http://www.remonline.com/home/?page_id=2624
page 48
Concerning given that PHPIC and NHICC have people at the top one owning a home inspector school, and one owning an inspection training support, course development, et ceteras.
Bill this is alarming that you write an article knowing full well the conflicts at the top. Misleading to say the least.
Thanks Ray but I see much of the same that Bill has said all along .
Looks to me like if some thing is said often enough people start to believe it .
I wonder how many think this is the future of our industry .
Bill still says between 5,000 and 6,000 home inspectors in Canada .
I think he also counting those who have left the industry in the last ten years . There are active home Inspectors just about smack on ~3,000 in Canada .
I see he also does not give the cost of his program.
Oooops I stand corrected; CanNachi as well and inspection school and association rolled into one.
OK Ray.
I see somethings being fare. Others not so fare but again its a lobbied affair by the CMHC. ( to me )
They forgot to mention that no elections on Chair or even mention to other associations that the NCP was being absorbed by CAHPI until it was 6 months before it happened.
Now please excuse my time line referencing. I have been hear a shot time I could be wrong…
Am I wrong in-seeing half truth’s being played out again.
I love Roy’s favorite term used " at arms length " being embraced by ones that have no concept of it actual meaning.
There is a huge amount of money changing hands for ‘educating’ new home inspectors and virtually every one of the old associations are enjoying a relationship with a home inspection mill. If not through a direct connection then through the connection of one or more of the owners / board members. This kind of cash for this quality of education ( some courses as short as nine days) is the real crime of the Canadian Home Inspection Industry. It has become more important for many of the older associations to keep this questionable arrangement intact in order to preserve their private cash cows than it is to actually improve our industry through the improvement of their memberships.
Does anyone remember the ALLIANCE of CANADIAN HOME INSPECTORS requirement before attending the aborted “meeting of the minds” that Nick proposed;
the adoption of a **REAL **grandfathering programme,
the acceptance of the much feared ‘newbees’ as fellow inspectors
the institution of an apprenticeship programme that is governed by a board of directors including home inspectors, representatives from related fields and government
the shedding of all connections between Associations and their Inspector schools ( including those owned by board members and operated by principals of the association) by the other associations.
It should come as no surprise to anyone that the last point was never directly addressed by any of the representatives (real or imagined) of the old associations. Could that be because of the loss of potentially huge amounts of income for their organizations?
Money talks.
That is why the ALLIANCE of CANADIAN HOME INSPECTORS will only recognize graduation from a ministry accredited community college level Home Inspection course as the basic level or education requirement after the grandfathering programme concludes. We believe that Home Inspection associations have no place in education. We are Inspectors and should leave ‘education’ to professionals.
JOIN US AT;
http://www.theachi.org
George they will not stop and do everything to they can to reinvent that shell game until they die.
It hurts HI industry as well.
One day it will stop and hopefully that day will be in my life time.
Will the “grandfathered” HI’s have to meet the "ministry accredited community college level Home Inspection course " standards before being recognized and given a full HI designation by ACHI?
If so, how long will they have to meet the ACHI requirements and at who’s cost?
[size=2][FONT=Arial][size=2][FONT=Arial]From seeing how Grandfathering worked with other trades in Ontario .
All who where making their living at their Business, Example electricians, Auto Mechanics, Lathers,steam fitters ,ect where given their diploma , Upgrading followed at a leisure pace from what I remember .
It worked very well and I expect it would work great now .
The system we have now with many having little training and others pushing their ideas seems to do little for our industry.
The closed door associations think theirs is the only method , Co-operation is non existing.
TheACHI seems to be the only one who is open and is trying to move our industry forward.
I am sure I have tried to explain this before .
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Seeing you are here Brian MacN.
I looked into and performed a test on turbines.
1:I used a device to assimilate energy.
2: placed a plastic film at the bottom where the atmosphere would be drawn up, and I
3 rotated the turbine at x number of revaluations per minute to see the effect.
I rotated the circumference of the doom at several speeds and never over exaggerated the speed for effect.
At slower speeds I could produce draw.
The film was not static.
There was movement and the film became con-vexed in shape.
I repeated this several times in a windless environment.
Scientific no. It did perform its function to me having energy move the turbines and the shape of the turbines louvers in relationship to the angle they were set at, moved air( more so ) than a standard low-profile vent o a higher maximum of the same diameter.
Again scientific no.
A link that I also harvested from an old INCHI POST.
Been searching for the old CMHC sponsored side-by-side comparison of the turbine and the “chicken coop” ventilator. Still cannot find it as it was done 22+ years ago.
