What is the difference between cloth wiring and insulated cloth wiring? And do you have a picture? Is the attached picture insulated cloth wiring or cloth wiring? Citizens will allow insulated cloth wiring but not plain cloth wiring.
Rubber insulation under the cloth .
They stopped making it in Canada about 1950~.
Typically these are type RH conductors which are tin coated copper with a rubber insulation and a “cloth” covering. The tin keeps the copper from reacting with the rubber.
so what is my picture? Plain cloth wiring? I have been asked to specify on my 4-point, if it is insulated or not… If it is two wires wrapped in cloth which enters the sub panel, is it just cloth wiring?
It’s insulated. Where are you getting this information of a the definitions/difference between cloth wiring and insulated cloth wiring?
Interesting never heard that before .
I was taught the wire was tinned to make it easier to solder as that was how all joints where made back then ,
Directly from the uninformed insurance company…
love it never heard of that insulation before .
I would call it insulated wiring, which it definitely is. Cloth wiring would not work very well, as cloth is a poor conductor of electricity, which is why they make wires out of copper, gold, aluminum, etc. Probably best to leave that last bit out of your report lest insuranceco might mistake you for a smartypants.
It was tinned because the rubber has sulfur in it that reacts with copper.
All aged wiring had some type of rubberized or encased coating. Even knob and tube had some type of material which seperated the wire from the cloth sheathing. I can’t tell anymore becuase its so old its brittle and crubles when messsed with.
They could be specifing the strand itself. Older wires were cloth wrapped like Roys picture.
Later wiring used in the late 50’s and 60’s was actually a rubber coated strand. The outer casing was still cloth wrapped but the hot and neutral strands were simmilar to modern wiring.
The larger wiring in your picture would be cloth covered, but I would want to know if it specified single or multi strand. Even with newer single strand wiring used up through the 70’s, some of the larger wiring was still cloth covered.
The stuff in the first photo appears to be stranded. Why would stranded vs. solid matter?
I personally don’t know why, I was just using the reference from past observation. My only thought on that was it seemed to still be used after single strand started to transition over to newer materials. At least thats what I have commonly seen.
I would think it wouldn’t matter, but only the insurance company could answer that one.
I think its about age and what was used and or available for residential during such and such time frame. We all have seen the transition from K&T basically starting pre 1920’s thru present day we can pretty well date a lot of homes by the type of electrical wire used
Background of question. I did a 4-point on a sale. The lady was able to get insurance based on my 4-point. 6 weeks after closing she received her cancellation notice as I checked the box knob and tub/cloth wiring. I was asked to review as she fixed the plumbing and wanted a second look at the electrical. I redid the 4-point and received the e-mail below from the insurance lady…
On a side note, why did they close on my first 4-point and then cancel her 6 months after closing? If this is the standard I need to be educated so I can warn the buyer…
Lucy has not yet called me back. Are you able to send me a copy of the inspection?
Also, Citizen’s will accept insulated cloth wiring, but they will not accept cloth wiring if its not insulated…could you make sure the inspection specificies if it is insulated or not?
Jeff pretty much answered this already. Whomever is providing the info for the insurance company hasn’t a clue.
Cancellation after acceptance is because little fish, the first person who saw the application approved the policy, but slightly bigger fish, the underwriter reviewed the policy after it was written and over rode the little fish. This seems to be standard procedure in insurance biz, everybody is accepted right away, take their money, so they don’t go elsewhere, study the application at leisure and reject the ones that are higher risk later.
Your reply is simple, “The NEC mandates that all conductors are to be insulated except the Equipment Grounding Conductor which never carries current except in a fault condition.”
I reached up and randomly picked out the 1940 edition of the NEC which states in 3004 that conductors must have insulation of the following types except the neutral of a service entrance cable. Want to guess what type of insulation was mentioned? Rubber which is made with sulfur and the copper was tinned to prevent adverse affects.