Florida House of Representatives - HB 315

Originally Posted By: jburkeson
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Its official, Florida Representative Bob Allen has filed HB 315.


Home Inspection Services: Provides for licensure of persons providing home inspection services; provides legislative intent and definitions; provides standards of practice; creates the Florida Home Inspection Advisory Council; provides licensure requirements, including grandfathering provisions; provides exemptions; provides prohibited acts and penalties; provides for complaints and discipline; provides fees; requires liability insurance; exempts from duty to provide repair cost estimates; provides for reciprocity; provides continuing education requirements; provides limitations; provides for enforcement of violations; provides an appropriation and authorizes positions.

Effective Date: July 1, 2005.

Last Action: Filed on Wednesday, January 12, 2005 4:20 PM


Here is a link to the entire text of the bill http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/loadDoc.aspx?FileName=_h0315__.doc&DocumentENGINE=Bill&amp DEFAULT CHARSET=latin1;BillNumber=0315&Session=2005


Basically the requirements for licensing are...

(a) Be of good moral character.

(b) Have successfully completed high school or its equivalent.

(c) Have completed a course of study of no less than 90 hours that covers all of the following components of a home: structure, electrical system, HVAC system, roof covering, plumbing system, interior components, exterior components, and site conditions that affect the structure.

(d) Pass an examination that is psychometrically valid and meets the standards of the Council on Licensure, Enforcement, and Regulation, as determined by the department.

Basically the requirements for Grandfathering is...

GRANDFATHERING.--For the first year after the enactment of this section, to be eligible for a license as a home inspector, an applicant must:

(a) Be of good moral character.

(b) Have successfully completed high school, its equivalent, or have been in the business of home inspection services for at least 5 years.

(c) Have been engaged in the practice of home inspection for compensation for not fewer than 3 years prior to the effective date of this section.

(d) Have performed not fewer than 250 home inspections for compensation.

(e) Have passed a psychometrically valid examination that meets the standards in the Council on Licensure, Enforcement, and Regulation publication "A Resource Brief on Licensure Examinations," as determined by the department.

------End Copy

I have every reason to believe that the forces who proposed this licensing legislature will be successful in seeing this bill become law unless the legislature can be convinced otherwise.


--
Joseph Burkeson, RPI (Hooperette)

?Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.?
~ Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Originally Posted By: jmertins
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Here we go again with the 3 years and 250 inspects…as if that makes you legitimate and competent. Is there a plan of action to equalize this repeat of last year as of yet and insure a level playing field?



John Mertins


Baxter Home Inspections, Inc.

"Greatness courts failure"

Roy "Tin Cup" McAvoy

Originally Posted By: jburkeson
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Hi John,


Yes, I believe there is a planned meeting on Florida HI legislation that will take place during the Convention in Orlando next week, please attend.


--
Joseph Burkeson, RPI (Hooperette)

?Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.?
~ Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Originally Posted By: rzimmerman
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If this passes I will be out of business.


20 years various construction back ground - Void

50K IR camera - back to bank

15K marketing, tools, certification courses - gone

Home depot here I come ![icon_confused.gif](upload://qv5zppiN69qCk2Y6JzaFYhrff8S.gif)

There is no way I meet the grandfather or have the time and money to meet the 90 hours. Yet, Realtors and homeowners report my service far exceeds the inspections and reports by other inspectors in this area.


--
Rob Z.
www.RZinspections.com

Originally Posted By: jburkeson
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Hi Rob,


It was a pleasure meeting you last night, I clearly see your position, there should be a provision for related work experience, you might want to think about making the trip to Tallahassee to discuss this with your Representative.


--
Joseph Burkeson, RPI (Hooperette)

?Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.?
~ Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Originally Posted By: jschwartz1
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Hi Joseph,


Two questions, one comment.

If the bill is passed, what happens to the occupational licenses not set to expire until after July 2005? Does this mean we have til July 2005 to get the classes and testing out of the way?

If all it requires is 90 hours of training and passing a test, so be it. We can come up with a way to make these classes very affordable with a NACHI push.

I have no problem passing a test.


--
Jay Schwartz
Coast To Coast Home Services, Inc
www.Coasttocoasthomeservices.com
Southeast Florida NACHI Chapter - VP www.floridanachi.org
NACHI - Legislative Committee Member
MAB - Member

Originally Posted By: jmertins
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Joe,


Do you know as of which day and time that meeting will take place regarding the HI licensing and legislation in FL? I only live 45 minutes from the convention and plan to make my drives there each day.

Thanks,

John


--
John Mertins

Baxter Home Inspections, Inc.

"Greatness courts failure"

Roy "Tin Cup" McAvoy

Originally Posted By: dbowers
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Robert -


Are you saying you can't take 2 weeks out of your life to take a 90 hour HI course ($2600-$3000) but you can spend big bucks for a camera???

