Financial accountability from CAHPI and OAHI

OAHI financial accountability - That’s an oxymoron. These people have never had any intent to be forthcoming with the financial info!

CAHPI-National Board Members

Mandate: To represent the OAHI and CAHPI-Ontario on the CAHPI-National Board of Directors regarding ‘national’ issues.

Ralph Banks
Glenn Gogal
Kirk Iredale

more info that Bill M posted below
And will soon make sure we are at arms length with all we do.

And we are almost CAN-P-9 approved ,and you Bill have the nerve to say
( And that, sir, is absolute bull****. )

Now below is ( And that, sir, is absolute bull****. ) from Bill M

Remember Whistler
http://www.nachi.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4935
Bill has a big anouncement comming soon
http://www.nachi.org/forum/showpost.php?p=166560&postcount=103

Brian, Membership in InterNACHI is used for grandfathering nearly everywhere. There are only 3 states that require continual membership in an approved private association like InterNACHI as a requirement for government-issued licensing, and all of them accept InterNACHI membership.

Nearly all of the rest of the licensed states approve of nearly all our courses for either continuing education, pre-licensing, or both. In fact, we have been awarded some 700 approvals (see right column of www.nachi.org/education.htm )

AHHHH!!! Wanda, from chameleon to lap dog now…It would be truly sad if Nick needs or wants you answer my questions?

Hell, now I’ve lost respect for dogs!!

Well, it begs the question if they were the Executive in charge of the NCA why did they fail their NCH’s by not protecting their monies from the get go? I think their defence thus far might be to deflect a D&O claim against them and to divert to CAHPI…yet they were in charge by their own admission.

The demise of the NCA, NCP and NCH by it’s Executive or CAHPI shows just how fragile and insecure the program and certification was. With only 500 NCH in so many years and far less than the 5-6,000 predicted by some in a far shorter period of time, its scandalous that the NCA, its Executive and / or CAHPI and its provincial counterparts continued to take money from unknowi

ng registrants.

Now, to perpetuate matters, NHICC and its supporting association PHPIC which are both largely made up of the same individuals from th defunct NCA continue the myth by flogging unsuspecting participants to fork over money to invest in a dead horse. Maybe it’s me, but I can’t tell the difference, what is the difference between this and a ponzi scheme:

A fraud disguised as an investment opportunity, in which initial investors and the perpetrators of the fraud are paid out of funds raised from later investors, and the later investors lose all funds invested.

Or maybe pyramid scheme…

A fraudulent moneymaking scheme in which people are recruited to make payments to others above them in a hierarchy while expecting to receive payments from people recruited below them. Eventually the number of new recruits fails to sustain the payment structure, and the scheme collapses with most people losing the money they paid in.

No monies left? No limited benefits received in turn? It begs the questions: Who got the money? Who spent the money? Who failed to protect the money?

Hey mouthpiece,

Maybe you should run to your authorities and demand a full accounting of where the monies are that CAHPI collected. You seem to have your priorities screwed up.

As a member of OAHI you keep quiet under fear of retribution.

Do you really think that anyone on these boards really believes (1) that I (living and working in Nova Scotia) am a member of OAHI and (2) if I had any monies involved in the OAHI/CAHPI/NCA fiasco, I would be quiet about it?

Why don’t you save yourself and the boards the time and go learn about things you don’t inspect, yet are an expert on… like wood heating systems!!

I know all about wood inserts, unlike you.

And despite your repeated protests you are a member of OAHI! Your name is up in lights!

Carry on you cry baby!

Too bad you can’t tell the difference between a wood insert or hearth mounted wood stove that vent through the firebox/damper of a fireplace and a hearth mount vented through the upper front face of the fireplace directly into the flue and not through the firebox/damper area…as that’s what was being discussed…go take a WETT course!!!

Either way insurers here want it lined whether its an insert or vented through the front of the fireplace as its easy to over fire creaking temps in excess of what the clay tiles are rated for.

So unless you live in Ontario take a hike.

Well this is getting clearer…what is Bill Mullen smoking!!!

Bill Mullen says: Why should CMHC care? They have not given CAHPI any funding for years. Any money in question came from either CAHPI members or applicants for the national certification. CAHPI no longer offers the national certification so there is not a connection between CMHC and CAHPI at all. No money from CMHC or any government source was ever misused. CMHC has also almost completed their full banishing of CAHPI from their publications an websites. CAHPI once had the ear of CMHC and other government agencies, but the Sutherland regime has managed to fritter that away. The CAHPI members should be raising hell, but most are just sitting on their hands as usual. I am aware, however, of an uprising in BC, and some angry rustling in Alberta, Quebec and Atlantic Canada. It likely means the end of CAHPI National, because CAHPI has no inspector members and has abandoned its reason to exist, which was the NCP. With the NHICC now in charge of the NCP, CAHPI’s office must be sprouting dust and cobwebs. …and yes, CMHC is very aware of what is going on. Bill Mullen]

Can’t have it both ways Bill…if some of the monies in the same pot are misused by paying Sutherland’s Director’s fees, NCH’s monies are withheld, there’s no accountability, transparency, financial statements, stewardship or governance…then ALL the money is tainted. I’d like to hear you tell a judge that of the billions Bernie Madoff took, the money spent paying for rent was not wasted as part of the elaborate and lavish facade used to defraud so many in the ponzi scheme.

