LMAO… 
Unless something has changed. A GC has to have an HI license to perform FULL Home Inspections. A GC/RC/BC, does not need an HI license to report on license specific areas, such as structure. Just as an electrical contractor does not need an HI to inspect the electrical. Or, an roofing contractor to report on roofing.
All trades need an HI to cross over to OTHER trade specific areas.
If it is otherwise, that is new to me. I personally would be reluctant to let my HI license go. I think it’s important to continue to professionalize and legitimize our industry. No one, should be building without a contractors license, and no one should be inspecting homes without an HI license.
Just my 2 cents and why I continue to support home inspector initiatives that may seem counter to the interest of my other licenses.
A CGC can grandfather to get the Hi license if they choose but they do not need it to do anything which is already covered in their license. A CGC can build a pool or install new roofs or do mold assessment/removal, install windows…basically a CGC can do anything except electrical/plumbing. A CGC can install new ductwork and HVAC and install solar panels but they can’t commission them or service them. But, technically, a CGC can work on or replace a water heater as long as the value is under $2500. A CGC can install any new roof (except metal or tile) but they can’t re-roof. A CGC can install a septic tank/drainfield but they can’t replace one. We’ve been down this road before on this MB. Every new division 2/3/specialty license has historically tried to negate what a CGC can do and with the exception of electrical/plumbing, they have failed. Those specialty trades which affect life safety are the only ones outside the scope of a GC license. I’m not sure if a RC needs the HI or not but it would seem to me, they do not as their license covers the construction of a residence.
Many do not know a CGC who completes the Residential Wind Design certification can seal new residential building plans and that means the GC does not need an architect or PE.
Mike, call Contractor’s Institute in Hudson, FL. They have the actual DBPR opinion which says a CGC does not need a HI license. I will keep my HI license as I choose to separate the business entities.
Truly, I do not know why this matters to anyone. why would you care if a GC can inspect a shaq? There are 7000 registered HI’s who will give you more competition than you can handle.
Yep and no G.C. is going to do them for free to TRY to find work.
I personally hate being squeezed by the State.
QUOTE=wchandler;957291]A CGC can grandfather to get the Hi license if they choose but they do not need it to do anything which is already covered in their license. A CGC can build a pool or install new roofs or do mold assessment/removal, install windows…basically a CGC can do anything except electrical/plumbing. A CGC can install new ductwork and HVAC and install solar panels but they can’t commission them or service them. But, technically, a CGC can work on or replace a water heater as long as the value is under $2500. A CGC can install any new roof (except metal or tile) but they can’t re-roof. A CGC can install a septic tank/drainfield but they can’t replace one. We’ve been down this road before on this MB. Every new division 2/3/specialty license has historically tried to negate what a CGC can do and with the exception of electrical/plumbing, they have failed. Those specialty trades which affect life safety are the only ones outside the scope of a GC license. I’m not sure if a RC needs the HI or not but it would seem to me, they do not as their license covers the construction of a residence.
Many do not know a CGC who completes the Residential Wind Design certification can seal new residential building plans and that means the GC does not need an architect or PE.
Mike, call Contractor’s Institute in Hudson, FL. They have the actual DBPR opinion which says a CGC does not need a HI license. I will keep my HI license as I choose to separate the business entities.
Truly, I do not know why this matters to anyone. why would you care if a GC can inspect a shaq? There are 7000 registered HI’s who will give you more competition than you can handle.
[/QUOTE]
This is not new math, a home inspection is a report of all systems and since you have already acknowledged you can not do plumbing and electric… A+B=you can not do a home inspection without an HI number:)
I think what you are missing is that the CILB said GCs can do home inspections without a license. The DBPR says they can not. Since CILB is under the DBPR who do you think is going to win that debate?
The DBPR says that a GC can do all of the items in a home inspection but must have a HI license if they are doing them as a “Home Inspection” or are doing them all at once. Leave some stuff out of the inspections(see what is included in a home inspection on the DBPR website) and it is not a home inspection.
I hope that helps
This is not new math, a home inspection is a report of all systems and since you have already acknowledged you can not do plumbing and electric… A+B=you can not do a home inspection without an HI number:smile:
Sorry, Bruce, but you are wrong. Look, I’m not defending a GC or marginalizing a HI - it is what it is. A HI can’t do plumbing either or electric so what is the difference in a GC being able to inspect v. a HI who has completed a 3 day course?
I’m done with this argument but you guys who think a GC can’t inspect a home without a Hi license are flat out misinformed. The state did not command a GC to get a HI license; they simply said if they wanted one they could grandfather in without taking the test - up to them. State never said if you intend to inspect a home you must have one. Div 1 contractors are exempt from the HI license. Call your congressman.
http://www.myfloridalicense.com/dbpr/pro/homein/documents/home_faqs.pdf …
2. I’m currently licensed with the Construction Industry Licensing Board as a
contractor. Do I need a license to perform home inspections?
