Gas Fireplace

[pcanter1 (Philip F. Canter)]

Inspected a home that had converted the wood fireplace to a natural gas. The venting is the original chimney with damper. Is this proper?
Also, the gas piping runs under two doors enroute to the fireplace?
Thanks, Phil

[mlarson (Michael Larson, WI Lic. # 1672-106)]

The damper needs to be secured in at least a partial opened position.

Are there doors?

I would defer to the conversion log manufacturer’s installation instruction in any case.

There is nothing proper about that installation.

[pcanter1 (Philip F. Canter)]

Michael.
The original glass doors are also still in place. The seller agent and homeowner are “resisting” that a pro needs to come in and futher evaluate this.

[mlarson (Michael Larson, WI Lic. # 1672-106)]

Each gas log set will specify the minimum opening of the damper door.

It cannot be able to be closed completely as your picture shows.

Without the installation instructions all you can do is defer it as you have already done.

You need to put the responsibility onto the buyer or seller not yourself.

[pcanter1 (Philip F. Canter)]

Thanks!

[mlarson (Michael Larson, WI Lic. # 1672-106)]

ANSI Z21.60 requires the damper be fixed to maintain a minimum permanent net free opening of X amt. based upon the mfrs. specifications and the input BTU firing rate as stated in the code. How you achieve this is actually up to you. You can remove the damper entirely, tie the handle with wire, weld it (Mass) or use one of those clamps provided by the gas log mfr. The clamp must be located so when the damper is attempted to close, it still maintains that specified min. perm. net free opening. That means attaching it to the edge of most dampers is incorrect. I put them on the handle with the damper wide open.
ANSI also requires some sort of screen or doors. You could use mesh curtains, screen cabinet style doors or even glass doors.
All chimneys should have caps that minimize rain and animal intrusion and be stainless steel or copper. The codes don’t require caps except on chimney liners and factory built fireplaces. I unplug a lot of heater flues that have a 5 foot plug of animal nesting in them.
The gas logset should have an attached rating plate identifying the mfr. model, serial #, input BTU rate, fuel, orifice, and operating instructions as well as a listing mark from an approved testing lab. If you don’t find this info. I would recommend removal.
The fireplace and chimney should have a Level II inspection. They must be suitable for continued use burning wood in order to be acceptable for use with vented gas logs.
All the other requirements still apply such as approved gas shutoff and makeup air.

HTIN

[pcanter1 (Philip F. Canter)]

Thanks. I will copy and paste this to my client. Do you have a comment about the rusty gas piping that runs under the door?

[mlarson (Michael Larson, WI Lic. # 1672-106)]

I would not quote code myself and leave it at verification to the manufactures instructions.

If that is black iron pipe I would not have a comment.

It appears that it was once under a wood threshold that is now gone.

[pcanter1 (Philip F. Canter)]

Understand. Thanks again!!!

[ryoung7 (ROBERT YOUNG, CMI)]

If the fire place chimney has no galvanized or stainless flue liner installed after or during the retro fit of the gas fire place insert, the clay Tera-cota flue liners or double wythe walled brick degrade rapidly for the acidic exhaust.
The same goes for furnaces.
The low heat from efficient furnaces makes the chimney draw slower. Combined with the acidic exhaust, the effect will eat away the clay liners or clay brick quickly.
Expensive repair and it may also reduce the venting size.
A Bladder used to deflate after the concrete has dries is inserted into the flue of chimney cavity. Concrete is poured and a vibrator is used to insure there are no voids.
http://www.topstak.co.uk/pumice-concrete-flue-liners.php
Not the best site but I am tired.

FAQs | A Step in Time Chimney Sweeps

SUSPECT: Chimney deficiency. Liner.Safety issue.
RECOMMEND. WETT inspection.http://www.wettinc.ca/what.html
Specialized licensed chimney insert installer.
( any other notes you made . Components that are missing or broken, damaged, bent.)
Good luck.

[mlarson (Michael Larson, WI Lic. # 1672-106)]

WETT only applies top Canada

[ryoung7 (ROBERT YOUNG, CMI)]

Thanks Michel.
I will try to remember.

[pcanter1 (Philip F. Canter)]

Thanks again, gentlemen!