Originally Posted By: cnounnan
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http://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/usrimages/T/Taquitz_0263.jpg ]
http://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/usrimages/T/Taquitz_0263.jpg ]
Originally Posted By: jmichalski
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thanks for reducing the photos!
Originally Posted By: jpope
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The distribution panel is a Zinsco (an ugly one at that). If you are not familiar with Zinsco’s, they’re much along the lines of FPE.
Based on what I can see in the photo, replacement would be a valid recommendation.
The FPE appears to be over-fused. It looks like a 70 amp breaker which would require 4 awg copper or bigger.
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: cnounnan
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What are the signs of a Zinsco panel. How would I know in the future what to look for?
Originally Posted By: jpope
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The “colorful” breakers are one indicator.
"Blade" type bus bars are another.
The one you have pictured actually has several different generations of breakers - the large orange and blue breakers are from their original design (the oldest having copper bus bars) and the small red breakers are from their more current version (late 60's through late 70's) prior to their buy-out from Sylvania and used on up through the cross-over to GTE.
Do a search on this board for Zinsco and you find plenty of pictures and information.
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: jpope
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I just noticed that you’re from CA Chad. We are littered with Zinsco, Zinsco/Sylvania and Sylvania/GTE.
Study up, you're gonna need it. . .
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: cnounnan
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Do you have any other examples of these panel in pictures?
Originally Posted By: pabernathy
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Jeff,
Remember now that not all Zinsco panels are needing a recommendation for replacement just because they are Zinsco panels. As an electrician I have worked on quite a few of these panels and while they can be problematic and can have issues with the dead front panel the workings of a maintained Zinsco will work fine.
Now FPE has had litigation against them but I do not recall this against Zinsco and since now T & B makes replacement breakers for these older Zinsco panels my suggestion would be to reconfigure the statement.
" I suggest you have a licensed electrician evaluate the condition of this panel. It is a Zinsco panel and they do have some safety issues as a whole but this does not mean yours is included in that assumption so I recommend it be reviewed by a qualified licensed electrician. "
You can also state :
" I am also aware that a company called T & B now makes a better made and more reliable breaker that will work in the older Zinsco panel and may be an option for your licensed electrician upon evaluation."
Point is......if a seller is selling the home you make that statement without it being looked at by an electrician " JUST " because of the name of the panel and model the buyer may just opt out since the seller may not wish to pay the $ 1,500- 2,000 in upgrades so a panel that is basically fine again depending on the condition of it and how well it may or maynot have been maintained.
Just my opinion......with FPE's we have lawsuit and litigation over problems and documentation for it....not so much on Zinsco panels.
--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: jpope
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| pabernathy wrote: |
| Jeff,
Remember now that not all Zinsco panels are needing a recommendation for replacement just because they are Zinsco panels. |
I am completely aware of this Paul. Based on the condition and age of this particular panel, however, a recommendation for replacement may be in order.
The rust in the panel box indicates moisture which is particularly detrimental to the aluminum bus bars of these panels, and the different generations of breakers tells me that several have already been replaced.
The simple act of replacing these breakers scratches the antioxidant on the bus bars and helps to begin the process of deterioration.
The repair costs for Zinsco components can exceed, in some cases, the cost of a replacement panel.
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: jpope
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| cnounnan wrote: |
| Do you have any other examples of these panel in pictures? |
http://images.google.com/images?svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&q=zinsco+panel
http://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/search.php?mode=results
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: cnounnan
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Thanks Jeffery, this really helps.
Originally Posted By: jpope
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Here is the Zinsco from this morning’s inspection. . .
I did not recommend replacement of this one, but I did recommend further evaluation for several reasons other than its brand.
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: Aron Jacobs
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Jeff, Is that paint on the inside?
–
Aron Jacobs
Electrical Contractor
Electrical Instructor
North Carolina
Originally Posted By: jpope
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“Paint and/or plaster” is how I worded it. . .
To top it off, it was installed upside down
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: pabernathy
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Jeff,
Do not get me wrong here...I am just stating as an Electrician I would prefer someone like myself ( or other electrician ) make the evaluation on a Zinsco panel versus someone just saying it should be removed or upgraded.
I was not generally speaking of THAT panel per say...just in general for inspectors who may see a Zinsco panel and jump to lump it with FPE panels and this make a recommendation to replace for the wrong reasons is all....
P.S....we have reconditioned Zinsco panels in worse shape than that one and are still working fine....but we had to clean the panel well much like the one you posted may need.
Just wanted to make sure other inspectors did not just lump a Zinsco in with FPE...are Zinsco's a crappy panel...sure they are...but many that have been maintained have been working fine for many years and will continue to work fine...with a little electricians love and care....or enough money to MAKE us love and care it...lol
--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: jpope
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| pabernathy wrote: |
| Do not get me wrong here...I am just stating as an Electrician I would prefer someone like myself ( or other electrician ) make the evaluation on a Zinsco panel versus someone just saying it should be removed or upgraded. |
For the most part, I agree. I don't believe that a blaket statement of replacement is warranted for every Zinsco, however, more often than not, Zinsco panels warrant a closer look than what we can give as HI's.
--
Jeff Pope
JPI Home Inspection Service
"At JPI, we'll help you look better"
(661) 212-0738
Originally Posted By: pabernathy
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Exactly…which is why HI’s refer them to people like me…lol…so I can feed my kids…and see if I can save a life in the process…lol
Opps.....Kid..not Kids...I only have (1)
--
Paul W. Abernathy- NACHI Certified
Electrical Service Specialists
Licensed Master Electrician
Electrical Contractor
President of NACHI Central Virginia Chapter
NEC Instructor
Moderator @ Doityourself.com
Visit our website- www.electrical-ess.com
Originally Posted By: thejnicki
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Originally Posted By: Jay Moge
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is there a draft threw the panel? there’s a lot of dust. fire hazard?
Originally Posted By: thejnicki
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Panel was located in a bedroom wall, condo is 33 years old… Would the dust pose a fire hazard?? Hmmm.