In the end it said that the turbine performed about 10% better than the other…not much considering it looks like it does a lot more and has moving parts…mostly an illusion. See the first study where the 8 inch open “stub” ventilation hole performed better than the turbines! A conical rain cap on the open stub vent will reduce its effectiveness but it still performs at approximately 90% of the turbine rate.
Venmar, the company that grew on these turbine, no longer manufactures turbines but probably has become the largest residential ventilation company in the world without whirlybirds!
http://services.eng.uts.edu.au/~phuoc/docs/writings/AFMC00120.pdf
From another article:
"WHIRLYBIRDS
The correct term is “air motor” , also called roof turbines. It is thought that the spinning turbine creates some sort of suction which induces air movement. This has not been proven. These are called “air motors” as they are used in large commercial applications for venting of smoke and fumes from a manufacturing plant. The wind spins the turbine which is connected by a shaft to a fan blade below which spins and pulls the air from the building. Turbines used in the residential market do not have these fans and therefore can exhaust only what the roof opening dictates."
**
Here’s another where they have added a motor to get desired ventilation in certian conditions:
http://www.csr-in-asia.com/images/csr_singapore/edmonds/CSR%20Edmonds%20ecopower.pdf
Understand Brian we have lived that episode in our lives before.
I wanted to point out that I did a half hazard scientific study on its usefulness.
You mention 10 percent better performance if I read this right.
I can not give any measurements but to say when turned in a windless atmosphere, the plastic barrier was not static and there was a response.
When the turbine was activated by energy it gave a response. It moved air. By how much CFM. I do not know.
I see it for what it is ( a snapshot in time ) and time has moved on to other inventions for moving air have taken its place.
I had to see for myself Brian and I am satisfied with my findings.
Thanks for sending me on that journey ( so to speak ). I did learn.
Roy I agree with the grandfathering of Home Inspectors that have been running a successful business. Some people just do not understand that if you demand that everyone must meet some pie in the sky dream scheme, the industry will be disrupted. What possible benefit is that to the HI, the consumer or the industry. To maintain continuity of service existing HI’s must be aloud to continue. Once licencing is implemented new inspectors must meet a raised standard that forces the diploma mills to provide enough course content so the newbies can do a competent inspection and report. At this time there are several out of province training programs that do not have adequate course content and a lot of that content is simply wrong.
I’m not so sure about that community college thing. Community college home inspection courses in Canada are notorious for offering the weakest training in our industry.
You must have heard that on these boards!
Gee am I missing some thing where else is information given .
Please help me Brian , Where else is information given.
Roy
Brian Do you post any where else if so where?
Brian what ever that percentage gain maybe its was still a gain and the product was pulled from the shelves instead of further developing it to play a roll in roofing and home ventilation system.
That was the pertinence of my argument and discussion with you on the subject turbines.
Have a look at Texas’ requirements as a decent starting point for certifying HI’s. Maybe trade schools/community colleges can do a similar job.
George.
That and the ever so present personality assassinations that is practiced by some NOT ALL in an effort to have there voices heard above the rest.
It is the same reason that they lock the doors to their MB and associations and meetings…
It an affront on there member’s intelligence and the intelligence of other association’s member’s wanting to communicate with the ones behind THOSE CLOSED DOORS.
As dictatorships around the world are called out, their so called leaders are seen for what they truly are.Arrogant and mistrusting and thieves of their fortunes of monetary wealth and education.
Also being seen there for money and power and to separate the education from the populates to keep them closed off form educating themselves from knowing the TRUTH.
They elevate them selves and truly think they are doing there followers a service.
With the advent of the internet and social media the populations educate themselves freely now and see them for what they truly are. HOLLOW AND THIEVES OF PUBLIC FUNDS AND CORRUPTING EDUCATION.
Sound like a familiar story George?
You’re here!! It’s a lot more fun!!!
If that small % gain is going to make or break a roof ventilation system performing properly, there are other problems in the house.
Your experiment was quite flawed in that it was in windless conditions and you supplied the mechanical energy by hand as is now being done by one turbine manufacturer in the form of an electric motor.
The flaw with the windless conditions is:
When the wind blows and supplies the mechanical energy to get the turbine moving, some of the air on the windward side is going to flow to the interior of the unit and flow to the other side to be expelled thus reducing/disrupting upward flow of air. In the still conditions you will get an enhanced effect of air being drawn out, as it is not tested in real world conditions.
No, they are not a bust but I would never put one of these on my roof! I have seen at least 2 where the homeowner has covered them over with plastic- one appeared to be a pink fiberglass insulation bag!