Originally Posted By: pehrenpreis This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Hey Everyone in Virginia!
This is your classic "Catch-22" in VA you need x amount of training and x amount of inspections and pass a [the] national exam before you can become and call yourself "a certified home inspector."
OK? How are you (or not?) using the designation "Certified" as in NACHI if you have not completed these requirements? (such as logo on a [your] web site, business cards, reference to this site etc.)
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
I believe in VA they are opposed to you saying you are " State Certified " or just plain listing you are "Certified " as that would imply a governmental agenda.
But Nick is right....if you are NACHI Certified their is nothing wrong with making that statement.....as you are NACHI Certified....nothing ilegal their...
But to place on your site or cards........with your business listing and then have just " Certified " or ' State Certified " you will have a problem.
Many people hold " Certifications " in many fields of study and have earned the right by the certification body that " certified them "
For example...one of my companies my home office " Certifies " our dealers and they list themselves as " Certified " becasue they came to our office, trained under our office and passes our tests and became certified. But they dont say the are State Certified at all.
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: ddivito This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
state certified (regardless of any professional certification), and he added that there is no precedent concerning this, because this would be a criminal case which does not create precedence in law.
He suggests that you do not use the word certified unless you are recognized by the state to use the term or talk to a lawyer who thinks he can win a case if someone makes a complaint against you because of your claiming to be "certified" and you really are not.
In other words don't do it unless you are certified by the state.
Why not become state certified? It strengthens our profession and sends the message that you consider yourself a professional.
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Firstly,
Is strongly disagree with you in regards to only state certified inspectors can convey professional statue in the home inspections industry.
Secondly, The state can NOT govern the achievements of a individual to lets say the level of organization like the NACHI...if they certify you I would find it MORE criminal for the state to impose their will and say you cant even use the term...NACHI? Certified Inspector or Certified by NACHI?
The fact they have the right to certify and test as do manufacturers who certify people to work on their product or software like Microsoft Certifed and the like...
The state does NOT want to open up the can of worms in saying that even an individual can't use the term certified from a organization and I would be very interested in speaking with the DPOR director who plans on enforcing that theory.
Does it help the industry...maybe...does it harm it...no otherwise it would not be a Voluntary Law in VA.....
Guess I have a good lawyer........They will have to sue alot of people that have legit certificates in hand...stated they are certified by NACHI, what about the RADON certification...it is not by the state and does not convey a license for their home inspectors and is certified from the EPA or other body...yet they can use the term Radon Certified.
The term Certfied is broad......if you had a ad and NACHI members check your own websites.....if you go by what is being said here then you make a statement on your site...NACHI? Certified you are in violation of the law.......obserd...
Dennis I will call Mr. David Dick on Monday and bring up this with him directly. I and my attorney are very interested in hearing what he has to say on the issue and his authority to say NACHI? can't certify their members...or if ITA cant Educationally Certify their members, if my other company can't legally Certify our members who we training and they pass our tests.
It is a interesting can of worms Mr. Dick may be bringing up.
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
18 VAC 15-40-20 Necessity for certfication
Any person who hols himself out as or uses the title of " Certfied Home Inspector " or coducts or offers to provide a " Certfied Home Inspection "
Ok.....so are you saying Mr David Dick stated these terms are not correct to use..
Certfied by NACHI?
NACHI? Certfied
ITA Educationally Certfied
ITA Certfied
AHIT Certfied
all of these would be in the eyes of the DPOR as a violation of the law.....it is important to know....did he mean any statement which has the term Certified in it...?
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: ddivito This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Mr Dick is not the enforcer of law. His department is only the administrative agency for the regulations. His comments were only his opinion, not a position of the Board.
His suggestion was to make the distinction clear to clients that you are not STATE CERTIFIED. But he was not sure if that would be acceptable to a judge who is the only one who can make the decision. Not him or the board.
You may be better off talking to a commonwealth attorney about the issue, as it is the legislation that makes the stipulation, not the Board's standards of practice. They are two different things.
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Or better yet talk to NACHI becasue if what you state is true I can see future lawsuits against the NACHI because it’s button on websites clearly says Certified…
His opinion is one thing.....the "quoted" state mark on the term " Certfied Home Inspector " can only govern that statement..I dont think their is anyone saying they are state certified who are not already truly state certfied.
besides....in most cases the loophole at the bottom requirement will allow many inspectors in the state to bypass the top 4 requirements because of the testing within the professional associations.
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: bkelly2 This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
In AZ if you advertise as a Certified Home Inspector you need to be certified by the state. If you do not have a state cert you can not advertise as being a certified home inspector without being fined. Just like I can’t use my Autopia drivers license to drive.
– “I used to be disgusted, Now I try to Be amused”-Elvis Costello
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
why not…the logo NACHI gave me to place on my site has Certifed on it…am I authorized to remove it???
Anyway.....very interesting and brian...all states are not created equal.....I being a licensed electrician and contractor in VA MUST have a license but again HI's do not...voluntary.
Anyway.....again I will contact them on Monday....they know who I am and it wont be a cold call....
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Quote:
"Note to New Inspectors:
NACHI does not make a public distinction between these two levels of membership. No law requires you to publicly announce what your NACHI member level is so you are simply a "Member." This is true for many other professions. For instance, a lawyer is not required to warn his first client about his lack of experience. Also, no law recognizes experience and knowledge gained outside the performance of inspections (many inspectors were once involved in construction). Since every inspector's experience is different there is likely no correlation between real experience and level of membership. Furthermore, since no law requires a public disclosure of an inspector's experience (or lack of it), NACHI does not require it either. If you are only a new working member you need not alarm your clients. If you are a full member there is nothing preventing you from touting it. You must be one or the other though. NACHI does not "brand" new inspectors with derogatory terms such as "Associate" or "Candidate" because NACHI has an entrance exam. Many agents blacklist associates and candidates. If you are a member you may call yourself a "Certified Member" or a "Certified Home Inspector."
