Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
What is your thoughts on the ends of the beams having no support to keep them from twisting. I think they could add a 2x10 on the ends of each of the beams and toenail them into the other beam to create some stability. Probably won’t go anywhere but not great framing to begin with. The beams are a triple 2x10 on a 32’ wide home supporting 2 floors and a roof. Not a problem if your columns are only 5’8" apart but here they were anywhere from 10 to 13’ apart and you can see the sagging in the beams.
I know this is beyond the scope of the "home inspector", I just wanted to bring this to the table for a good technical discussion.....Please don't waste your replies telling me this is not our job, I already know that. Thoughts??
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jeff,
Are you for real dude?  This is not our job, we are just there to report visual observations!
BTW...I don't think it would hurt to toenail some more headers to those boards. I don't really see the sagging you are suggesting, can you be a little more specific? Where?
It does not look like that long of a distance for 3, 2 X 10's. The one support post should be moved, you can see the post support is pushing it up into the floor joists since there is no joist there for it to rest on, at the end of course. The other looks fine.
10 to 13 feet does not sound all that far for this much lumber.
Jeff, Jeff, Jeff....what were you thinking when you posted this?
Originally Posted By: ltrower This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jeff,
The support post on the left looks to me like there is a list from port to starboard. (I am a former Marine too) For those that don't know that is from left to right.
How many former Marines do we have in NACHI? Is there enough to make up a squad? We could become Nick's hit squad.
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
I did not photograph the deflections in the beams but they are definitely “present and accounted for, Sir!” It is more than obvious that a triple 2x10 beam on a 32’ wide home that has 2 stories and a roof load is inadequate with the vertical “lolly” columns being so far apart. Any span and header table will tell you that. The guy who built the home was an electrician and the electrical work is great. I just think he took advice from the wrong person for the framing. Probably some old timer who used his thumb and the sun to level a home.
When talking about homes and they say "they don't build them like they use to", I always reply "thank god!!"
Come on, where are you Rob O??
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jonofrey This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
. It looks to me that they were installed after the fact when it was determined that the original first floor design (if you can call that designed) was not sufficient. Oops lets jack some beams up into place so our floor doesn’t fall down!
I have seen some basements in the north (Pittsburgh) and the main beams seem to be set perpendicular to the joists and the joists run flush to them and either notched into them and nailed or hung with hanging brackets.
My inspection agreement disclaims design problems but I would have mentioned something about the floor structure.
Originally Posted By: Brandon Ellerbee This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
John,
I dont want to sound stupid or anything, but wouldn't it be common sense that tells you when you see 2 jacks holding up the joists, and not actual columns, that it's a buildon? Or is this a common thing where you all are from. Down here in the south, I am pretty sure that builders use block colums or support posts that are built into the house.
Originally Posted By: jonofrey This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Brandon,
Those do look like jacks but I think they are beam supports commonly found in basements in the yankee territories. 
It's where and how they are spaced/located that makes me think that they are an afterthought, rig job. Who wants two supports in close proximity wasting space like these are? It's a waste of good basement room as well as being a bad floor job. There are much better ways to support the floor than what's in Jeff's photo. But when you are in a hurry (please floor, don't fall on me) you'll settle for less.
Originally Posted By: jpope This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
My simple response to this condition would be - These are temporary supports (both beam AND column). Placing 2x10’s to eliminate twists or rolling would indicate that these are considered permanent Now that WOULD be scarey
Originally Posted By: jonofrey This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Lee,
Ooh-Rahh.
Erby, you too?? Damn, I knew there was something I liked about you. I couldn't figure it out because none of your other traits are particularly appealing. 
Originally Posted By: jmyers This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jeff,
I don't know about up there in WHOVILLE but around here 3 - 2 X 10's sandwhiched together, along with some contractors glue and lots of nails, is a pretty common experience for 2 story homes. While I agree with you that 8 foot spacing would be better, I see them further apart quite a bit, without any problems what so ever.
There seems to be a trend starting with Metal "I" beams, which is really good. When you see the steel bow, you know you got a problem! 
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Igor, thanks for the input and you got me, I really looked twice for a mud tube,…nice one. I did flag the lack of a joist hangar on the double. It already dropped 1/4". The framing itself was quite a quagmire.
Joe M.,.. Exactly what planet without gravity do you live in where some glue makes a difference?? Whheeewww, keep the AHJ from there away from me. I bet the gravity is alot less there.
Of course a triple 2x10 is ok for a 2 story, 36' wide building BUT the vertical supports can't be more than 4'10" apart. This is why contractors use steel I beams and engineered laminate beams instead of supports so close together.
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Good question Joe H, what are they sitting on? Who knows, they are concreted in at the base. I was not there for the footer pour or slab pour so your guess is as good as mine.
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Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: rstephens This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Is there a possibility that a over zealous pest control sales person sold these to the home owner and the PC company installed them?
Alot of pest control companies include crap like that to the price of termite jobs to up the price. The company I work for does not sell them but they used to and most often those supports were installed upside down.
Just a thought on my behalf.
Is that a termite tunnel? I can not tell by the picture.
Now that WOULD be scarey 
