Originally Posted By: dsunday
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Joe,
Does that include the General Business Liability?
What is the "Fidelity Bond"
Regards,
DjSunday
Joe,
Does that include the General Business Liability?
What is the "Fidelity Bond"
Regards,
DjSunday
Originally Posted By: dsunday
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Joe,
I also see that FREA offers Group Rates - Do members of NACHI qualify for those rates?
I also see that many insurance carriers require a paragraph in your contract that limits liability to arbitration. Who uses such a paragraph. I don't think it's in the NACHI agreement. Is it used as an addendum?
Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
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Fidelity bond is money ($5,000) for your dishonest activities (like stealing). General Liability is extra, although very reasonable. The only problem with the Gen Liability, is that its not really general liability, in that it only covers you for damages which happened as a result of the HI business, and nothing else.
Termite and radon coverage is also available for an additional $350 per annum, for each rider
Cant say whether NACHI gets a group discount, although they accept NACHIs SOP, COE, and recognize it as a HI org.
Originally Posted By: rwills
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Question from Jeff R: [Bob, After you joined the IHINA, did you get an increase in inspections?]
Jeff, Not really, I've only been listed there for less than a year and got 1 or 2 from it. But for 50 bucks a year I can't complain. Unless buyers do a lot of searching before they choose a HI I doubt they could find IHINA. If you peruse my homepageyou'll see I state that the business is "Independently owned and operated!". I just want to let my clients know I'm not joined at the hip with anybody. Don't get me wrong about RE agencies either, I deal with tons of agents each week and a lot are really great to deal with, in fact, I think there's nothing wrong with doing inspections from RE referrals if they refer you because they know your good and want their client to get the best. It's the soliciting RE agencies where you set yourself up to be labeled, for instance, let's say an ageny decides to try you and the property turns out to be problematic, a good agent will understand because you have to be thorough but a lesser one will label you and blackmark you from future work. How long do you think you would last? If you were buying a home, would you want to depend on an agent referrel of a HI, knowing their commision rides on that inspection unless you knew them very well? I wouldn't. It's like asking a door to door salesman if his products are any good.
Originally Posted By: rwills
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Joe M, Still no responses from the last two posts I answered of yours! Why so curious about my IHINA membership and marketing? Just curious about your curiosity!..Bob
Originally Posted By: gbeaumont
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Hi to all, I read with interest Bob’s comments about IHINA, I too am applying for membership of that organization, and frankly do not expect it it increase my business one iota, so why do it you ask, well its simple either you belive in the goals of the organization or you do not, if you do $50:00 per annum is a cheap price to pay to support ethics you belive in.
–
Gerry Beaumont
NACHI Education Committee
e-mail : education@nachi.org
NACHI phone 484-429-5466
Inspection Depot Education
gbeaumont@inspectiondepot.com
"Education is a journey, not a destination"
Originally Posted By: rwills
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Gerry, Thanks for the interest. You’re right about the fact you either agree or you don’t! Those that look at it from an extremist point of view couldn’t be more wrong. People seem to jump the gun and think it’s an org. against realtors and it’s not. There’s just some things a HI should and should not do and the same goes for RE agents. They should both look out for the interests of their paying clients. They shouldn’t put their own goals whatever they are ahead of the client. If anyone disagrees with that whether they join or not will only find out that dishonesty doesn’t pay (in the long run that is!)…Bob
Originally Posted By: jmyers
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Bob,
Sorry, I did not mean to ignore you.
I don't really think that much of Dennis. Since my significant other is a real estate agent I just happen to know these kind of people on more of a personal level than a professional one. The agents I have come in contact with are good people, trying to make a living.
I have read through some of his web site, I am not impressed at all. I think he has made them out to be something along the line of crooks and misleading to clients just to make deals go through. I do not think is true at all. On the other side of the coin, since my significant other is a real estate agent, I have seen how a bad inspector can really make their life a living HE**. Reporting issues that do not exist. Quoting codes that are totally incorrect.
I have never had a real estate agent ask me to overlook an issue, NEVER! The agents that use me, use me because I provide a good inspection, not because they can scare me into saying whatever they want.