Ok...note the LAST line.........now do they WISH us to get sued or is that just lack of understanding the law?
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: Monte Lunde This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
NV requires you to be certified by them before you can advertise as a Certified Home Inspector or a Certified Residential Inspector. The certification comes only after you have completed there requirements for your license.
NRS 645D.160 Certificate required; penalty; prosecution of violation.
1. Any person who, in this state, engages in the business of, acts in the capacity of, or advertises or assumes to act as an inspector without first obtaining a certificate pursuant to this chapter is guilty of a misdemeanor.
I would say that NACHI Certified would not cause a problem as long as you are not conducting Real Estate Structural Inspection (Home Inspections) in the State.
-- Monte Lunde CCI, CCPM, CRI
Viking Construction Services Inc.
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: ddivito This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
governing the use of the C word. It has nothing to do with organizations who may not advise their members correctly for every state situation. It is the individual home inspector who would be responsible.
? 54.1-517.1. Applicability.
The certification program established under this article shall be voluntary and shall not be construed to restrict or otherwise affect the right of any person to conduct an inspection of a residential building for any purpose; however, no person may (i) refer to the inspection conducted as a "certified home inspection" or (ii) hold himself out as, or use the title of "certified home inspector," unless he has been certified in accordance with this article. Any person offering to provide or conduct a "certified home inspection" within the meaning of this chapter or through verbal claim, sign, advertisement, or letterhead representing himself as a "certified home inspector" shall be subject to the provisions of ? 54.1-111 of this title.
(2001, c. 723.)
? 54.1-111. Unlawful acts; prosecution; proceedings in equity; civil penalty.
A. It shall be unlawful for any person, partnership, corporation or other entity to engage in any of the following acts:
1. Practicing a profession or occupation without holding a valid license as required by statute or regulation.
2. Making use of any designation provided by statute or regulation to denote a standard of professional or occupational competence without being duly certified or licensed.
3. Making use of any titles, words, letters or abbreviations which may reasonably be confused with a designation provided by statute or regulation to denote a standard of professional or occupational competence without being duly certified or licensed.
Any person who willfully engages in any unlawful act enumerated in this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. The third or any subsequent conviction for violating this section during a 36-month period shall constitute a Class 6 felony. In addition, any person convicted of any unlawful act enumerated in subdivision 1 through 8 of this subsection, for conduct that is within the purview of any regulatory board within the Department of Professional and Occupational Regulation, may be ordered by the court to pay restitution
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Again…the argument is that we are NOT holding ourselves out as State Certified or offering ourselves as ’ certified home inspectors " we are offering ourselves as NACHI Certified Members or Certified by NACHI…
anyway.......it has beena good debate.......with all the certifications I have with the state of VA anyway...lol....what would be one more as the only requirement I have not met is the national test........for all thats worth....anyway....
I will let my attorney call them on Monday.....he is on retainer anyway and I have many other companies so he can do the dirty work...lol
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: tallen This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
pabernathy wrote:
Again...the argument is that we are NOT holding ourselves out as State Certified or offering ourselves as ' certified home inspectors " we are offering ourselves as NACHI Certified Members or Certified by NACHI...
No, I am certified by the State of AZ. Big difference.
Am I of topic?
-- I have put the past behind me,
where , however, it now sits, making rude remarks.
Originally Posted By: pabernathy This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Naw…you are fine Mr.Allen…you are free to comment but again certified state inspectors are bias on the question being asked. Why does the state of VA have a voluntary law…and in the terms it says you are not able to use…the “” the full term and not the singlized word " Certified "
As one member mentioned...I have WAY to much time on my hands to sit and think up stuff....I have to get out more. Come monday back to the grind so I have that to look forward too..
-- Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: jhagarty This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
ddivito wrote:
This is the text of the LAW governing the use of the C word. It has nothing to do with organizations who may not advise their members correctly for every state situation. It is the individual home inspector who would be responsible.
? 54.1-517.1. Applicability.
The certification program established under this article shall be voluntary and shall not be construed to restrict or otherwise affect the right of any person to conduct an inspection of a residential building for any purpose; however, no person may (i) refer to the inspection conducted as a "certified home inspection" or (ii) hold himself out as, or use the title of "certified home inspector," unless he has been certified in accordance with this article. Any person offering to provide or conduct a "certified home inspection" within the meaning of this chapter or through verbal claim, sign, advertisement, or letterhead representing himself as a "certified home inspector" shall be subject to the provisions of ? 54.1-111 of this title.
(2001, c. 723.)
? 54.1-111. Unlawful acts; prosecution; proceedings in equity; civil penalty.
A. It shall be unlawful for any person, partnership, corporation or other entity to engage in any of the following acts:
1. Practicing a profession or occupation without holding a valid license as required by statute or regulation.
2. Making use of any designation provided by statute or regulation to denote a standard of professional or occupational competence without being duly certified or licensed.
3. Making use of any titles, words, letters or abbreviations which may reasonably be confused with a designation provided by statute or regulation to denote a standard of professional or occupational competence without being duly certified or licensed.
Any person who willfully engages in any unlawful act enumerated in this section shall be guilty of a Class 1 misdemeanor. The third or any subsequent conviction for violating this section during a 36-month period shall constitute a Class 6 felony. In addition, any person convicted of any unlawful act enumerated in subdivision 1 through 8 of this subsection, for conduct that is within the purview of any regulatory board within the Department of Professional and Occupational Regulation, may be ordered by the court to pay restitution
Dennis:
The most effective marketing that you can conduct is to Sell Yourself.