Originally Posted By: Dennis Bozek This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
What’s wrong with that transformer being in the panel???
If one wants to get technical here....a standard doorbell transformer has 24 vac on the terminals......which is almost always exposed. Can 24vac kill you? Not likely but it can shock you. So why not protect it...stick it in the panel where no one can touch it. Granted you don't often see it...it is rare to do it....but frankly...nothing wrong with it.
-- This information has been edited and reviewed for errors by your favorite resident sparky.
Originally Posted By: Scott Patterson This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Dennis Bozek wrote:
What's wrong with that transformer being in the panel????
If one wants to get technical here....a standard doorbell transformer has 24 vac on the terminals......which is almost always exposed. Can 24vac kill you? Not likely but it can shock you. So why not protect it...stick it in the panel where no one can touch it. Granted you don't often see it...it is rare to do it....but frankly...nothing wrong with it.
I see about twenty or so a year like this and each time I call them out. The NEC does not allow for low voltage items in the same panel. Another thing is that most of the time they create a double tap, so I would not say nothing is wrong with it.
Originally Posted By: jpeck This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Dennis,
Scott is correct. No low voltage transformer in the panel. In fact, nothing in the panel which is not approved by the panel manufacturer to be in that panel.
Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
I always tell my client to get this low voltage transformer installed onto the exterior of the SE panel. Most of the time when I see this laying in the panel, there are other electrical issues that need to be dealt with also. So this transformer removal is added on to other electrical issues that need to be corrected.
If this is the only single electrical issue, I make sure I tell my client that it’s not a big deal but should be moved eventually.
I see Scott Patterson is here...
This isn't the same Scott Patterson from the other board...is it?
Originally Posted By: Scott Patterson This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
dvalley wrote:
I always tell my client to get this low voltage transformer installed onto the exterior of the SE panel. Most of the time when I see this laying in the panel, there are other electrical issues that need to be dealt with also. So this transformer removal is added on to other electrical issues that need to be corrected. If this is the only single electrical issue, I make sure I tell my client that it's not a big deal but should be moved eventually.
I see Scott Patterson is here...
This isn't the same Scott Patterson from the other board...is it?
Yep it's me.
As for attaching it to the exterior of the panel box, this could create another problem as whoever sticks it to the side of the box will most likely use "sharp" sheet metal screws and we all know what happens when an insulated wire rubs up against a "sharp" sheet metal screw.
I would also not tell my client that it is not a problem. Reason: House burns down from some electrical problem, fire investigator finds a transformer in panel box. Homeowner says that the home inspector said it was not a big deal".
Report what you see and do not sugar coat or soft sell it. I have seen soft selling like this way too many times as an expert witness.
Originally Posted By: jpeck This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
The low voltage transformer will (most likely will, anyway) a threaded hub which gets inserted through a knock out and is held in place with a lock nut, putting the 120 volt supplies in the panel (which, if not careful, can create its own problems) and the transformer and low voltage side outside the panel.
Originally Posted By: dvalley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Scott,
I never mentioned attaching this to the panel itself, I quoted "installed onto the exterior of the SE panel". You have a good point about the sheet metal screws. Not good.
I do see these transformers attached directly to the side of the panel most of the time. I don't call them out.
About sugarcoating or soft selling this matter... Good point, again. Lets get them all removed.
Originally Posted By: Blaine Wiley This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
In general, the standard installations I have seen over the years have been either on the side of the panel, as Jerry said, or on the outside of a metal junction box either on a basement or garage light.
Technically, no low voltage wriring should be inside a main service panel, and when I find it I do write it up for further evaluation/correction by a qualified licensed sparky.
I posted this pic just cause I thought y'all would find it funny, still being in the box!   
Originally Posted By: roconnor This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.
Scott and Jerry … let me play devils advocate here. You are both indicating that just the presence of a doorbell transformer in a service panel is a code violation.
I dont see where the NEC or UL panelboard listing/labeling standard clearly states that transformers or low voltage wiring can not be installed in a service panel.
It's not good practice, but assuming the equipment is listed for that, what code/section does this violate?
-- Robert O'Connor, PE
Eagle Engineering ?
Eagle Eye Inspections ?
NACHI Education Committee
I am absolutely amazed sometimes by how much thought goes into doing things wrong