While I have not read the law which he claims to have pushed through the legislature, I have read the law is CRAP and totally worthless. It essentially only limits SELLER AGENTS from refering inspectors, not BUYER AGENTS, which is where most inspectors get all their work from.
Some achievement????
I was just curious about why you would associate yourself with such a radical, I am not trying to bust your buns or anything. 
Joe Myers
Originally Posted By: Nick Gromicko
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I have to agree with Joe Myers on this one. I can understand Dennis’s frustration with REALTORS especially in areas that still practice sub-agency (where every and all agents work for and owe their fiduciary duty to the seller, not the buyer). Pressuring an inspector to go soft on the seller/home can be argued to be the true DUTY of an agent working for the seller. However, in areas where buyer-agency is the norm, I see no conflict between a buyer agent and a home inspector. They both have a common client that they have to protect. An agent is helping their client navigate and negotiate thru the biggest financial deal of their lives. Buyer’s agents (every one I ever met) want good inspectors. What they don’t want is an inspector to miss defects that exist, or find defects that don’t exist. Both kill a buyer’s agent’s referral business (especially if they referred their client to the inspector). The fine line that inspectors must walk is between these two areas. Some misinterpret an agents pressure to avoid these two mistakes as a fine line between finding actual defects and writing a patty-cake report. These inspectors are wrong about this and about buyer’s agents.
I should disclose at this point that I have been a licensed REMAX agent (buyer's agent) for 12 years.
I am somewhat offended by Dennis's work but as a former inspector, I can sympathize with his impressions of agents especially sub-agency agents.
If you are worried that you are not getting work from some agents because you are too thorough, you are probably wrong and you should do the following: CALL EVERY AGENT AND EVERY CLIENT A WEEK AFTER EVERY INSPECTION AND ENCOURAGE FEEDBACK. Every business should do this. It is eye-opening and will improve your service.
What Dennis doesn't GET is the agency-principal relationship. Agents are just that. AGENTS of the buyer and represent the buyer in the real estate deal. To try to circumvent them typically goes against the wishes (and actual best interests) of the client/principal/buyer.
If you have a good home inspection service, marketing to agents is good for you, good for the agent and good for the buyer. Doing good work is good for this world. Marketing and offering your abilities to do good work helps everyone. Get out there and tell the world you do good work. Then do your best. God will bless you for it.
Nick
P.S. If someone wants to invite Dennis to post here, I would love to hear his counter-point. I like to try to see things from all sides (like inspecting a chimney).
Originally Posted By: jmyers
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Nick,
Ahh, the chimney. Since working with you I have not found any that I could push on an angle to take a picture of. 
Joe Myers
Originally Posted By: rwills
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Joe & Nick, Two very good responses and opinions. Being either in or related to someone in RE, I can see how one may take IHINA to be offensive. I personally believe it all comes down to each persons actual experiences, region, among other things. I stated before that I have met many realtors who no doubt were looking out for their (buyer) clients. They were also great people to work with in general. On the other hand I have been on inspections (quite a few), where the (buyers) agents were less than friendly, beligerent, demanding, arrogant, just to name a few. They try to avert your attention away from items during inspections, I’ve had them try to rush inspections along, argue about inspected items, walk off the site. Mostly before the client shows up or isn’t there at all. Perhaps the large competition in my area promotes such desperacy. From viewing multitudes of views on this matter, it appears to be a regional issue. I respect good agents and resent ones that are devious. I perform thorough inspections and work in the best interest of my client. Again, IHINA doesn’t say an inspector can’t accept work from agencies that may be requested by their clientele, just that it’s not a good idea to solicit directly to an agent and perhaps setting yourself up to be manipulated. You can’t tell me this doesn’t happen either! I agree that hearing Dennis’s views is only fair and will ask that he participate in the discussion…Bob
P.S. I hope everyone realizes that these are just differing matters of opinion and that no one takes offense. Without differences of opinion we wouldn’t need the board, right? Also that the different opinions doesn’t turn this into a bashing ground as I’ve seen in other boards! Thanks, Bob
Originally Posted By: ecrofutt
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I’m glad to see that y’all (we’all) can exchange opinions without the typically bashing and name calling that usually goes on in discussions of this nature.