I think if your business means anything those 2 weeks would be a cheap price to pay to stay in business.


Originally Posted By: jfarsetta
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Its ASHI model legislation, no?


I would propose the legislative paskage that NY State recetly passed. It is reasonable, and provides a path for anyone who wishes to enter the profession.

Summng it up:

Grandfathering: 3 years and 250 inspections and no test, or 2 years and 100 inspections and pass the NHIE.

Dont have either? Fine... then 140 hour traning, 40 of which are in the field, inspecting, and a part of the school. No mentoring BS. When you're done, take te NHIE. Dont want to do that? Fine... work for someone and perform 100 inspections under the direct supervision of a licensed inspector, then take the NHIE.

For those who dont meet either grandfathering requirement, the options presented get you a full license to practice.

Licansing Board? Nope. Its an advisory counsel, with no actual authority. They serve at the cnvenence of the Secretary of State. ne final thing: this advsory council s made up of 3 inspectors and 3 non-inspectors.

I think you guys should get on this, and quickly...


--
Joe Farsetta

Illigitimi Non Carborundum
"Dont let the bastards grind you down..."

Originally Posted By: rzimmerman
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dbowers wrote:
Robert -

Are you saying you can't take 2 weeks out of your life to take a 90 hour HI course ($2600-$3000) but you can spend big bucks for a camera???

I think if your business means anything those 2 weeks would be a cheap price to pay to stay in business.


Dan,
If I need to do two weeks of training to stay in business I will do that. Do I have the money setting around for it? NO

I spent big bucks for an IR cam a year ago for doing strictly IR work in Texas. Unfortunately things changed. I'm now in Florida starting over.

This is just one of those changes that happens at the wrong time and tends to put my panties in a wad ![icon_eek.gif](upload://yuxgmvDDEGIQPAyP9sRnK0D0CCY.gif)

Will I go out of business. NO I'm too good at what I do to let someone like the state of Florida get the better of me


--
Rob Z.
www.RZinspections.com

Originally Posted By: dedwards
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I don’t know why any of this is coming as a surprise to anyone. We have known about this coming for months. This is just basically the same package as last year and the year before and the year before…etc. etc.


This is why FAPHI was formed to present another position and to keep the folks in Tallahassee informed about what the Home Inspectors in Florida want. This bill is being pushed by the people who stand to make the most money from it, not “to protect the consumer” as they would have you believe. That is the biggest sled load of crap to come down the pike. The only consumer you as an individual can protect is YOUR customer and you can do all you want to, to protect their interest. Can the state of Florida really afford this at this time having just had four hurricanes in one month? Doubtful. Regarding the “advisory council”. That is just to get the ball rolling. That same council will help make the bigger decisions later about licensing and all the other nuances. Remember, the devil is in the details. This thing is far from complete. The folks in the panhandle have been down this road more than a few times. We have tried to sound the warning but gotten very little response from inspectors around the state. If we end up with licensing there are going to be people out of business and that is exactly what your representative needs to hear. JOBS LOST is not good for the state! I have seen posts here on the BB that indicates that is okay with some people. This about money. The people pushing this are the ones who stand to make the most money from it. The big money in HI is not in actually performing them. It is in providing the continueing education requirements and getting the initial qualification (hence the 90 hours course requirement). Not only do you have to do it to get the license you have to do it every year to keep it. The “council” will deceide the criteria and which school houses will get the nod or approval for state recognition. This thing has been beat around numerous times right here in the BB. The pros and cons of licensing is well known. Licensing has not stopped other professions from having lousy, incompetent people from entering the professions. We as HI ought to know this. We see their handiwork every day. Much of what we see during our inspections was done by “licensed” professionals. Time to pull our heads out of the sand. This is not going to go away until we deal with it.


Originally Posted By: jburkeson
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jschwartz1 wrote:
If the bill is passed, what happens to the occupational licenses not set to expire until after July 2005? Does this mean we have til July 2005 to get the classes and testing out of the way?

If all it requires is 90 hours of training and passing a test, so be it. We can come up with a way to make these classes very affordable with a NACHI push.


Answer #1: The state trumps the county, but I believe that there will be a 1-year time frame to allow both licensee's and those who will be filing under grandfathering to get it together.

Answer #2: The folks that wrote the bill will make sure that NACHI will never be granted accreditation to provide classes, you can count on it.


--
Joseph Burkeson, RPI (Hooperette)

?Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.?
~ Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Originally Posted By: jschwartz1
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Joe,


I have a meeting with my state representative on Wednesday. He is currently in Tallahassee. I invited him to the conference this week. I hope to have some good news for everyone.