Contractors will be able to conduct system specific “inspections” that include some
systems or components of the home. “Home inspection services” is currently defined to
include all eight components of the home. Contractors can continue to conduct
estimates and system specific inspections on those building systems and components
included within their scope of work. The law defines “home inspection services” as the
limited visual examination of the following readily accessible installed systems and
components of a home: the structure, electrical system, HVAC system, roof covering,
plumbing system, interior components, exterior components, and site conditions that
affect the structure. The purpose of the inspection is to provide a written professional
opinion of the condition of the home. All eight components of the home must be
inspected and a report written to be considered an official home inspection where the
department has jurisdiction under Section 468.83 Part XV. System specific inspections
of just one system or component will not require a home inspectors license. However,
contractors not licensed as a home inspector may not represent themselves as home
inspectors.
**3. Is there a provision that would allow those licensed by the Construction
Industry Licensing Board (CILB) to perform home inspections as long as they stay
within the scope of their current licenses? **
Yes, Section 468.831 F.S. exempts persons from the provisions of Chapter 468 Part XV,
when acting within their authorized scope of practice as licensed under federal, state or
local codes or statutes. Any person acting on this exemption must not hold himself or
herself out for hire as a certified home inspector or any title implying licensure under
Chapter 468 Part XV.
Please note that home inspection services is defined as the limited visual examination of
the following readily accessible installed systems and components of a home: the
structure, electrical system, HVAC system, roof covering, plumbing system, interior
components, exterior components, and site conditions that affect the structure. The
purpose of the inspection is to provide a written professional opinion of the condition of
the home. All eight components of the home must be inspected and a report written to
be considered an official home inspection where the department has jurisdiction under
Chapter 468 Part XV.
So if I skip site conditions, then I don’t need a license…sweet!
In my opinion,
A GC is limited to the intent of the law:
F.S. 489.113 does not have the word inspect, inspector, visual approval report, etc…
Nor under F.S. 468.8319 does it give any profession but a person with a HI license the authority to preform a home inspect, report etc…
Now, can a GC, truck driver, medical doctor, etc… make a report of a home which he gives an opinion of the condition and call it an evaluation?
I believe if a GC or any profession does a home inspection, sells the report as a home inspection and is not licensed as a HI, they are subject to disciplinary action.
The big question is:
Who will spend the money to file charges, for what, and take the chance of slander/libel suits if you lose.
Live and let live, worry about your own life,
Luke 6:41 And why worry about a speck in your friend’s eye when you have a log in your own?
So if I skip site conditions, then I don’t need a license…sweet!
Thanks for clarifying my position in a nutshell, Russell.
XYZ GENERAL CONTRACTOR
HOME EVALUATION REPORT
for
MS. HOMEOWNER
I have evaluated the home at xxxxx to determine the total structural integrity, the evaluation of the building envelope and the main components which affect the performance of the home, life safety and sanitation, etc.
My findings of fact are:
- Roof
- Exterior
- Interior
- HVAC
- Plumbing
- Electrical
- Structural
Based upon the above, I would recommend :
- Total replacement of the roof (see estimate of cost attached)
- Upgrade to the roof to wall connection to increase wind protection (see estimate attached)
- Removal of tile/backer board/drywall in master bath due to the visual presence of mold. (see estimate attached).
- Removal of the water oak tree which is compromising the septic drainfield and overhanging the roofline. (see estimate attached)
Under Chapter 489, I am a Div 1 General Contractor and I have 97 years of combined experience in restoring the American Dream. If you choose our company for these repairs, the cost of this evaluation may be deducted from the contract for construction.
Etc, etc.
You can’t stop a licensed contractor from doing what they are capable of doing and I suggest everybody quit worrying about what a GC can or can’t do. Make HI better by increasing standards and education requirements (and to me, that doesn’t include inspecting a stupid microwave).
When we pointed this out the DBPR they said you could loose both licenses for trying to skirt the law. If their investigator believes it was a “home inspection” you are going to have issues. That is from them, not me. If you do not believe me ask Richard Hyland or any of the others that were sitting at the table when it was discussed with DBPR or just call DBPR and ask yourself.
I’m not defending any side but some of this is like telling a GC he can’t build a single family house because we have Residential Contractors and if he does, he better not be advertising to build them. It just never ends. A CGC can do most anything he wants with a house and anyone, including the DBPR, is going to have difficulty proving they can’t. No matter what anyone on this MB thinks about it, it is the highest license issued by the CILB and was intended to be so. Anything to do with a house is covered by the scope of the license. Anything.
Enough time spent on this. to each his own.
Except for one minor fact the CILB is under the DBPR.
It is true that a GC license is unlimited in scope except where prohibited by other laws.
