Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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This is the disconnect for an air conditioning unit.
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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
This is the disconnect for an air conditioning unit.
Originally Posted By: jpeck
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First and foremost is the lack of required working space.
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Jerry Peck
South Florida
Originally Posted By: psisler
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I agree with Jerry. The, as I see it should be placed in an area that is free and clear to be able to access it in an emergency etc… Like an adjoining wall.
Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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Do you think that the disconnect is “readily accessible”
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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
Originally Posted By: ekartal
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No, I think it should be accessible facing the home.
Erol Kartal
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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It is not allowed to be on the AC.
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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| Mike Parks wrote: |
| It is not allowed to be on the AC.
Mike P. |
The disconnecting means is permitted to be installed on or within the air-conditioning or refrigerating equipment.
Also, make sure that the disconnecting means is not located on panels that are designed to allow access to the air-conditioning or refrigeration equipment.
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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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How can the unit be replaced with the disconnect mounted to it?
Removing the disconnect would require working on live equipment (OSHA).
How would you comply with the motor disconnecting means?
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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PS this is the same logic for not allowing a disconnect on a mobile home.
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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Mike:
According to the descriptions posted on your website, you are a Certified IAEI Electrical Inspector, etc.
I often wonder were you get the thoughts that you post, most of which are on the negative side of the discussion.
I cannot understand why you continue to question the posts that are made here where facts are provided.
Again, you are allowed, according to the NEC to apply the rule that permits the disconnect to be installed on the unit.
Mobile homes and OSHA are not being discussed here.
Please do me a favor, sit down and write a 25 question true or false quiz and post it, that would make a lot better use of your time.
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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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OK
Here is a quick one.
When is a supplemental ground rod required. Assuming the 2002 NEC.
A Always
B Never
C Sometimes.
D When no water line electrode is present.
I only respond so that erroneous information is not spread.
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: jtedesco
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| Quote: |
| I only respond so that erroneous information is not spread. |
What have you found here in this post that is inaccurate, incorrect, or wrong?
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Joe Tedesco, NEC Consultant
www.nachi.org/tedescobook.htm
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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Joe
These are not personal attacks. These (my posts) are conversation.
I disagree with allowing disconnects on equipment. I think that we all agree that the code is poorly written in some areas.
I am just 'trying' to bring the 'common sense' issue to the fore front.
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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The correct answer is B.
A supplemental ground rod is never required.
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: Mike Parks
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As a side note:
I try not to edit my posts unless someone will be harmed from my opinion.
And I openly acknowledge my mistakes.
http://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/viewtopic.php?t=4672
Mike P.
Originally Posted By: jpeck
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Joe,
Assuming the a/c condenser unit is on the ground (not up in a tree or up on a deck) and then adding in the required working space already referred to (if that were done), then, yes it would be readily accessible.
However, because it does not have the required working space (which would make it readily accessible) so it is not readily accessible as it now is.
Correcting the main problem, the lack of required working space, would make this readily accessible, so that is a secondary issue, which is corrected by correcting the primary issue (working space).
Now, as to the disconnect on the unit, I was going to address than second, becuase it is (I feel) not the "first and foremost" thing wrong.
It is, as you stated allowed on or within the a/c unit, however, it is not allowed on access panels. The following is directly from the 2002 NEC Analysis of Changes CD (it's also in the book of the same).
I was going to add the graphics in line, but because it is a little large, I added it as a link for dial up users.
[ Image: http://www.nachi.org/bbsystem/usrimages/more/2002_NEC_AC_disconnect_at_CU.jpg ]
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Jerry Peck
South Florida
Originally Posted By: jpeck
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| Mike Parks wrote: |
| The correct answer is B.
A supplemental ground rod is never required. Mike P. |
C. Sometimes
With a qualification.
It is the word "never" which makes the difference. Never is all inclusive, and your specific reference to asking about a "ground rod" is why you choose B, however, Supplemental Electrodes are required in some cases, and ground rods are one of the options to use for that REQUIRED supplemental electrode. Thus, there are times when the only available option may be the driven ground rod, and, being required (if it is within that requirement) that makes a supplemental ground rod "required" in that specific case. Maybe one shot in a million, but there is the possibility that all conditions could lead to that end.
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Jerry Peck
South Florida
Originally Posted By: Ryan Jackson
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Mike: 440.14 says that you can put the disco on the unit.
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Ryan Jackson, Salt Lake City
Originally Posted By: jpeck
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| Ryan Jackson wrote: |
| Mike: 440.14 says that you can put the disco on the unit. |
Ryan,
Yes and no (as shown in my previous post above).
440.14 Location.
Disconnecting means shall be located within sight from and readily accessible from the air-conditioning or refrigerating equipment. The disconnecting means shall be permitted to be installed on or within the air-conditioning or refrigerating equipment.
The disconnecting means shall not be located on panels that are designed to allow access to the air-conditioning or refrigeration equipment
That last statement pretty much limits *where* on the equipment it can be mounted to those areas which are non-removable or are removable but does not provide access to the equipment (which is going to be hard to do - have a removable panel which does not provide access to the equipment, that's why it is removable, it's designed to provide access to that part of the equipment).
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Jerry Peck
South Florida
Originally Posted By: Ryan Jackson
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I realize that Jerry, I was trying to give Mike a reference as to where it is addressed in an effort to rebut his blanket statement of not permitted.
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Ryan Jackson, Salt Lake City