Four Point Inspection Question

I received a call from an insurance agent today saying a four point inspection that I had done was rejected by their underwriter because I did not put an estimated usefull life expectancy for the plumbing system and the electrical system.
Has anybody run into this?
John Miller
PRP Home Inspections
DeLand, Florida

That’s really interesting. What insurance company is it? None of that info is a required field on the Citizens approved FABI or INACHI forms and to my knowledge there are no definative answers to those questions.

Explain to the moron that in Florida there is not a uniform 4 point inspection form and each inspector creates their own. If they wanted something specific they should have mentioned it before the inspection and you cannot read their minds and predict what they may want. Explain that it is their responsibility to tell the client of the requirements before the inspection and not after.Tell him you will gladly go back and do another inspection for him if he pays you. Do not forget to ask him how in the hell you are supposed to predict those things as each house and environmental conditions are different and there are no guidelines to go by. Then tell him you have informed your client that they should file a complaint with the OIR.

After he explains to you that all his inspectors do it tell him you will gladly do it when he sends you all of his inspections.

After all that tell him you asked your peers about it and send him a link to this and let him see what everyone else is saying.

Yes, I often run into that. Certain Carriers require that information for specific components, ie; old plumbing, electric, roof covering. How you decide to service your clients is your decision.

Never leave home without it.

No doubt, Cub scout.

There are NO DEFNITIVE ANSWERS TO THOSE QUESTIONS! So here are some non definitive answers. The copper plumbing supply lines should not be expected to remain serviceable beyond 100 years of age. The electrical components may fail within the next 60 years. Etcetera…Let them figure it out. I liked the crystal ball! No one should be cowtowing to these guys when they ask for the ridiculous. They need to be told the answers can’t be given.

Did you use the Nachi form?

Screw the Nachi form.

Why are you constantly pushing that useless waste of time?

Do you get royalties every time some fool uses it? Did you help create it or something? Be honest. It is not a 4 point inspection it is a mini home inspection. Most of the stuff on that form none of the insurance companies even care about.

Show me one person who used anything even close to that ridiculous thing 2 years ago.

How would that have helped anyway I hope the Nachi form does mot have that kind of crap in it.

Now that is some solid advice.

Unless of course you are kept in the insurance companies pocket and you kiss their a-s at every opportunity so they send you all their work.

I get no royalty. I was given that form by Gerry Beaumont years ago. He was my most trusted mentor, he never steered me wrong. I did take a class on how to do a four point many years ago. This form was approved yours, I am not to sure about.

You can love the form or hate it. I have never had one denied or kicked back. I do quality inspections, if it means me answering a few more simple questions, so be it. “Inspected once, inspected right!” How much longer does it actually take to fill-out my approved form to yours that is not approved?

Why are you afraid of going the extra step for a complete job and quality work? Seriously, why?

John M.
Use the NACHI form. it has been approved by Citizens and others.
Members on here have them available in different formats. PDF, WORD etc.
I have mine set up in “OPEN OFFICE” with auto expandable description boxes and click to enter photos. Can get you a clean copy if use OPEN OFFICE.

Because it is a waste of time and no one is requesting the information.
It also gets them accustomed to getting more than what is needed.

My form is approved as well because I have never had a problem with it. All I am ever asked for is when the electrical was updated and I do not guess unless asked.

What do you think happens when you go the extra step and report a defect?
How do you think it affects the person paying you. Or does that not matter as long as you buddies in the insurance agency keep sending you jobs?

My loyalty is to the person who pays me and I always provide accurate reports without useless extra crap top trying to justify prices above the going rate.

Any other questions?

I guess you won’t answer this one huh. “Show me one person who used anything even close to that ridiculous thing 2 years ago.”

Or are you going to use a guy that has passed away and cannot say weather you are full of crap or not?

How come none of you guys who use a normal 4 point inspection form will speak up? I personally know of 3 to 4 of you who do not use that crap. I suggest you speak up because if John has his way that crap would be the norm.

I know how my forms affect my clients, because I talk with them. I know what the underwriters and agents want, because I talk with them. My job is to give the insurance companies correct information, defect or no defect. They decided what is insurable and not insurable, not me.

So if a home has a “defect” and it is not on your form, you do not report it. How does that help the customer? They are left with an unsafe home?
Who does that help? It helps you, until someone figures out you are doing easy reports just to get more referrals.

So a TPR valve is useless extra crap?
Ungrounded homes are OK?
How about AL wire? How about PB plumbing? Are improper breakers OK?

I fully realize that not all insurance companies process this info, but it is there for them if they choose. I report, they decide. You report, we pray.

I guess you truly do not know who you work for. Still waiting on the answer about what guys were using 2 years ago.

By the way it is not a safety report it is a 4 point inspection.

You should just go work for the insurance companies full time.

Inspectors are supposed to look out for their clients not those trying to screw them.

Keep doing it you way and have fun I am just trying to show others the light. Time is money. Wasting time is wasting money. I do neither.

I guess it helps to have all those newly qualified experts that can just goosestep in line. A little bit in your pocket off of each one adds up I am sure.


Mikie…nachi 4 point form was approved by citizens in 2007

Ok. I’ll chime in, Meeker. My 4pt inspection is very thorough, but my report is very vague. The sole purpose of the 4pt inspection is to let the insurer know the level of risk they are considering.
I report the type, age, condition, and (yes) I report the approximate useful life for the roof, hvac, plumbing, and electric (when it was updated). A new roof can leak, a new fan motor can go bad, new plumbing can leak, etc. A 4PT IS FAR LESS IN SCOPE THAN A COMPLETE HOME INSPECTION. It is what it is. PB gets documented as below average condition. As does FPE panels, non-grounded panel boxes, obvious plumbing leaks, roof leaks, etc.
My experience with the NACHI form is that the agents say it’s too much info and makes the property hard to insure.
That’s my 2 cents.

Then why in the hell should anyone use it. I guess it is kind of like those 10 page wind mits I have been seeing.

I guess you cannot teach old dogs new tricks.

4 points and wind mits do not need to impress people with as many words as possible. We just need to report the facts and try to remember who our clients are.

Hello John, the only time I had one of these returned was because I forgot to put the year the item was updated. They all go by with no questions asked… I do not mind giving a little extra to the client either…