NACHI lowballer loses 3 times.

General Inspection Topics General Inspection Discussion
41

Roy:

"I have no Idea why the realtor was banned but if he does a good inspection and is now honerable should he not be allowed to make a living at some thing."

This gent walked into the HI field because he has no other skills to get a job with but he can always be a home inspector. He was a political creature (and we know how truthful they all can be) and there were no jobs open there! He is not a member of any organization and no one knows of any background in the construction industry.

So, as I tell many of my customers: "If you can say the words “Home Inspector”, then you are one- no legislation and controls. Get a ladder, flashlight and cards…cost= $300.00. That simple. As I said in another post, I was finding 1-3 new certified HI’s every week for a while in the Maritimes.

I fear for the public in the next few years- there was question on this board from one of our newer Maritime HI’s a few months back about “How to test a sump pump?” If this is the level of knowledge that is being foisted on the public, the overloaded courts will have more coming at them.

42

"Still…licensing solves nothing"

Licensing will at least solve the problem of anyone with little or no credentials getting into a field that is very technical and involves **most individuals biggest investment. **Where have I seen that last hilighted phrase before…Oh!! In many HI Ads!!! We seem to want to emphasize this and scare them into rushing to us but don’t want to seriously control ourselves at the same level as other professionals such as the lawyers or even the licensed trades such as electrician, plumber, gasfitter, etc. If we consider our services comparable in importance, then control should not scare us …or does it?? Will some of us not make it through more stringent scrutiny??

Remember that the above mentioned trades/professions take 3-4-5+ years to become suitably trained to work on your own? Why can people walk into the HI field?

43

Brian,

If you want to live in a “nanny state” that’s your choice.
But please don’t insist that I must also.:slight_smile:

44

Brian’s concern is not for the consumer, as he projects. He is simply another one of the many home inspectors who wish to have the government implement their marketing plan and eliminate the “unworthy” competitor.

It is not that there is an underqualified home inspector in his province…it is the fact that the underqualified home inspector is getting business that he feels would otherwise go to him. Eliminate the inspector and increase sales…and look like a concerned citizen in the process.

Same story…different zip code.

45

"Sometimes I wonder if those who support ever expanding regulation(not just HI) truly understand what freedom is.:sad:"

As society gets more complex, it will need more regulation, not less. If there were no HI"s, there would be no need for regulation. Case closed!! We regulate cars, driving, drinking, drugs, housebuilding, doctors,…Oh!! Way to much stuff. Let’s get rid of it. We’d have to let fights in our professional sports go until someone was carried away on a stretcher. Now we have a real winner!!!

In the past when we were simple people with a poorly developed sense of fairness, equality and freedom, we had slaverery (that was alright, was it/); women wouldn’t be able to be engineers, lawyers, presidents, HI’s; Women should be at home, right.

If you leave it for men and women to make their own rules without a system of regulation run by consensus, we’d be in a hell of a mess. what about cloning? Can someone steal your DNA and clone your parts for sale (because you’re a great specimen)? There ought to be a law against that (and I don’t think there is yet!).

I have lots of freedom: If I don’t like being an HI, I can choose another job. If I don’t like being an HI where I live now, I can move (note: this is my second location for working in the HI field; my Canadian social system didn’t provide me with $$$ for life when the economy and construction fields in my former area went quite dead in the early 90’s…so I moved). I don’t know how you feel you’re losing your basic freedoms!!! They are all protected in your constitution and amendments. Everyone says what they want to on this board (we’re all being honest, aren’t we?).

The most recent place where I feel my freedoms have been encroached on is right here with this organzation!!! It’s membership is going to be capped at 10,000. Why not allow everyone who wants to be an HI in NACHI, the best of organizations, to join? As Roy has said a few times: clean up home first!

46

“Inspectors” who have to ask how to check out a sump pump shouldn’t be inspectors. This is the crowd that makes E&O insurance so expensive. Think about this. Common sense and a very basic level of knowledge should suffice for a person to figure out for himself how to check a sump pump. Around here, probably about 1 in 500 homes has one, but I will bet that all inspectors here know how to check them out for operation. Why? because a guy who doesn’t have a clue about this would have been weeded out by Mississippi’s licensing process in the beginning. No way could such a person pass the required test. The realities of the market are subtly different in different areas of the country, but I think we all know that there is a market for such “fool” inspectors…that market being referrals from shady realtors who want a soft inspection in order to make a commission. The realtor can always find a way to plead innocence if something comes up, and the inspector is caught by what he has written in his report. Does that put him out of business? Not if he can continue to get enough gross and pay his E&O premiums. But in THIS state, he wouldn’t be in business in the first place. I realize that the testing procedures and educational requirements of most licensing reflect only basic knowledge. They are a joke to experienced people. But they do serve to weed out the inexperienced wannabees who are able to hang out their signs in too many places.

