Completed a 4 Point inspection today, All wiring for 120V was copper wiring. I observed aluminum wiring on 240V Stove Circuit. I want to know if this still has to be reported that I observed aluminum wiring in the panel or is this only aluminum wiring on a 120V 15-20amp circuit.
I want to say this is only for 120V 15-20 amp circuit. Please let me know.
The insurance companies are worried about solid strand going to appliances.
So, single strand aluminum branch circuits would be Yes??? It weird I reading on the internet and alot of people were stating that aluminum wiring on 120v 15-20A circuit bad and 220V Circuits are ok?
I know that insurance companies hate aluminum wiring, but i don’t want this insured to get canceled or not be able to get insurance because of something i put, when this would be ok.
Just report what you see. Get paid upon arrival so you do not get screwed. If there is a solid conductor going from the panel to the stove or whatever report it. If it is multi strand then I would like to say do not mention it but that would be wrong. I would write in big caps MULTI strand not Single strand and hope they did not get the normal underwriters that do not know their a s s from a hole in a panel… I always have on my 4 point cover my phone number and times I take calls and email address with instructions for anyone with questions to call. That is the best I can do.
Also get what you think you can on each 4 point I do not lkist that price and feel out each customer individually. I have lately been getting $150 per 4 point. I sell the fact I do it on a citizens form compared to those who may not and I also push I am a CMI. In otherwords I NEVER bundle them and NEVER give a discounter “well almost” price when doing them with mits.
PEOPLE MUST get them and so many fools are doing them for pennies because of the big box companies but if we all always said $150 that would become the norm. Just my 2 cents.
Per our licensed master electrician kitchen ranges are the only circuits still permissable to be wired on single strand aluminum per Florida Electric Code. Must be at least on a 60 amp breaker. You’re welcome to call him for verification if you don’t believe me. Just PM me.
You still have to mention it. As that is the info they want to know. I just report conditions. What the insurance companies do is not my issue.
Thank you for the info, I believe you. Just wanted to double check before I submit.
Why is everyone worried over whether a client gets insurance or has to make upgrades. Many times you are doing them a favor by showing them what is wrong.
Also, we do not make anyone do an upgrade or deny them insurance. It is the insurance company that does that. We just are supposed to report accurately.
Interesting, considering that would take a #6 AL wire. I don’t believe a solid #6 AL is even available.
Multi-strand AL wiring for larger appliances is ok and not usually mentioned in a report. If you do find solid conductor AL wiring, note it and ask the owner if it has ever been repaired at the outlets with approved methods. Some insurance companies won’t accept “solid” AL wiring at all, even after repairs. Some will…
Single strand(solid) Aluminum wire is what the insurance companies are looking for. Even the power companies use multi-strand AL wires. The issues are not with the wires but with junctions. Typically multi-strand AL wires to appliances do not have junctions.
That sure looks like multi strand conductors to me in that picture.
Aluminum wiring in a 4 point
Here it is in writing from Citizens;
*Thank you for allowing us the opportunity to review and respond to the concerns raised by Mr. Nick Hernandez regarding Citizens’ policy on aluminum wiring.
The first item I would like to provide for him is an excerpt from our Homeowners’ Rules of Practice Manual, as seen below.
Rule 7. UNINSURABLE PROPERTIES
The following risks may not be insured in Citizens Personal Lines (All Perils). DO NOT SUBMIT:
K. Heating And Electrical
- Properties, which have a portable heater or open flame as a primary source of heat, (e.g., electric, oil or kerosene portable space heater, gas heater, or any device utilizing an open flame).
Exception: Permanent and factory or professionally installed, central gas, fireplaces or wood burning stove heat systems.
Properties, which contain any potentially hazardous electrical conditions, knob & tube or aluminum branch wiring circuits.
Properties equipped with electrical service less than 60 amps.
Exception: If approved by a Florida licensed electrician, licensed journeyman electrician, or municipal building inspector within the last five (5) years.
Our industry research shows most insurance companies do not write aluminum wiring or they require the update of electrical wiring within the last 20 years. Effective August 1, 2010, Citizens amended our electrical rules to clarify that homes with aluminum branch wiring circuits, as well as knob and tube wiring, are not eligible for coverage. The aluminum branch wiring circuits referenced in the rule is provided to address the risk of overheating and fire from a single-strand (#10 or #12 AWG [American Wire Gauge]) solid aluminum wiring that is connected to the lower branch circuits that occurred predominantly in the 1970’s and before. Most modern homes have some aluminum wiring such as main service (trunk) wires and heavier 240-volt aluminum wiring that feed many major appliances and air conditioning units. This higher voltage multi-strand aluminum wiring does not present the same risk as the single-strand aluminum circuit wiring, which is why we clarified our rule to be specific to branch wiring circuits.
We ask that professional inspector’s document on the inspection report the presence of any aluminum wiring found during the inspection. Our underwriters will make risk eligibility decisions based upon the specific aluminum wiring hazard clarification provided above.
We hope this information allows you to respond to the inquiry received from Mr. Hernandez. However, please do not hesitate to let me know if there is any further clarification needed.
Citizens Insurance, Customer Correspondence*
From Citizen’s letter above:
"We ask that professional inspector’s document on the inspection report the presence of any aluminum wiring found during the inspection. Our underwriters will make risk eligibility decisions based upon the specific aluminum wiring hazard clarification provided above. "
Yet in their own form, they only seem interested in single strand and remediations:
So, going off their** 4 PT form & letter**, would that include:
A) reporting on all visible wiring including SEC, multistrand and single strand
B) just ALL aluminum branch wiring
C) just solid branch wiring
report all with notes. the four point asks for any aluminum wiring. Add a note that it is stranded and on 220 and allowed by the NEC. that should solve all probems
I have never come across 6 AWG single strand aluminum wire.
Stranded AL. is Ok and it is recommended that there be an anti-oxidant present.
Noting multi-strand AL wiring only creates problems…
Where can I find a copy of the “Florida Electric Code”?
I submitted the letter for reference purposes. You can certainly do what you feel is best for you and/or your client. Happy Inspecting !