Bill goes onto say, why should CMHC care, they’ve banished CAHPI…yet they very aware of what’s going on? Is CMHC planning to recoup those funds they gave CAHPI?

Why would anyone invest in NHICC when the same key individuals that ran the NCA now run NHICC along with its promotional association PHPIC? These same executives, directors and officers allowed the abuse of monies in the NCA and CAHPI that they speak of now without bringing it to the attention of the membership? When they were in power why didn’t they call in the RCMP? Issue a white paper? Now, these same key individuals in charge of the NCA debacle carrying on when there was no meaningful growth of NCH members and they took no action to protect the NCH’s money in the NCA. Again, why would anyone in there right mind invest in the NHICC and the overstated and vastly unrecognized NCH?

To respond to your question:
(1) the NCH’s that believe in the NHICC, and many have renewed
(2) the NCH’s that wanted it transparent and NOT under the control of CAHPI management (or should that be mismanagement)
(3) how should the NCH’s be represented, other than by those “elected”, should they be appointed/or parachuted in from afar?

You suggest that the police should have investigated. What evidence can you provide that it was not done?

How many lawyers that were consulted saw this as it would be more trouble than what it was worth? Afterall the legal fees to collect $80,000 or so of NCP money would cost more than that, particularly with a forensic audit.

Remember the NCH/NCA was self-funded, and not one penny of CAHPI member dues were used for its operation.

Which bring this full circle back to now another example of who still continues to attack. I politely repond, and you still attack. Look in the mirror again!

So your assumptions are once again - just that assumptions and not factual. Perhaps fine in theory, but certainly not cost effective for those that would be footing the bill for all of this to happen.

You are also unfairly pointing fault at those that tried, rather than directing it that those that “managed and manipulated” and vetoed the process. By that time, the NCA was basically fired, and still controlled by guess who? The CAHPI appointees!

You are correct and saying the CAHPI officers and directors should be held accountable, which directly correlates to the discussion on that other “private” forum, that tidbits are copied from. Is that not the point being raised there?

Claude I have little ideas how the secret association is run.
All I know is it seems strange to me to see what has happened to our Canadian Industry.
Little on no communication with The Canadian homies .
Questions evade or not answered .
I and others called a liar and when complaints where lodged nothing changed no apologies, no charges .
To me this group of self appointed people are a farce I care less what they do.
But when they treat our industry with distain that is wrong and I will do all I can to get what ever information I get out there.
I do not want this self appointed group to control our industry in Canada.
Trying to say how about NACHI and the way it is run is hog wash .
Different system and trying to get all look elsewhere is silly.
I have asked and I have pleaded for open comunication with all Homies and associations
The selfish closed door method is wrong.

Claude Lawrenson wrote: You suggest that the police should have investigated. What evidence can you provide that it was not done?]

Are you telling us that during your reign Claude that you as Chair of the NCA and or the NCA Executive called in the RCMP or other police force to investigate and follow up on improprieties you allege and the theft of the NCH fees by CAHPI then?

Claude Lawrenson wrote: **How many lawyers that were consulted saw this as it would be more trouble than what it was worth? Afterall the legal fees to collect $80,000 or so of NCP money would cost more than that, particularly with a forensic audit.]

So, if this is the case why are you ******** about it? Why not let sleeping dogs lie? Why are you being antagonistic?

Claude Lawrenson wrote: **Remember the NCH/NCA was self-funded, and not one penny of CAHPI member dues were used for its operation.]

The NCA may have raised monies for the NCH, but it was wholly owned and backed by CAHPI. A dollar in CAHPI or the NCA is one in the same. They were NOT separate legal entities. By your accounts, you were the Chair of the NCA and you were in charge. You as Chair were in charge of ensuring the NCH fees were collected. You were in charge of ensuring monies spent by the NCH was done properly. You were in charge of safeguarding the assets (and monies) of the NCA.

Claude Lawrenson wrote: **Which bring this full circle back to now another example of who still continues to attack. I politely repond, and you still attack. Look in the mirror again! So your assumptions are once again - just that assumptions and not factual. Perhaps fine in theory, but certainly not cost effective for those that would be footing the bill for all of this to happen. You are also unfairly pointing fault at those that tried, rather than directing it that those that “managed and manipulated” and vetoed the process. By that time, the NCA was basically fired, and still controlled by guess who? The CAHPI appointees!]

