Clip or no clip

[phalstead (Preston Halstead, HI549)]

@btoye

LOL. Yeah, the “expert” sure likes to ramble on, but never really answers the question. Jerry Peck, with all due respect, says “Neither”??? I think both of those guys forgot about the blocking allowance.

I really am not knocking him but I really don’t have time to read a long description about that. There may be some valid points but the should be short and sweet. I have a business to run here. Just because you write a 40 page response doesn’t make it the best, especially if you ignore the wording on the form. That’s why I said you could read the “expert” because I don’t have that kind of time.

[btoye (Bradley Toye, CMI)]

@Robert_R.Sheppard

Having constructed more conventional frame rafter systems than I care to remember, I can tell you why this connection was placed where it is (connected to the ceiling joist) instead of where it should be (rafter).

Mechanically attached connectors are installed AFTER the rafters are set, not before.

In other words, the rafters and joists were set to the exterior supporting wall, then the connectors put in place.

So why are they attached to the joist and not the rafter?

Because the builder installed the roof sheathing BEFORE he installed the connectors and the connection between the rafter and the supporting wall structure was no longer accessible.

The connectors were installed at the only location that was accessible after the sheathing was installed, the ceiling joist from the inside. The connectors are not installed at the correct location, the connectors should be on the outside wall connected to the rafter.

Again, “can” and “should”…….

My fault, I “assumed” because you are a licensed contractor that you would have put two and two together on this one.

I can add just fine, Robert. You are incorrect about placing the connectors on the outside of the wall. Who does that? This is very rarely done unless it is retrofitted after interior finishes are installed, or for some other access issue. 99% of framed wall roof tie-downs (basic clips) are installed after the sheathing is on, from the inside. The reason this clip is on the joist is because the installer doesn’t know how to flip it around and install it on the rafter side…must be left handed. You should know this if you actually did frame a house.

Jerry Peck says that rafter is not even toe-nailed. How in the hell does he know that, and is most likely incorrect. Think about it.

[phalstead (Preston Halstead, HI549)]

@Robert_R.Sheppard

Having constructed more conventional frame rafter systems than I care to remember, I can tell you why this connection was placed where it is (connected to the ceiling joist) instead of where it should be (rafter).

Mechanically attached connectors are installed AFTER the rafters are set, not before.

In other words, the rafters and joists were set to the exterior supporting wall, then the connectors put in place.

So why are they attached to the joist and not the rafter?

Because the builder installed the roof sheathing BEFORE he installed the connectors and the connection between the rafter and the supporting wall structure was no longer accessible.

The connectors were installed at the only location that was accessible after the sheathing was installed, the ceiling joist from the inside. The connectors are not installed at the correct location, the connectors should be on the outside wall connected to the rafter.

Again, “can” and “should”…….

My fault, I “assumed” because you are a licensed contractor that you would have put two and two together on this one.

Huh?

[mmeeker (Michael Meeker, CMI)]

@Robert_R.Sheppard

Plantation?

I’ll never tell Joking.
I signed up as BlackSheepI think the name fits

[phalstead (Preston Halstead, HI549)]

@btoye

I can add just fine, Robert. You are incorrect about placing the connectors on the outside of the wall. Who does that? This is very rarely done unless it is retrofitted after interior finishes are installed, or for some other access issue. 99% of framed wall roof tie-downs (basic clips) are installed after the sheathing is on, from the inside. The reason this clip is on the joist is because the installer doesn’t know how to flip it around and install it on the rafter side…must be left handed. You should know this if you actually did frame a house.

Jerry Peck says that rafter is not even toe-nailed. How in the hell does he know that, and is most likely incorrect. Think about it.

Seriously though, what is he talking about? I have built houses and buildings in NJ and FL. Just because you say its so doesn’t mean it is. Cant see the forest through the trees…

[btoye (Bradley Toye, CMI)]

@mmeeker

I’ll never tell Joking.
I signed up as BlackSheepI think the name fits

Yep, you are member #31, congrats. Might get kinda lonely over there.

[btoye (Bradley Toye, CMI)]

@phalstead

Seriously though, what is he talking about? I have built houses and buildings in NJ and FL. Just because you say its so doesn’t mean it is. Cant see the forest through the trees…

I have no idea, Preston. He seems to be fixated on making a mark somehow. Probably never swung a hammer in his life.

[Robert_R.Sheppard]

@btoye

I can add just fine, Robert. You are incorrect about placing the connectors on the outside of the wall. Who does that? This is very rarely done unless it is retrofitted after interior finishes are installed, or for some other access issue. 99% of framed wall roof tie-downs (basic clips) are installed after the sheathing is on, from the inside. The reason this clip is on the joist is because the installer doesn’t know how to flip it around and install it on the rafter side…must be left handed. You should know this if you actually did frame a house.

Jerry Peck says that rafter is not even toe-nailed. How in the hell does he know that, and is most likely incorrect. Think about it.

Thank you Brad, that gave me a chuckle.

Left-handed contractors install connectors backwards…classic, absolutely classic.

[Robert_R.Sheppard]

@btoye

Jerry Peck says that rafter is not even toe-nailed. How in the hell does he know that, and is most likely incorrect. Think about it.

Do you see a “toe-nail” in the picture provided?

[mmeeker (Michael Meeker, CMI)]

@btoye

Yep, you are member #31, congrats. Might get kinda lonely over there.

The more the merrier I bet we end up with some good easy to find technical info over there and not nearly as much venom as here.

[Robert_R.Sheppard]

@btoye

LOL. Yeah, the “expert” sure likes to ramble on, but never really answers the question. Jerry Peck, with all due respect, says “Neither”??? I think both of those guys forgot about the blocking allowance.

What good would giving him the answer do if he didn’t understand WHY it was the answer?

That’s the point of the response….to “teach” inspectors to make these decisions based off verifiable and accurate information that supports their conclusions. Not speculation or voo-doo science nobody can understand (why do you think he doesn’t know in the first place?).

I answered his question in the same way I was taught….”here are the facts, you tell me”.

Contrary to popular belief, simply giving inspectors the answer teaches them nothing.

It may help pass a test, but the end result lacks substance.