Under your thoughts, a GC can work as an adjuster if it is a home? DFS may have an issue with that.
You can not spray for and treat for termites or other pests on a home, DACS may have an issue with that.
You can not work on septic systems, DH may have an issue with that.
You can not work on A/C units, CILB might have an issue with that.
You can not re-roof a house either.
William, I am not trying to tell you what to do, by any means. I just would rather one of my contractor buddies have all the facts before they believe in the GC Almighty License.
489.105
(a) “General contractor” means a contractor whose services are unlimited as to the type of work which he or she may do, who may contract for any activity requiring licensure under this part, and who may perform any work requiring licensure under this part, except as otherwise expressly provided in s. 489.113.
489.113 Qualifications for practice; restrictions.—
(1) Any person who desires to engage in contracting on a statewide basis shall, as a prerequisite thereto, establish his or her competency and qualifications to be certified pursuant to this part. To establish competency, a person shall pass the appropriate examination approved by the board and certified by the department. Any person who desires to engage in contracting on other than a statewide basis shall, as a prerequisite thereto, be registered pursuant to this part, unless exempted by this part.
(2) A person must be certified or registered in order to engage in the business of contracting in this state. However, for purposes of complying with the provisions of this chapter, a subcontractor who is not certified or registered may perform construction work under the supervision of a person who is certified or registered, provided that the work is within the scope of the supervising contractor’s license, the supervising contractor is responsible for the work, and the subcontractor being supervised is not engaged in construction work that would require a license as a contractor under any of the categories listed in s. 489.105(3)(d)-(o). This subsection does not affect the application of any local construction licensing ordinances. To enforce this subsection:
(a) The department shall issue a cease and desist order to prohibit any person from engaging in the business of contracting who does not hold the required certification or registration for the work being performed under this part. For the purpose of enforcing a cease and desist order, the department may file a proceeding in the name of the state seeking issuance of an injunction or a writ of mandamus against any person who violates any provision of such order.
(b) A county, municipality, or local licensing board created by special act may issue a cease and desist order to prohibit any person from engaging in the business of contracting who does not hold the required certification or registration for the work being performed under this part.
(3) A contractor shall subcontract all electrical, mechanical, plumbing, roofing, sheet metal, swimming pool, and air-conditioning work, unless such contractor holds a state certificate or registration in the respective trade category, however:
(a) A general, building, or residential contractor, except as otherwise provided in this part, shall be responsible for any construction or alteration of a structural component of a building or structure, and any certified general contractor or certified underground utility and excavation contractor may perform clearing and grubbing, grading, excavation, and other site work for any construction project in the state. Any certified building contractor or certified residential contractor may perform clearing and grubbing, grading, excavation, and other site work for any construction project in this state, limited to the lot on which any specific building is located.
(b) A general, building, or residential contractor shall not be required to subcontract the installation, or repair made under warranty, of wood shingles, wood shakes, or asphalt or fiberglass shingle roofing materials on a new building of his or her own construction.
(c) A general contractor shall not be required to subcontract structural swimming pool work. All other swimming pool work shall be subcontracted to an appropriately licensed certified or registered swimming pool contractor.
(d) A general contractor shall not be required to subcontract the construction of a main sanitary sewer collection system, storm collection system, or water distribution system, not including the continuation of utility lines from the mains to the buildings, and may perform any of the services, on public or private property, for which a license as an underground utility and excavation contractor is required under this part.
(e) A general contractor shall not be required to subcontract the continuation of utility lines from the mains in mobile home parks, and such continuations are to be considered a part of the main sewer collection and main water distribution systems.
(f) A solar contractor shall not be required to subcontract minor, as defined by board rule, electrical, mechanical, plumbing, or roofing work so long as that work is within the scope of the license held by the solar contractor and where such work exclusively pertains to the installation of residential solar energy equipment as defined by rules of the board adopted in conjunction with the Electrical Contracting Licensing Board.
(g) No general, building, or residential contractor certified after 1973 shall act as, hold himself or herself out to be, or advertise himself or herself to be a roofing contractor unless he or she is certified or registered as a roofing contractor.
From the DBPR
468.8311 Definitions.—As used in this part, the term:
(1) “Department” means the Department of Business and Professional Regulation.
(2) “Home” means any residential real property, or manufactured or modular home, which is a single-family dwelling, duplex, triplex, quadruplex, condominium unit, or cooperative unit. The term does not include the common areas of condominiums or cooperatives.
(3) “Home inspector” means any person who provides or offers to provide home inspection services for a fee or other compensation.
(4) “Home inspection services” means a limited visual examination of the following readily accessible installed systems and components of a home: the structure, electrical system, HVAC system, roof covering, plumbing system, interior components, exterior components, and site conditions that affect the structure, for the purposes of providing a written professional opinion of the condition of the home.
