Originally Posted By: roconnor This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
If the disposal is on it’s own curcuit, I dont see an issue. But if both are on a general appliance/receptacle curcuit it’s a sticky issue.
The codes require at least two (2) 20A curcuits that serve only the kitchen and dining area receptacles, except for clocks and power for gas appliances (IRC E3603.2 and NEC 210.11.C & 210.52.B).
If both are connected to one of the required appliance curcuits, it appears to be a code issue ... but is it really a safety issue? Maybe not depending on the disposal draw since it is 20A/#12 (just my opinion since the light doesn't draw much, and the #12 has some non-code extra capacity ... up to 25A for THWN insulation) [but that should trip the breaker]
If both are on an appliance curcuit for new construction they should know better, and I would ask if the electrical inspector accepted that.
-- Robert O'Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee
I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong
Originally Posted By: tpfleiderer This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jeff,
Good question! I would say that this would be allowed if the calculated load of the new light and the garbage disposal does not exceed the allowable amps of both the wire and the over load protection of that circuit. The over load protection would also have to be marked as to having that light on that circuit. 
Originally Posted By: jremas This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Thanks for the answers, I threw this one out there after some research and it looks like we are all on the same page. Yes, it is allowable. We just can’t tap off one of the 2 circuits dedicated for counterspace.
Hmmmmm, lets see. If the disposal is rated for 7.5A and the bulb will be one 60 watt bulb in the lone fixture above the sink then I guess a 15A circuit with 14awg would be ok then huh??? Think…
–
Jeff Remas
REMAS Inspections, Inc.
Northeastern PA & the Poconos
www.NEPAinspector.com
Originally Posted By: jfarsetta This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
It also dpends upon the age of the home, and what upgrades were made and when.
On newer construction, I look for this. If I see a defficiency, I flag it. But on many older homes, there simply werent enough breakers to go around. So, ot depends on what else is going on in the home. I may suggest they upgrade their service to allow dedicated circuits, or distribute the load more effectively. But, on many occasions, the home has had this equipment installed for the last 15 or 20 years with no trouble, and I am hard-pressed to call it out as more than a recommended upgrade.
Disposals are a real concern to me. Not so much from a current draw, but from an operational safety issue. So, I also look at whether the disposal is equipped with a safety lockout. To me, most folks are more interested in that fact than whether they may pop a circuit if the microwave and disposal are on at the same time. If it isnt, I tell them that I hate the set-up, and always recommend replacement of the unit, especially if they have kids in the house. That's when I may also suggest the dedicated circuit...
-- Joe Farsetta
Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."
Originally Posted By: Dennis Bozek This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Well I gotta put my 2 cents in here. Would this be allowable?? Hmmm!!
Well yea it would be but would it be practical? Not likely. If the disposal is defective and tripping the breaker....that means no light??? That is why it would not be practical to do such but as far as loads go...yea it is ok. Besides, most kitchens have more than one light anyway. As long as there is only one light on that circuit along with the disposal, I wouldn't flag it. It also would take a lot to switch it too especially if the basement had a finished ceiling or no access to the lighting circuit from above. So from a sparky's aspect....not a problem...unless as indicated above.
Do remember though, that most houses have a full edison running the disposal and the dishwasher. You gotta be careful with this one though because if the two circuits are not present...it might be that the dishwasher is also on the same circuit as the disposal 
-- This information has been edited and reviewed for errors by your favorite resident sparky.
Originally Posted By: jfarsetta This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Hey, Dennis…
Nice post. You're being practical. You speak of the realities of established homes. You also speck of the realities of modified kitchens. Good point about the DW and disposal...
-- Joe Farsetta
Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."
Originally Posted By: jmcginnis This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
One other consideration for example is article 210.23 (A)(2) NEC basically states that since you are connecting a lighting load with a fastened in place piece of equipment (the disposal) then the disposal amperage draw may not exceed 50% of the capacity of the circuit (in this case 10amps)…most household disposals draw less than 10 amps so it probably wouldn’t be a problem… but it is something worth knowing about in the case of other types of “fastened in place” equipment that have higher amperage draw or in case you are working with a 15 amp circuit…2 cents…cha ching!!!
Originally Posted By: roconnor This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Jack … did the NEC change that 210.23 (A)(2) section recently (other than using luminaries)?
I thought that the 50% limit on the equipment only applied when you had the fixed equipment plus receptacles on the same circuit, or the fixed equipment plus both receptacles and luminaires on the same circuit (since the luminaires usually don?t draw much). That?s how my 2002 pocket guide and Mike Holt guide read.
But when I doubled checked the 2002 NEC (ugh) it reads either luminaires or receptacles (or both) ... as indicated in your post. Did the NEC mess up this section when they added ?luminaires?, because limiting the fixed equipment to 50% with just a kitchen light on the circuit seems out there ... am I missing something here ... 
Plus whats up with the terms "luminaires", "lighting fixtures", and "lighting units" all in the same sentence? Leave it up to NFPA to "clarify" things in an attempt to make the standards international.
-- Robert O'Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee
I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong
Originally Posted By: jmcginnis This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
The “99” code reads the same way so it is not new to the 2002 code…my guess about the reasoning would be that within the last 10 to 15 years, people have really leaned toward an abundance of lighting in the kitchen area… recessed and track… and it doesn’t take long before you have a fairly heavy amperage draw with paralleling multiple 75 and 100 watt bulbs…I would also consider that the start up of a motor operated appliance draws such a high inrush current that the lighting will dim for that instant and give concern to the homeowner about the proper operation of the circuit…I would think that if you had an installation with just one or two lights on with a fixed piece of equipment and the equipment exceeded the 50% limit, that the AHJ would let it pass in as much as the AHJ has the final say…
Originally Posted By: roconnor This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Good point about the startup draw … and very practical position on existing installs …
Any thoughts on the terms ... I'm assuming that NEC section means "lighting fixture" (errrrr ... "luminaire" ... must be a French thing ... lol) where it mentions "lighting unit"
-- Robert O'Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee
I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong
Originally Posted By: Dennis Bozek This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
In thier infinite wisdom at the NFPA, they must use terms like troculators and bilbous rods to confuse the general individual, hence, scaring him/her enough to wish to do electrical work on their own, thus, giving sparkies “job security”. My best guess anyway
You have to remember that us sparkies are a different breed and we don't use common terms. We try to act like college geniuses to confuse you guys  . Even our choice of music is different....we listen to songs like ohm ohm on the range and the like. When we talk about our residence we merely say "ohm sweet ohm". In the world of luminaires, kingpins and rf grease only those that write about such stuff actually know what it means. All the rest just make their best guess!! Job Security is the key...make it simple and everyone is a sparky
Hmm that might not be a bad thing.....I bet I'd be really busy at work then  
-- This information has been edited and reviewed for errors by your favorite resident sparky.
Originally Posted By: jmcginnis This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
RC…
Check in article 100… they only catalog one term… the terms luminaire and lighting fixture are interchangeable… lighting unit would seem to mean the same thing as well… and you are right … luminaire is a european term…probably has something to do with the requirements of ISO 9000…
Dennis...
pretty funny stuff wth the ohm word play.... I once knew an electrician whose motto was "Let us remove your shorts" He had it painted on his trucks....
Thanx Joe…I’m trying 
