb life is proven in my book, I installed many of them in a house I owned and I could rarely get a bulb to last more than 30 days, 60 days if you were really, really, really lucky or you just did not use the light much. The watt miser bulbs rarely lasted more than two weeks. If I were to do it again I would replace them with the compact fluorescent or a similar bulb that does not produce the heat of the incandescent.
Originally Posted By: Dennis Bozek This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Two things I hate to install…recessed cans and
exhaust fans Anyway…compact flourescents in a recessed can gives the longest lamp life however they are ballasted fixtures and unless one knows how to replace the ballast…you are probably better off with the incadescent type.
The biggest problems I see with recessed cans are the size of the lamp. These things are only rated for so much wattage depending on the style of lamp you install. This is typically stated inside the reflector of the can. Exceed the recommended wattage and it will surely melt stuff as well as become a fire hazard. Had a funny sometime ago, a tile and marble store called me out because their lighting was smelling bad and some fixtures were smoking. When I got there, a display case that was lit up by 8 recessed cans with eyeballs all had 150 watt incadescent lamps in them. The cans were rated for no more than a 60 watt lamp when using the incadescent style of lamp (ordinary light bulb). The heat generated by that 150 watter was enough to melt the eyeballs which are basically just plastic. Some got so hot that they actually started to smoke 
Needless to say I think the guy or gal who put them lamos in these fixtures are probably not employed there anymore.
If the can is rated for IC then it is ok for insulation to touch it. In the case of a old work can that is rated for IC, typically unless you have some sort of access to these cans from above, they are going to sit amongst all the insulation you slide them into. I have yet to see any recessed can start a fire or cause over temperature if it is rated for IC and sitting in insulation.
One fact that happened about 3 years ago specifically pertained to Halo cans (Cooper Lighting). They had farmed out some of their manufacturing to Mexico and what had transpired was that the heat shrink placed on the leads to the thermocell was too short. As the can went into operation, the heat generated by the lamp would shrink this tube more and because it was too short, it would allow the leads of the thermocell to be exposed and in many cases, allow it to short out to the metal part of the can. Well.....WHAM  when these things shiorted out it would typically trip the breaker but not before causing the home owner to jump from his easychair. Halo has since then repaired that problem but as far as I know, they did not do a recall on the bad fixtures. So beware of Halo cans specifically...check that tubing on the thermocell! If anyone wants any recessed cans installed call another sparky....oh and I don't do windows either.
-- This information has been edited and reviewed for errors by your favorite resident sparky.
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Dennis,
When I said to replace them with a fluorescent bulb I meant the bulb that contains the ballast, not the fluorescent can light.
Halo was always way more expensive than the Hubbell counterpart, I wonder if that is why they tried to assemble them overseas, to cut the cost so they could be more competetive!
and