Sadly no GC BC or RC is listed here
468.831 Exemptions.—The following persons are not required to comply with any provision of this part:
(1) An authorized government employee of the United States, this state, or any municipality, county, or other political subdivision who is conducting home inspection services within the scope of that employment, as long as the employee does not hold out for hire to the general public or otherwise engage in home inspection services.
(2) A person acting within his or her authorized scope of practice as licensed under federal, state, or local codes or statutes, except when such person holds himself or herself out for hire to the public as a “certified home inspector,” “registered home inspector,” “licensed home inspector,” “home inspector,” “professional home inspector,” or any combination thereof stating or implying licensure under this part.
(3) An officer appointed by the court.
(4) A person performing safety inspections of utility equipment in or on a home or building or other duties conducted by or for a utility under chapter 366 or rules adopted by the Public Service Commission.
(5) A certified energy auditor performing an energy audit of any home or building or other duties conducted by or for a utility under chapter 366 or rules adopted by the Public Service Commission.
History.—s. 2, ch. 2007-235.
(2) A person acting within his or her authorized scope of practice as licensed under federal, state, or local codes or statutes, except when such person holds himself or herself out for hire to the public as a “certified home inspector,” “registered home inspector,” “licensed home inspector,” “home inspector,” “professional home inspector,” or any combination thereof stating or implying licensure under this part.
John, as I stated, I’m not advocating the GC position and I have a HI license. My only point is, a GC can inspect a home and my example showed how. It’s a play on words just like a GC doing mold assessment. Based on this, to be safe, all a GC needs to do is not call it a home inspection. How about this?
Licensed General Contractor will provide a complete building evaluation of your home or office to include roof, structure, etc. and provide written cost estimate to cure deficiencies found. We will inspect your home or office and provide a comprehensive report for $13.95.
No different than the ruling on a GC doing mold - all they have to do is not call themselves a licensed mold assessor/remediator and provide a cost estimate to fix the problem.
In the ancilliary areas you mentioned, a GC can contract to do anything to a home including any sub-trade specialties and that is the difference. Obviously, the GC is required to hire electricians, plumbers, etc to permit the specialty - but he can contract the work with the owner and he can contract with the specialty trade AND oversee their work. A GC can do some minor repairs to plumbing, roofing, septic, etc. as long as it is under $2500 and meets the building dept guidelines such as not adding new water lines or replacing a roof and the like. And as I said, a GC can install a new roof other than metal or tile but they can’t replace a roof. Few Gc’s permit the new roof as they don’t want the liability or the insurance costs, but they can if they choose.
We’re debating semantics and again, I’m not advocating for the GC. I inspect under my HI and I build under my GC. I don’t want either license jeopardized by the other and I maintain separate legal entities. I’m getting my mold assessor license next month even though I can legally assess mold as a GC; I don’t need controversy and I wanted proper training/certification and I will have separate insurance for mold related work activities. I also don’t agree that a GC has the specialized knowledge to assess mold and they are not generally set-up to manage employees in the remediation.
We all know that just because someone has a license, it does not guaranteee competence and that applies to GC’s, HI’s, MA’s, CPA’s and lawyers to name a few. I just passed a truck today advertising Concrete Pumping (I have known this company for many years as Concrete Pumpers) and low and behold, they are also advertising their HI license. This guy has been pumping concrete for 20 years and now he is a home inspector, number 19xx. People are doing anything and everything they can to make a living today.
My point in entering this discussion is simply that, as HI’s, in my opinion, we should concentrate on improving the qualifications needed to become a HI. This minimal “inspector school training” is the enemy - not the very few GC’s who are inspecting homes; regardless of whether they have a HI license or not. To my knowledge, I am the only GC in my immediate area that is actively pursuing home inspection yet there are dozens of licensed HI’s inspecting ho,mes for $99 that come from non-building backgrounds - two of them worked as general laborers for me once and I fired them.
The enemy is also not InterNachi or AHIT or the dozens of other schools - they offer a product that meets the state guidelines. The enemy is the weak licensing statute enacted as recommended by Internachi, AHIT, led by our current board or most of it. I really feel like the Lone Ranger here and I have already said, I don’t believe half of the HI’s should be HI’s as they don’t know anything. I’m not saying they can’t learn and InterNachi provides a great platform for them to learn (yes, I learn things here too). I’m saying, there should be OJT unless they have a solid background as a builder, engineer or something similiar. Then Hi becomes a profession. Right now, it is the lowest form of retail, price point, merchandising for those who can’t distinguish themselves otherwise. guy who used to sell me my lotto tickets is now advertising wind mits for $45 thanks to his HI license.
the enemy is not the GC - it is the HI down the street thanks to poor leadership and greed during licensure. I don’t know, maybe those who advocated for this license suspect they don’t know anything about a home either. have at it boys, this is my opinion.