I haven't found that it matters where I get the referral from in relationship to how a particular agent is going to act.
The agent is going to act like they always act, irregardless of how you came to be on the site. That's just how they are. Good agents are going to act good, bad agents are going to act bad, and incompetent agents are going to act incompetent. Gee, just about like any other profession.
Erby Crofutt
B4U Close Home Inspections
Georgetown, KY
www.b4uclose.net
Originally Posted By: denni
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| Joseph Myers wrote: |
| Bob,
Sorry, I did not mean to ignore you. I don't really think that much of Dennis. Since my significant other is a real estate agent I just happen to know these kind of people on more of a personal level than a professional one. The agents I have come in contact with are good people, trying to make a living. I have read through some of his web site, I am not impressed at all. I think he has made them out to be something along the line of crooks and misleading to clients just to make deals go through. I do not think is true at all. On the other side of the coin, since my significant other is a real estate agent, I have seen how a bad inspector can really make their life a living HE**. Reporting issues that do not exist. Quoting codes that are totally incorrect. I have never had a real estate agent ask me to overlook an issue, NEVER! The agents that use me, use me because I provide a good inspection, not because they can scare me into saying whatever they want. While I have not read the law which he claims to have pushed through the legislature, I have read the law is CRAP and totally worthless. It essentially only limits SELLER AGENTS from refering inspectors, not BUYER AGENTS, which is where most inspectors get all their work from. Some achievement???? I was just curious about why you would associate yourself with such a radical, I am not trying to bust your buns or anything.  Joe Myers |
Hi Joe,
Let me respond with the same post I made on The Inspection News Site.
Well,
I see there has been a little bit of discussion regarding IHINA and yours truly.
First, let me state that to the best of my knowledge, I do not have anything posted on the IHINA web site that says agents / brokers or Realtors are sleeze buckets, scum or are no good.
Second, a member of IHINA can accept agent referrals. A member of IHINA cannot actively solicit agents for client leads.
Third, I have been doing home inspections since 1982 and have never had a fight with an agent or any heated arguments with one.
Fourth, I guess I am naive, the whole buisness relationship of inspectors and agents is very clear to me. Agents work in the best interest of their client (the seller) and home inspectors work in the best interest of their client (the buyer.) I do not subscribe to the ASHI philosophy or that of the franchise companies that the job of the inspector is to help "facilate" the deal or that the home inspector has two clients the buyer and the agent.
Fifth, I cannot understand why inspectors want to spend time and energy selling themselves to agents instead of directly to their potential clients. The concept in MA is simple, the successful inspectors are those who provide a worthwhile service to their clients. It's a level playing field for the most part.
Sixth, I think it is a scary concept for many inspectors if the life rafts (agents) were removed from the inspector selection process.
Seventh, I think deep down most inspectors would like to be able to conduct their business without the control of the agents. Since the MA law went into effect, my average fee has gone from $450 to $650. We all know agents advise the potential buyers what the cost of a home inspection should be. In most cases that advice is something between $150 and $300. I have seen this info on several real estate agency web sites. Do home inspectors advise potential sellers that the real estate agent commissions are between 1% and 3%? Of course not, so why do we allow the agents to control our salaries?
Eighth, I take my job seriously, it is a hugh responsibilty with a hugh liability and we should be compensated accordingly. How many of us pay ourselves for sick time, vacations or contribute sufficiently towards our retirement? Up till now the agents have been at the top of the food chain in the real estate transaction process. I hope to change that.
Nine, I love when someone calls and offers to pay my travel and hotel costs for me and my wife. (This just happened a few days ago, a fella from Syracuse NY wanted me to travel out there. I referred him to a IHINA member out there.)
Ten, let's keep the dissusions going. I have learned a lot about inspectors and agents from across the country.
Dennis Robitaille Independent Home Inspectors Of North America
Originally Posted By: jmyers
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Dennis,
You should find your way back to the IN BB and read my reply.
Joe Myers
Originally Posted By: jmyers
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Bob,
There are many different kinds of people in this world. Not all agents are going to be the nice, easy inspection that everyone would like.