47

Then…we can agree that…if in any licensed state there is a home inspector who does not know how to check a sump pump…licensing has failed? Is this correct?

48

One of the most amusing things about people arguing for licensing is how it is always the “other guy” that needs to be controlled by the state. Sometimes I laugh myself to tears as I read this stuff.

49

James Bushart:

"It is not that there is an underqualified home inspector in his province…it is the fact that the underqualified home inspector is getting business that he feels would otherwise go to him. Eliminate the inspector and increase sales…and look like a concerned citizen in the process."

James:

Only part of my business comes from pre-purchase home inspections. I do litigation, training, energy consulting/audits (have a current contract with gov’t on 75 buildings), residential enviromental work, and a little side business of energy retrofits for housing. (this I don’t advertise- my work sells itself; presently I’m booked for the late summer /fall- 3 months ahead of last year.) My work life is quite varied and interesting. Presently, I could go back into the energy retrofit, roofing, siding etc type of company I used to run (have been asked a few times- Why don’t I?)

I don’t care how many HI’s there are: most of my work comes from referrals (see below) and my website. I have only 1 real estate agent (out of 600-1200) that recommends me- the guy that sold me my house when I moved here 15 years ago (gave me 3 inspections last week). My inspections are thorough and accurate and take longer than others (agents hate this and they have more negotiation to do). I work above any SOP’s that I know of (eg. I do oil furnace efficiency tests; test 80-100% of receptacles, analyze HRV’s (a larger franchisor here reports “an air exhanger was noted”

(****In the past 3 weeks I have inspected for an engineer, a carpenter, an electrician, a contractor’s son, 2 firemen, a building official, a professional timber framer. All of these have come from others and the website- its seems those on the inside of the building field recommend me when they can. I don’t have any worries about the business loss. Many have commented that I am overqualified for the field; it’s better to be overqualified than under!!!)

By the way, I have have very high working principles: In 1992, I left the highest paying job of my career- set up and managed an indoor air quality and air balancing subsidiary for a mechanical engineering firm (charge out rate of $750/day) - due to a “poisoned” atmosphere (overcharge gov’t; if you weren’t white and male, need i go farther)

I will survive, no problem.

The other organizations I am aware of have no limits to membership that I know of except higher standards (still not high enough, in my opinion) to become certified. Anyone with the brains and GOYA mentality can still become a certified member in these orgs, but just not overnight.

50

Goverment “lives” to do “good”. Just ask any politician.

They do so so much “good” that they have to take an ever increasing portion of cash from my pocket and put it in someone elses. All to do said “good” with.

Unless regulation of HIs really sovles a problem it is nothing more than a burdensome law that takes a little more freedom away. IMHO

51

"Unless regulation of HIs really sovles a problem it is nothing more than a burdensome law that takes a little more freedom away. IMHO"

Michael:
You don’t think the fact that someone can walk into this field untrained and set up a business is not a problem??? I and millions of the public think it is!! I have not had a negative response from a customer that was told about the unregulated nature of this profession- all are surprisd to shocked and say it should be!!!

For Roy:

This AM as I told the story about the banned agent that is now an HI, I stopped short of telling more because I forgot its source and only remembered part of the story. That got cleared up 2 hours ago when I went to make a deposit at our local, semi-rural bank (I’m 42 km out of downtown here). It was from one of the tellers at the bank that I had never been served by until 2 months ago. While making a deposit, she noticed I ran an HI business and quickly brought the HI’s name up. What I have is still second hand but very close to source- her husband and other family members.

He and a brother had a long running construction company doing quite well. They hired this guy to be comptroller/bookkeeper as he’s married into the family. Things were alright for a few years and suddenly the successful company became insolvent. Guess who had been cooking the books while stealing the $$- Mr. Now I’m An HI. Since he was in the family, he was not hauled into court and has no record; the brothers are starting over again as they are both good carpenters.

Next he becomes a real estate agent- commissions and rental monies from a few properties he became overseer for (absentee owners in Florida for the winter) then went missing. Guess what? He’s pilfering again!! Gets banned-for-life and now is an HI. The teller recounted another story which involved Xmas $$ for booze and gifts that went missing as an unknowing family member entrusted him with it.

