You often find distribution panels than need to be relocated , in the bathrooms, not enough clearance, etc. My question is if its allowed to splice the feeders, or do you need to run a new feeder line from the new location of distribution panel to meter?
polaris taps?
http://www.nsiindustries.com/catalog/nsiproducts/polaris™-insulated-mechanical-connectors
Sure you are permitted to splice Service, Feeder and Branch Circuits if done properly and in accordance with the NEC. The section that comes to mind that best fits your situation is 312.8 if the enclosure will retain any switching or overcurrent devices. If the box is becoming a “junction box” then it would also be ok as long as it has a cover on it [314.25] and be aware of 314.28 and associated sub-parts where applicable.
Long story short- In a residence the typical panel enclosure has more than enough room to make splices and extend the feeder and contain splices to extend branch circuits when dealing with a feeder application.
We sometimes used these when I was in the back up generator business.,
Polar splices sure to make it easy and they are well insulated. The only original concern anyone had with them is when they are used in enclosures that contained switches or overcurrent devices and meeting the requirements of 312.8 (40/70 Rule)…but other than that a very nice product to use indeed.
You can not splice conductors at the interior of panel boards that contain over-current protection or switches unless the conductor terminates at the interior of the panel. That would classify it as a “raceway”, and panels are neither UL listed or have sufficient space for this.
312.8 Enclosures for Switches or Overcurrent Devices.
Sorry Robert S there is space provided and splices and feed through are allowed. You need to read the entire sentence before coming to a conclusion. It is very hard to fill a gutter space even close to maximum fill. If you will check later editions for the NEC you will see that the wording has changed and “for this purpose” has been removed.
You will also see that raceways are specifically mentioned in the article you posted.
Assuming the a panel is used as a junction box, is there an issue with an accessible junction box being in the same location that warrented a distribution panel to be moved? For example bathroom, too close to water heater, etc. my assumption is yes but this is the place to ask.
I agree, splicing is allowed and the possibility of filling the space to over 75% is nearly impossible given the natural interstices surrounding the conductors next to each other.
Panel have workspace requirements as well as prohibited locations. Junction boxs do not have the same restrictions.
BTW, there is no requirement for separation for panel and a water heater. They can almost touch if the workspace extends to the other side.
Curently, no panel board manufacturer has a UL listing for the minimum required space to provide for raceway splicing. And, as you hopefully know, it is a violation of the NEC to use any electrical equipment for anything other than it’s approved UL listing. It’s not an issue of space specifically, it’s an issue of UL approved listing…the panel boards were never tested for or approved for use as a raceway. The change you are speaking of came in the 2011 NEC, that isn’t adopted yet in my area. But, the panel board can’t be used for anything outside of it’s UL testing or listing.
Maybe this will help? http://www.askcodeman.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=75
Equipment must be installed and used in accordance with it’s “listing”, once the panel board is used as a raceway, it is beyond the tested UL lsiting for use.
**[FONT=Times-Bold][size=2]2008 National Electrical Code: 110.3 Examination, Identification, Installation, and Use
of Equipment.
[/size][/FONT][FONT=Times-Bold]size=2 Installation and Use. **[/size][/FONT][FONT=Times-Roman][size=2]Listed or labeled equipment
shall be installed and used in accordance with any instructions
included in the listing or labeling.
[/size][/FONT]
Panel boards are to be installed and used according to their UL listing, the act of splicing a conductor that does not terminate at the interior of the panel qualifies it as raceway use. The panel board was never tested for listing of that purpose. It’s not a matter of space or location, it’s a matter of the UL listed instllation and use. The code is just showing that splicing IS using that panel board as a"raceway"…
Incorrect Statements…The Cabinet is just that…a Cabinet and is subject to to the requirements in Art 312. The enclosure is not a raceway. The panel enclosure is not “expressly” for holding wires, cables, or busbars…it is designed (in this case) for holding switches and overcurrent protective devices.
AS the previous Southern NEMA Field Rep…I disagree.
It wouldn’t be the first time I was wrong about something…
312.8 Switch and Overcurrent Device Enclosures with Splices, Taps, and Feed-Through Conductors. The wiring space of enclosures for switches or overcurrent devices shall be permitted for conductors feeding through, spliced,or tapping off to other enclosures, switches, or overcurrent devices where all of the following conditions are met:
(1) The total of all conductors installed at any cross section
of the wiring space does not exceed 40 percent of the
cross-sectional area of that space.
(2) The total area of all conductors, splices, and taps installed
at any cross section of the wiring space does not
exceed 75 percent of the cross-sectional area of that
space.
(3) A warning label complying with 110.21(B) is applied
to the enclosure that identifies the closest disconnecting
means for any feed-through conductors.
http://ecmweb.com/mag/707ecmCQfig1.jpg
Hey…you better call Mike Holt then…
I’m not the best at explaining things, so maybe I have created some confusion as relating to the original post. I understood it that he want to leave the original panel in place and use it to splice off to the newly relocated panel. As the code reads, it specifically does not say the panel enclosure has to contain over-current devices or switches at time of use, just that enclosures for over-current devices and switches shall not be used as raceways. The code was changed in 2011, our area is currently under the jurisdiction of 2008. But, and maybe you might know more about new enclosures, if the enclosure was specifically designed for use with over-current devices and switches…the way the code reads, it can’t be used as a raceway. That is the act of splicing off through the panel without the conductor terminating at the interior of enclosure/panel classifies it as a raceway. The enclosure must be used in accordance with it’s UL listing, and as such tested/rated for use as a raceway…this means adequate space as tested by the manufactrurer for the approved listing. Adequate space is there, we all know that, but the panel was never tested or UL listed for use as a “raceway”. That was my point…ALL equipment per 110.3(b) listed or labeled equipment has to be used in accordance with it’s listing or label. It’s splitting hairs, but it makes sense…kinda:mrgreen:
[FONT=Times-Bold][size=2]
2008 NEC: 312.8 Enclosures for Switches or Overcurrent Devices.[/size][/FONT][FONT=Times-Roman][size=2]Enclosures for switches or overcurrent devices shall not be used as junction boxes, auxiliary gutters, or raceways for conductors feeding through or tapping off to other switches or overcurrent devices, unless adequate space for this purpose is provided. The conductors shall not fill the wiring space at any cross section to more than 40 percent of the cross-sectional area of the space, and the conductors, splices, and taps shall not fill the wiring space at any cross section to more than 75 percent of the cross-sectional area of that space.
[/size][/FONT]
I’ll call Jerry, you call mike…