Outlet in closet??

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1

Originally Posted By: aleleika
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Outlet in closet )


( Image: White Dress near outlet )

( Image: Light fixture )

( Image: Another Light fixture )

--
A. Dan Leleika
www.a-teamhomeinspections.com

2

Originally Posted By: bsumpter
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I don’t see anything in Code Check about a box in the closet, but there are very specific requirements regarding mounting and support of metal boxes. But the lights need to be guarded or replaced. If the contents of the closet come in contact with the hot bulb a fire could result.


JT or JP will be able to help you more...sorry!

--
"In the fields of observation, chance favors only the mind that is prepared"

Louis Pasteur

3

Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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Electrical defects to numerous to mention, call upon a licensed electrical contractor.


Dan:

I must talk to you personally, you have found some serious issues here!

You were very wise to ask for an expert opinion, I will await to hear from you.

Call me anytime!

![icon_twisted.gif](upload://xjO326gspdTNE5QS3UTl0a0Rtvy.gif)

--
Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm

4

Originally Posted By: aleleika
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.


Joe,


Is it too late to call on the east coast right now?

--
A. Dan Leleika
www.a-teamhomeinspections.com

5

Originally Posted By: rbrown1
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Joe,


Why not post the issues you are talking about on here. That way we all have a chance to learn something.

Wouldn't that make sense?

--
Bob Brown
President NACHI Du-Ka Chapter ON. Canada
NACHI Cell: 1-484-429-5465

ACISS Home Inspections
bob@aciss.biz

Certified Adult Training Services
www.certifiedadulttrainingservices.com
info@certifiedadulttrainingservices.com

6

Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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rbrown1 wrote:
Joe,

Why not post the issues you are talking about on here. That way we all have a chance to learn something.

Wouldn't that make sense?


Bob:

Yes, but I want to talk to Dan and then he will post it, my words are not clear to some, why I have been told in the last few days that I have no clue as to what a HI does when Inspecting .. !

--
Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
7

Originally Posted By: rbrown1
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.


aaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhh I see.


Ok, will await the outcome.

--
Bob Brown
President NACHI Du-Ka Chapter ON. Canada
NACHI Cell: 1-484-429-5465

ACISS Home Inspections
bob@aciss.biz

Certified Adult Training Services
www.certifiedadulttrainingservices.com
info@certifiedadulttrainingservices.com

8

Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.


The major problem is the bare bulb in a clothes closet. Totally wrong. You can have enclosed bulb fixtures if they are a foot away, laterally, from the “storage space”. (shelf and hanging rod).


The rule is really get more complicated than that but a quick rule of thumb is you want a foot of free space from the falling “broken bulb” zone and it still needs to be enclosed.


There is nothing wrong with having a receptacle. In high end houses around here the burglar alarm box is isually in the master closet, cord and plug connected.

These are the real "Clothes closet" rules ... confused yet? Join the club.

From the 2002 NEC, handbook commentary in italics

410.8 Luminaires (Fixtures) in Clothes Closets.
(A) Definition.
Storage Space. The volume bounded by the sides and back closet walls and planes extending from the closet floor vertically to a height of 1.8 m (6 ft) or the highest clothes-hanging rod and parallel to the walls at a horizontal distance of 600 mm (24 in.) from the sides and back of the closet walls, respectively, and continuing vertically to the closet ceiling parallel to the walls at a horizontal distance of 300 mm (12 in.) or the width of the shelf, whichever is greater; for a closet that permits access to both sides of a hanging rod, this space includes the volume below the highest rod extending 300 mm (12 in.) on either side of the rod on a plane horizontal to the floor extending the entire length of the rod.
FPN:See Figure 410.8.
The 24-in. rule is intended to cover the clothes-hanging space, even if no clothes-hanging rod is installed. If a clothes-hanging rod is installed, the space extends from the floor to the top of the highest rod. If no clothes-hanging rod is installed, the space extends from the floor to a height of 6 ft.
In addition to the space in which clothing will be hung from the closet pole or rod, this requirement also establishes a 12-in. wide shelf space to cover those installations where shelving is not in place at the time of fixture installation. If shelving is installed and the shelves are wider than 12 in., the greater width must be applied in establishing this space.
The storage space for closets that permit access to both sides of the clothes-hanging rod is based on a horizontal plane extending 12 in. from both sides of the rod, from the rod down to the floor. This equates to the 24-in. space required for the closet rod where there is only one direction of access.

![](upload://qzBlrNz4nUhoodEJid6CpqF2fYQ.jpeg)

(B) Luminaire (Fixture) Types Permitted. Listed luminaires (fixtures) of the following types shall be permitted to be installed in a closet:
(1) A surface-mounted or recessed incandescent luminaire (fixture) with a completely enclosed lamp
(2) A surface-mounted or recessed fluorescent luminaire (fixture)
(C) Luminaire (Fixture) Types Not Permitted. Incandescent luminaires (fixtures) with open or partially enclosed lamps and pendant luminaires (fixtures) or lampholders shall not be permitted.
See the commentary following 410.8(D)(3).
(D) Location. Luminaires (fixtures) in clothes closets shall be permitted to be installed as follows:
(1) Surface-mounted incandescent luminaires (fixtures) installed on the wall above the door or on the ceiling, provided there is a minimum clearance of 300 mm (12 in.) between the luminaire (fixture) and the nearest point of a storage space
(2) Surface-mounted fluorescent luminaires (fixtures) installed on the wall above the door or on the ceiling, provided there is a minimum clearance of 150 mm (6 in.) between the luminaire (fixture) and the nearest point of a storage space
(3) Recessed incandescent luminaires (fixtures) with a completely enclosed lamp installed in the wall or the ceiling, provided there is a minimum clearance of 150 mm (6 in.) between the luminaire (fixture) and the nearest point of a storage space
The requirement in 410.8(D)(3) results from tests that have shown that a hot filament falling from a broken incandescent lamp can ignite combustible material below the luminaire in which the lamp is installed.
(4) Recessed fluorescent luminaires (fixtures) installed in the wall or the ceiling, provided there is a minimum clearance of 150 mm (6 in.) between the luminaire (fixture) and the nearest point of a storage space
Note that the clearance measurement for each requirement in 410.8(D) is to the luminaire and not to the lamp itself.
It is not mandatory to install a luminaire in a clothes closet; if one is installed, however, the conditions for installation are as required by 410.8(D).
The requirements of 410.8(D) apply to incandescent and fluorescent lighting in clothes closets of various kinds of occupancies. The requirement is intended to prevent hot lamps or parts of broken lamps from coming in contact with boxes, cartons, blankets, and the like, stored on shelves, and clothing hung in closets.

9

Originally Posted By: Greg Fretwell
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.


** off topic alert


I am sending a proposal to add LED lights to 410.8(D) since they are not currently in the article as permitted types. An LED could probably be NRTL evaluated as a “safe” light within the storage space since it could be a sealed unit that runs at very close to ambient room temperature and not constitute an ignition source.


My thought is if you make it legal they will come.

10

Originally Posted By: Jay Moge
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.


“off topic reply” let’s not forget that an LED is technical a Light Emitting Diode, and could be argued as a diode and not a “light”. my thoughts? if it looks like a light, acts like a light and smells like a light, it must be a light. a lot of the codes were set when “incandescent” was the only light therefore I’d agree with you. icon_wink.gif

11

Originally Posted By: James D Mosier
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On the outlet box it seems that the receptacles are lacking a cover.


It is nice to se that they have purchased a fire escape ladder, too bad they keep it where the fire is very likely to originate.

--
Jim Mosier

12

Originally Posted By: escanlan
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Dan,


Don't forget to add this:

"Highly recommend installing noted "Kiddie Fire Escape Ladder" in preparation" ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif) ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif) ![icon_lol.gif](upload://zEgbBCXRskkCTwEux7Bi20ZySza.gif)

--
Manny (Emmanuel) Scanlan

Knowledge is power, but sharing knowledge brings peace!

13

Originally Posted By: mboyett
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.




14

Originally Posted By: wdecker
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The no circuit breaker panel in clothes closet one is real hard to enforce here. I see it all the time, write it up and get called by the seller’s electrician who curtly informs me that I have no idea what I am talking about. The seller’s all refuse to move the panel and the buyers still buy the house.


Oh well. At least I covered my glutius maximus.

--
Will Decker
Decker Home Services
Skokie, IL 60076
wjd@DeckerHomeServices.com

15

Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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NEC rule since 1981 Code


Quote:
Not in Vicinity of Easily Ignitible Material

Overcurrent devices shall not be located in the vicinity of easily ignitible material, such as in clothes closets.

Examples of locations where combustible materials may be stored are linen closets, paper storage closets, and clothes closets.

Also:

Not Located in Bathrooms In dwelling units and guest rooms or guest suites of hotels and motels, overcurrent devices, other than supplementary overcurrent protection, shall not be located in bathrooms.


--
Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant

www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
16

Originally Posted By: wdecker
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I know this, Joe. It just seems that most of the electricians that seller’s hire don’t. Nor do most of the builders.

–
Will Decker


Decker Home Services


Skokie, IL 60076


wjd@DeckerHomeServices.com