This is not the kind of person we should have in this industry. When will he be taking side money for easy inspections wanted by brokers or paying brokers for referrals? Maybe criminal checks are in order when we get regulated!! I’m all for it!

We want to be professionals so let’s act like them.

52

We are, Brian.

Most of us are able to do that without having a politician tell us how and that is why we successfully fend off efforts such as those you endorse.

My state licenses barbers…and people still get bad haircuts.

My city licenses dogs…but they still lick each other’s butts and drink from the toilet bowl.

Licensing solves nothing.

53

YEP…
Can you imagine working for a company that has a little more than 300
employees and has the following statistics?

30 have been accused of spousal abuse.
9 have been arrested for fraud
14 have been accused of writing bad cheques.
95 have directly or indirectly bankrupted at least 2 businesses.
4 have done time for assault.
55 cannot get a credit card due to bad credit.
12 have been arrested on drug related charges.
4 have been arrested for shoplifting.
16 are currently defendants in lawsuits.
62 have been arrested for drunk driving in the last year!

Can you guess which organization this is?
.

**It is the 301 MP’s in the Canadian Parliament! **
**The same group that cranks out hundreds of new laws designed to keep
the rest of us in line?!

Which one did you vote for?

**

**TAKEN FROM THE OTTAWA CITIZEN
**

54

Brian, I don’t care what profession you talk about, there will always be unprofessional, untrained, unscroupulous, uncaring, unconscionable people within that industry. To name a few
Doctors
Lawyers
Dentists
Contractors
Car repairs/salesman
Realtors
Accountants
CEOs
CFOs

Most on this list require licensing but do we still hear horror stories from all of the above, YUP!!!

55

PS

I forgot one.

Home inspectors!!!

Licensing does not create or weed out the bad one’s. Informed consumers do.

56

I don’t know who said this but it’s right on the money!!!

You get the government you deserve.

I didn’t vote for anyone in this and the past 3-4 parliaments. My candidates lost.

But when you do get honest people who want to do good up in Ottawa (and probably Washington for that matter), they get tramped on. One of my best high school friends got elected in the first Mulroney gov’t. In 1985, I attended a large building conference (Avoiding Mistakes; Learning from Experience; put on by NRC, CMHC, RAIC, BOMA) and stayed with him. He had a stripped down, bare apartment, 7 blocks from the hill so he could walk to work. I slept on a futon on the floor.

After going out to dinner, we went back to the apartment, talking until 4 AM. He had only been there for a year or so but was quite disappointed how things ran. He would not bend to the behind the scenes goings on so he was being ostrasized a bit. About 6 months later he was being interviewed on CBC radio about the possibility of crossing the floor. In the second Mulroney gov’t with the largest majority in Canadian history, he was not re-elected because the central party hacks would not give him any support like sending high profile cabinet ministers to speak in his riding.

Maybe it was the best thing for him. We live in different provinces now (he in NB and me in NS) but, by chance, I ran into him at a car rental shop here last fall. Asked him why he was returning a rental car in my area. He’d rented the car to get around town as he’d brought his Porsche in for servicing! Doing better out of gov’t I’d say!!!

If you don’t get involved in the process, it goes down the drain. So we have no one to blame but ourselves. We are the government and have the ability to change it. Remember- it is a free country (except for a certain group that if you were lucky to slip in early, you’ve got it made)

It can’t be true that there are only 10,000 persons in the world with enough brains to be NACHI HI’s. What’s up with that? Are there different levels of freedom with some being more free than others?

57

My licensed dog just ate a dead bird. Sometimes, he eats his own vomit. Just think if he were an unlicensed dog. Jeez. I’d have to shoot him.

58

No, James, the pound would have to put him down when he was caught out running around loose without a tag and they couldn’t track down an owner. The license money goes to offset the cost of the catchers and pound.

59

I know a little of what your buddy went through.
I tried it with ASHI north and found out how they are no different then my last post.
Joined NACHI and it has been full speed ahead.
I look forward till you too are a NACHI member and can also see how well all are treated.
I have never been sorry I left the Canadian Association having served on various committees and having lots of friends I see how bad it is and how great NACHI is .

The returns are great and the cost is small.

60

When I first started doing home inspections in 1995 as a sub contractor for The Building Inspector of America franchise, anyone remember it? I was encouraged to become a member of ASHI in fact I was a candidate member and nothing with them has changed. They wanted me to pay allot of money and jump through hoops and I was just not interested.

Everybody’s time is so valuable today, who has the time to jump through hoops, even newbies have a better chance for education at NACHI.