Safety glass needed?

I have never (nor will I ever) suggested in a report, that a security system be installed - there’s your answer, but I’m not sure what it tells you.

Personally, I would be more inclined to tell the clients to consider buying in a different neighborhood, rather than installing a security system. But that’s not my job.

Here’s a hypothetical for you:

Same windows but in second floor family room.

Any specific recommendations?

Tempered glass or protection that can be removed without tools or key diffently

No change in my recommendations. The “living space” of a family room is not technically considered to be a “walking surface.” If this was in a hallway, or passageway (near a door), my recommendation would certainly change.

Sorry, JP, I usually agree with your calls but from your own IRC, a hazardous location requiring safety glass includes [2406.3] 7.4 One or more walking surface(s) within 36" horizontally of the plane of the glazing surface. You can’t deny people walk there to get into the room.

John Kogel
www.allsafehome.ca

I concur with Jeff…I consider ‘walking surfaces’ to be outside, i.e. a sidewalk, deck, patio or the like…not the room itself.

Here’s why I asked…

My mother used to live in the St. Louis area and had windows very similar to those in her living room (upstairs of a split level). We were visiting at a time when my oldest first started walking. I was moving her glass coffee table (her home wasn’t very baby friendly) to the garage - attached, accessible only from the exterior - and walked past these windows, which were open.

I heard my son say Dada-dada and my mother, seeing me out the window, pointed to me. My son ran to the window, through the screen and landed on his back in the bushes, about 6 inches from some landscaping bricks. Yes, I dropped (and broke) the table, but was not quick enough to catch him.

Lucky for us, he only had a scratch, but it could have been much worse. My mother didn’t think to stop him, because she didn’t think the screen would give. :roll:

Are the windows inherently dangerous? No, but we can’t protect people from themselves.:shock:

Be sure to warn your clients to keep their children away from stove, water heater, furnace, full bathtub, all electrical outlets, tall trees, the street, and every other perceived danger.

…and any inspector that has no common sense or regaurd for safety :wink:

Richard
Thats why i mention it in my report. i also write up anti tip device on stoves.
but it is my preference

Anti-tip devices are required and should be listed if not in place.

It’s okay to disagree John, I certainly respect that. We all learn from these types of discussions.

I’m not denying that someone may walk near the window - that’s not really at issue. But who’s to say that someone might not just place the couch in front of the window?

My point is, the area is not considered (by model codes) to be a “walking surface.” Just like a rooftop is not a “walking surface.” *

We have to draw the line somewhere. We can eliminate much of the “gray” areas by referencing model codes, which are generally black and white.*

Would tempered glass have made any difference to the outcome of this event?

I’m happy to hear that everyone is okay. . .

Yes i know about anti tip and thats why i do but i know many inspectors that don’t
My point is i try to point out some things that most people will over look and explain that it may be not a code and is for their information .
As pointed out there many area’s people can get hurt Like roofs but it is not a every day occurrence that people walk on their roof . But kids ride bikes run around care free, If i see a situation that someone could avoid with simple solution I will tell them. Like locking their power panel and the crawl space door, Installing bars on sliding door I mark it under FYI, 99 percent people appreciate it They other 1% would not be happy if God himself did the inspection. But i can sleep better :smiley:

No but a safety panel would have

If the window shown was on the second floor I would point it out to the client and suggest they consider a barrier of some kind.

I have in the past.

Thanks, it was 6 years ago or so (even though I remember it like it was yesterday).

The reason I asked wasn’t about the glass, but recomendations in general. I haven’t seen that style window here, yet. When I do, I’m sure I’ll relay my story mainly as a common sense type of precaution, but I don’t think it’ll go in the report.

My mom’s inspector certainly couldn’t know that someday her grandson would visit, as he was just learning to walk, see his father outside, run to the open window and fall out. If he could, his crystal ball is better than mine.

There’s really only so much we can do - we can’t prevent accidents and we can’t stop people from doing stupid things.

Tempered glass is required in some locations. The following list is not all-inclusive.
(1) Glazing in doors and enclosures for hot tubs (both inside and outside), whirlpools, saunas, steam rooms, bathtubs and showers or any part of a wall enclosing these areas where the bottom of the glass is 60 inches or less off the drain, needs to have tempered glass.
(2) If a window meets all four of the following criteria the glass needs to be tempered.
a. Exposed area of an individual pane is greater than 9 sq. ft.
b. The bottom edge is less than 18” above the floor.
c. The top edge of the same piece of glass is 36” or more above the floor.
d. If one or more walking surfaces are within 36” horizontally of the glazing.
For further information consult the 2000 edition of the International Residential Code or consult the Building Permits Office.

I found the above information. i still would point out windows under FYI that close to the floor

I smell a new vendor