No matter what the personal quirks about agents you or anyone else has, I have never had an agent ask, imply or otherwise threaten not to use my services if I did not do something the way they wanted. It just is not a problem and this site has made it out to be one.
This would be some kind of victory if there was any justificaton for those actions but there are none.
I have met agents that we just did not click. That does not mean they are bad agents or they do not have their clients bests interests in mind and heart. Arrogant, ignorant, selfish, self-centered whatever finer qualities they may have, does that make them less than honest? I don't think so.
Bob, if you really want to get busy with agents stop making issues where they do not exist. This is exactly why agents will not use some inspectors, because they make issues where there don't exist.
Joe Myers
Originally Posted By: rwills
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Joe,
I don’t make problems where none exist, I only act on the problems I know for a fact exist. I also don’t have a problem getting work from agents that know I do a great, thorough inspection. Also from buyers that walk in and request me over the agencies (very small) list. To never have come across an agent that was obviously only worried about quickly getting that commision and not about the clients concerns only tells me that you either were damn lucky so far, or you live in that town in the TV commercial called Perfect. The only reasons I can see for HI’s to think it not fair for agents to hand out lists of ALL qualified inspectors, are, (1) the ones who live in their back pockets. (2) the ones who candy coat their reports to keep getting the work, (3) the franchises who get all the work through kickbacks. If you know your good and will get repeat business why worry about agencies handing out lists that level the field? Oh, and as stated, it does not exclude newbies or anyone else. If an inspector is qualified to do an inspection then they should be included in the list. It works both ways! if either an agent or a HI is incompetent both will weed themselves out which is why some may worry about any change!
Here’s another approach! We’re trying to gets RE offices to use a list of certified NACHI members and I’m sure we all agree with that. Isn’t that what IHINA is doing only expanding the list to all qualified inspectors?Joe Quote:“This is exactly why agents will not use some inspectors, because they make issues where there don’t exist.” maybe, but there are plenty that use inspectors because they overlook issues!
Bob W
Bob W
Originally Posted By: jmyers
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Bob,
I am sure there are some but I am also sure they are few and far between. I just happen to know a considerable amount of inspectors, all top rate inspectors, all openly solicit real estate agents, all charge top dollar for inspections, busier than you and I both could ever hope to be, NONE of them overlook issues.
Here is the challenge, find me one inspector that you say "candy coats" reports, or is in an agents back pocket. Just one, that is all I ask. I will forever give up my position and bow to you as being correct.
If you have ever taken notice, most agents do not use the office referral list which I believe you are referencing. Most bring companies with them from office to office. These people pay to be on those lists, what exactly is wrong with that. Common sense dictates that you would want to use companies that provide clients with good experiences and there in nothing wrong with making a list of companies that you know are honest, reliable and offer the client the service they want. I post companies on my web site which offer these services, only I do it for free. If they choose to charge that is their business, not mine.
How many inspectors do you know? How many agents do you know? Now how many of these inspectors and agents are in the position you are so amicable about fighting for? I am willing to bet it is ZERO. That is exactly what I mean, making an issue where it does not exist.
BTW... When an agent is in doubt about what to do, they ask me a simple question. What would you want if you were buying this property. I give them an honest answer, no need to sugar coat.
Joe Myers
Originally Posted By: denni
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Joe,
You asked for one example. Here is one for you. The entire document must be read.
http://www.lawlibrary.rutgers.edu/courts/appellate/a6252-99.opn.html Realtor Friendly Inspection Company Sued
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Originally Posted By: Nick Gromicko
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Dennis:
I just can't thank you enough for coming on the message board and sharing with us. I have a lot of respect for anyone who fights an uphill battle. You're willingness to help us see that other side "of the chimney" earns you even more of my respect.
My own bias (as a REALTOR) blinds me sometimes. Please visit often.
Nick
PS I may have caught the great grammar/spellchecker Erby Crofutt. His post above used the word irregardless (isn't it just regardless?). Send me $15. Hee Hee.
Originally Posted By: ecrofutt
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! Guess I didn’t realize I could be so opinonated.
Erby Crofutt
B4U Close Home Inspections
Georgetown, KY
www.b4uclose.com