--
Jay Schwartz
Coast To Coast Home Services, Inc
www.Coasttocoasthomeservices.com
Southeast Florida NACHI Chapter - VP www.floridanachi.org
NACHI - Legislative Committee Member
MAB - Member

Originally Posted By: jmertins
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Hey Guys,


Do we know what day and time the meeting will be in Orlando that will be discussing the LIC. issues?


--
John Mertins

Baxter Home Inspections, Inc.

"Greatness courts failure"

Roy "Tin Cup" McAvoy

Originally Posted By: sbyrnes
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Joe,


I've seen other threads on this, and personally I wouldn't mind ONE thread giving info as it comes available. I can't make the convention since I have inspections booked for the end of this week so could you keep us posted on what is discussed at the convention and outcomes?

I'm sure things will change as it goes through the approval process, basically because a lot of people will be trying to get what they want implemented.

The biggest concern is obviously the amount of time worked and the inspections completed. Is it 3 years AND 250 inspections, or 3 years OR 250 inspections? Will that change as it goes along?

The 90 hours of training, how low will that number go if at all? There are franchises out there that offer only 75 hours of training. I'm sure they'll want to get there 2 cents in.

There are several categories of trades that can call themselves HI's, so if someone wanted to be licensed will the fact that they worked for that trade be counted as part of the 3 years? An example being someone that worked WITH a GC and now wants to be a HI. Would that time count? Will that change?

You said The folks that wrote the bill will make sure that NACHI will never be granted accreditation to provide classes, you can count on it. Why? And what is NACHI doing to make sure the will be granted accreditation?

What is NACHI proposing for the requirements?

I don't expect you to sit back and answer all these questions, since it's too early in the game to make definite conclusions, but can you keep us posted?


--
All Corners Home Inspections, Inc
Serving Pasco, Hernando, N. Pinellas & N. Hillsborough counties

Originally Posted By: jschwartz1
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Scott,


Click on this FAPHI link.

http://www.nachi.org/faphi.htm

Then download the position statement. I believe it has the best merits for legislation.


--
Jay Schwartz
Coast To Coast Home Services, Inc
www.Coasttocoasthomeservices.com
Southeast Florida NACHI Chapter - VP www.floridanachi.org
NACHI - Legislative Committee Member
MAB - Member

Originally Posted By: ladams
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So how many smaller Home inspectors will this put out of business? I understand that they are trying to protect the consumer but how many HI’s out there have not done 250 reports or have not been in business 3 years?


Just my 2 cents icon_wink.gif


Originally Posted By: jschwartz1
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Lind,


The problem is not the number of inspections, but the numbers themselves. FABI and ASHI want to drive the legislation for the sole purpose of financial gain. More members and more classes they can offer. Both are not ethical.

Keep a close eye and get involved. Contact your local state representative. Your business will depend on your actions.


--
Jay Schwartz
Coast To Coast Home Services, Inc
www.Coasttocoasthomeservices.com
Southeast Florida NACHI Chapter - VP www.floridanachi.org
NACHI - Legislative Committee Member
MAB - Member

Originally Posted By: jburkeson
This post was automatically imported from our archived forum.



Deleted… icon_biggrin.gif



Joseph Burkeson, RPI (Hooperette)


?Anyone who has proclaimed violence his method inexorably must choose lying as his principle.?
~ Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

Originally Posted By: Brian A. Goodman
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[quote=“jburkeson”]


A$HI has only recently jumped on the licensing band wagon, for many years they opposed all attempts, and that is why Florida today still is without a licensing law on the books. I believe that the ivory tower mentality that was once in charge over at A$HI was afraid that licensing would make all inspectors equal and they would loose power.

I believe that was indeed the case. I've seen that arguement on the ASHI web board, but I think it's wrong-headed.

It is ironic and laughable that the reason that A$HI is in such poor shape is because they didn't support licensing when they were the sole national HI organization.

I don't see the direct connection there. What is it?

Now that A$HI's salad days are all but a mere memory and their costs have risen dramatically, once licensing is enacted there is simply no justification pissing away money to be an A$HI member, association membership will never trump state licensing, never.

I can't agree with that. There are still plenty of ASHI members (and NACHI & NAHI members, I'm sure) in states with licensing (mine included). Education, marketing, speaking louder on legislative issues, etc. ....silly little things, but they seem sort of worthwhile.

You can claim to be a member of any organization, but... a license talks and <b>s#!t</b> walks.

For the most part I agree, but there will always be some who find real value in affiliaton with reputable professional organizations. Clients are slowly becoming more sophitocated in the entire RE process.

A$HI will either learn to once again serve their members in a meaningful way, or end up on the ash heap of history with the rest of the looser organizations that failed membership 101 and thought that their leadership was meant to be served instead of being a servant.

I think the leadership did lose touch with the membership to a point. I also think they're very well aware of it these days. Fortunately our leadership is elected and rotates. They'll adjust.