Again, as Chair of the NCA did you or the Executive call in the RCMP or other police force to investigate and lay charges? If not, why not? Did you submitted a claim to the carrier of CAHPI’s Directors & Officers Liability insurance to recoup on behalf of the NCH’s the fees paid in by them? If not, why not? The only facts that you have presented appear to be banner waving after you were Chair of the NCA. You were in charge Claude, that’s what you keep telling us. It’s only after the fact that you blame CAHPI for closing you down. Geeze, on the Apprentice everyone knows that even Donald Trump fires the project manager if they failed at their task :slight_smile:

Claude Lawrenson wrote: **You are correct and saying the CAHPI officers and directors should be held accountable, which directly correlates to the discussion on that other “private” forum, that tidbits are copied from. Is that not the point being raised there?]
**
I think the Chair of the NCA and its Executive, Directors & Officers (if any) along with those in CAHPI should be held accountable. That is the point Claude. Why did you wait to be fired? You and your cohorts should have resigned if it was as serious as you say! I’ve seen no facts presented to suggest you and your team are exculpable. Only after the fact do you point fingers, which coincidentally coincides with the formation of the same crew starting up NHICC and it promotional association vehicle PHPIC to promote the overstated and vastly unrecognized NCH? Why would / should anyone give you (more) money?

To whoever is writing Roy’s messages for him now, the answer to most of your demands is that it is none of your business. Not one dime of public money has ever been in jeopardy. As Nick has said a million times, iNACHI’s business is nobody else’s business. The same applies to the NCA and CAHPI.

In the absence of any knowledge of what really occurred, and who did the right thing and who did not, it behooves you to not make such blatant conclusions and allegations. Your inept attempt to connect the dots is way off the mark.

Bill Mullen

To late Bill you are part of the group who did nothing .
I as a Canadian Tax payer paid some of these funds .

Claude Lawrenson wrote: **Which bring this full circle back to now another example of who still continues to attack. I politely repond, and you still attack. Look in the mirror again! So your assumptions are once again - just that assumptions and not factual. Perhaps fine in theory, but certainly not cost effective for those that would be footing the bill for all of this to happen. You are also unfairly pointing fault at those that tried, rather than directing it that those that “managed and manipulated” and vetoed the process. By that time, the NCA was basically fired, and still controlled by guess who? The CAHPI appointees!]

Again, as Chair of the NCA did you or the Executive call in the RCMP or other police force to investigate and lay charges? If not, why not? Did you submitted a claim to the carrier of CAHPI’s Directors & Officers Liability insurance to recoup on behalf of the NCH’s the fees paid in by them? If not, why not? The only facts that you have presented appear to be banner waving after you were Chair of the NCA. You were in charge Claude, that’s what you keep telling us. It’s only after the fact that you blame CAHPI for closing you down. Geeze, on the Apprentice everyone knows that even Donald Trump fires the project manager if they failed at their task :smile:

Claude Lawrenson wrote: **You are correct and saying the CAHPI officers and directors should be held accountable, which directly correlates to the discussion on that other “private” forum, that tidbits are copied from. Is that not the point being raised there?]

I think the Chair of the NCA and its Executive, Directors & Officers (if any) along with those in CAHPI should be held accountable. That is the point Claude. Why did you wait to be fired? You and your cohorts should have resigned if it was as serious as you say! I’ve seen no facts presented to suggest you and your team are exculpable. Only after the fact do you point fingers, which coincidentally coincides with the formation of the same crew starting up NHICC and it promotional association vehicle PHPIC to promote the overstated and vastly unrecognized NCH? Why would / should anyone give you (more) money?

Its a well known fact CAHPI lent Nat. Cert. $35K!!! This was admitted quite awhile ago when CAHPI and the Nat. kept claiming they were at arms length, then we found out that money was lent and NC was owned by CAHPI.

Stories are different at every turn. We also know taxpayers money courtesy of CMHC were given to fund part of the Nat. Cert.

Lets not leave OAHI out of the picture either, they have purposely kept financial accounts out of the hands of OAHI members who put a lot of monies in over the years including me and many others.

Wrong again Roy, you are like the other topic notes - CONFUSED!

Separate the facts and situations. As noted earlier - “Your inept attempt to connect the dots is way off the mark.” What you think is not the issue.

You never put one penny into the NCA or the requirements to become a NCH.

If you and your buddies believe otherwise, than you too also have an opportunity to become a “whistleblower” and save the inspection world.

Thanks Claude we all know every one has always been truthful and posted the facts and always answered all questions .

Remember Whistler
http://www.nachi.org/forum/showthread.php?t=4935
Bill has a big anouncement comming soon
http://www.nachi.org/forum/showpost.php?p=166560&postcount=103

Well the professor bolds words that support his position but the words in red says that on line training produces better trained students than the class room.
Talk about tunnel vision! :roll: