PHPIO oddly brags about education being recognized by a known diploma mill, but...

… no mention whatsoever of InterNACHI.

http://www.phpio.ca/benefits.php

Note the mention of “Just send a check and shazam!” ASHI but no mentiong of the world’s largest inspection association.

Nick:

William Devries asked me to move this from your original PHPIO thread…seems appropriate here!!

Originally Posted by Brian A. MacNeish http://nachi.cachefly.net/forum/images/2006/buttons/viewpost.gif
*But you sure as he!l can’t get "fully certified" in 2 hours as at INACHI!! *

*ASHI Certified Inspectors— Inspectors in this category have:

  • Passed the National Home Inspector Examination and ASHI’s Standards and Ethics Examination.
  • Had inspection reports successfully verified for compliance with ASHI’s Standards of Practice.
  • Submitted valid proof of performance of at least 250 fee-paid home inspections that meet or exceed the ASHI Standards of Practice.

From an email to me by a newbie about his INACHI CHI status:*

"Its not a permanent thing…and definitely not something I’m proud to boast about, considering it took me all but 2 hrs. to become “certified”. Don’t worry, I’ve been listening to what you’ve been telling me. This just had to be a first step for our company. I have people on my back to start doing inspections for them, and CAHPI wasn’t an option at this point in time." ( because it takes time to be well trained, not 2 hours!!)**
**
"Brian you actually can’t be fully certified in 2 hours, your friend lied to you. Once you have done all of the following you are considered fully certified, please do not confuse yourself and others with your persistent BS.
You are not a member please try to stick to the facts."

Well, William, Yes, I was a bit misinformed but upon checking with him he said it took him about 2 hours to complete the entry test and get his membershiop fee paid online. He wasn’t immediately certified that night but his name showed up as “certified” the next morning on the:
"Featured Inspectors"

"Find A Certified Home Inspector" page.

So he never completed any other requirements that night but was listed as “certified” for the public to view the next day!! So in the public’s eye he was certified…in what 12 hours or less… and listed with inspectors with 10 or more years experience… he had never done a full house inspection at this point!

Hell!! Here we don’t even have foxes watching the chicken coop…it’s all on the “honour system”. Who’s verifying anything except a computer??? Is it on the honour system also??

Brian, your information is old. ASHI no longer requires anything to join and become a member. Nothing. Just money.

The other part you quoted is correct… UNFORTUNATELY for consumers.

It is true…they encourage their come-only-with-cash new members to go out and screw over a certain number of poor unsuspecting consumers as the only way to achieve fool membership.

Thanks for pointing out the “go screw over 250 poor consumers” thing that ASHI is guilty of. You make a very valid point about them… that being that they are worse than a diploma mill.

Anyway, you can only join InterNACHI quickly if you can pass everything quickly and you still can’t do any inspections (if you are new) until you perform your mock inspections and get licensed (in licensed states). It’s not so easy considering that even one of our initial entrance exams (our easiest to pass IMHO) has a 61% fail rate and an 80% passing cut off score. Click here http://exams.nachi.org/oe/stats.php (takes a few minutes to download as these are live stats)… and it gets tougher as you continue with membership: www.nachi.org/rigorous2006.htm

Some inspectors try for years to join InterNACHI, but can’t.

Compare apples to apples.

Remember… it’s not the short amount of time that it takes a qualified inspector to be able to join InterNACHI that matters. It is the short amount of time that an UNqualified inspector can join ASHI that matters. In fact, anyone can join ASHI in less than 55 seconds. Anyone. And as Brian points out to consumers… after joining ASHI, the very next minute, they will be encouraged to go out and peform actual inspections for poor, unsuspecting consumers.

Thanks for pointing out this anti-consumer association’s requirement to harm a certain number of consumers. There used to be a biker gang that didn’t allow you to become a full member until you murdered an innocent civilian.

Thanks for reminding us of the similarities Brian.

Certification Requirement at NACHI continues to Surpass & Exceed the requirements of ASHI or any other comparable Organization.

What is the question…?

Why is the person that passes only the entrance exam and “comes-only-with-cash” listed as “certified” overnight on your “Featured Inspectors” page without having done any of the other requirements./mock inspections/real inspections?

Who is checking that inspectors have completed all requirements before inspecting?

At least, ASHI has 3 categories of membership so that the public can know the training/experience level of newbies versus INACHI where the overnight certified newbie is listed with the 10 year+ experienced inspector.

As soon as I mention “online certification” to realtors, their faces screw up in disbelief and sometimes shock!!

To repeat: It’s WEB FICTION!!! And there’s not too much of that around, is there???

It’s funny, Nick, that you’ve never commented on CAHPI Atlantic’s bare minimum entrance requirements just to obtain “Candidate” (student) status. And these probably will be raised again before next summer.

Keep trying Brian. There is no limit on how many times you can take the test. Eventually you will pass (as you mature) and you can then become one of us. :wink:

Nick:

Read it again. It does not say that PHPIO’s education is recognized by anyone because PHPIO offers no eductaion directly. PHPIO recognizes the educational offerings of any group that has an accreditation agreement with the NCA. So far you and NACHI have refused.

We need to work on that, becaue i would love to see many or most of your courses accredited by the NCA.

Bill Mullen

Never mind ASHI what happen to OAHI being recognized? :shock:

And I didn’t know CMHC recognized or promoted any education programs/courses. But then again maybe I missed that announcement from CMHC.

OAHI is a CAHPI organization, so if they recognize the education, PHPIO will as well. CMHC recognizes many educational providers, including their own.

Bill Mullen

Linus:
I think you’ve seen my qualifications before…If I remember correctly, I’m still waitng for yours!!! Hell, Ray and Roy can’t give me any help here, Mario gives me 1/2 the reds I get and I still get greens for the help I give here…what’s your beef??

That’s just it, Linus, people can take the test as many times as they need to until they pass. If someone has to repeat it 6-7-8 times and then finally pass, what is their overall knowledge of buildings like. You need much, much more than book learning and passing an online test to inspect…no proctoring, no verification of having completed all requirements, , 4 mock inspections with no mentor to oversee the competence of the newbie, free membership to some and a huge web presence…or right…Web Fiction!!

Loacally, we have had no CAHPI Atlantic members go to INACHI but we now have an ex-INACHI member as a Candidate member presently and a current INACHI member working towards credits to gain membership. The INACHI merry-go-round is still working for Nick and the vendors!! On…then off!!!

I’m sure some might glance over this given my relative new status to this business but can I offer a fresh set of eyes from someone who investigated all of the associations at length:

Living in Ontario I first found OAHI. I went on there website and found little information. Then I sent several emails requesting answers to various questions about basic enrollment. NO RESPONSE. I then paid for the application and information I was seeking and more than a week later I received it. The information came in a very difficult to understand format and the questions I had been asking still went unanswered. I was enrolled with Carson Dunlop and trying to determine the technical requirements. No one at OAHI could ever answer me one way or the other if after spending thousands of dollars and countless hours studying if I would in fact be qualifed to work towards my RHI designation.

Incidently, Carson Dunlop has an online education course… it is very comprehensive. All be it, I don’t have the 10 years of experience many inspectors have, I took it upon myself to arrange for mentoring before I started inspecting.

KEEP IN MIND PLEASE THAT THERE IS NO REGULATION IN CANADA. NONE OF THESE ASSOCIATIONS ARE A REQUIREMENT TO CALL YOURSELF A HOME INSPECTOR. Its up to the individual. Sure, taking a 2 hour online course and going to inspect houses is stupid. Do you think that individual will be around for years to come? Doubtful, I’m sure when he receives his first suit against him… it will be over. EAO insurance is impossible for someone untrained.

I’m surprised to see different associations all fighting to be the standard when frankly… such a standard only comes through regulation. Right now it is up to the individual and their morals and ethics to ensure they are qualified to do the job. Personally I chose to take the book courses as well as seek qualified mentors to show me the ropes. Where does one get the 10 years of experience? At one point we all did our very first inspection.

Personally, I’m looking for my association to not say hey kid, you’re not qualified to do this… I’m looking for them to say hey kid, been there and done that. Let me show you the best practices I have learned.

When I contacted NACHI I got an immediate response. Since joining I have found 3 mentors who are allowing me to mentor their home inspections. I can’t say how valuable this is to me as I know its not really that pleasant to have yet another person tagging along behind them during an inspection. I appreciate all the folks who have been supportive. And my commitment to myself, my customers and my association is I will always work my hardest to educate and develop myself to do the best job possible and to represent my clients and association to the best of my abilities.

When an association speaks up and offers mentoring and solutions rather than just barking at people who are “not qualified” I’ll be impressed… spend my money with them… and work to ensure they are promoted and recognized!

Goodness I ramble…

In short, I did not join NACHI because of the quick “certification”… rather the immediate benefit I saw. I can appreciate you’re saying the education requirements are low… however look at all the free information and courses they offer. This very message board has given me tons of information daily. Yes, NACHI has an incredible web presence… I’m surprised to hear that being said as a negative. I agree with you… Nick is a salesman and a marketer… Good for him whats wrong with that? We’re all business people. I would also point out that NACHI offers more free training than any other association, answers questions timely and has a great group of very qualified members. I’m sure we can look to any association and find inspectors that simply put aren’t very good.

I’ll stop rambling now…

Its too bad OAHI is so ignorant about its image of NOT returning calls, or answering emails. The OAHI Registrar/Administrator has for years operated in this manner. Repeated complaints from many members have repeatedly fallen on deaf ears. If there is a way to get you to pay OAHI will devise it!

Its a real pity OAHI and its BOD is so aloof that it can afford the negative publicity it receives through the ignorance of the Registrar/Administrator. This lady has done more harm and created more ill will than can be imagined.

Some of you may be relieved to know that this person is on her way out! Finally! It only took several years of members and non members bi tching to get some action.

And Sean, good for you for doing your home work, I don’t disagree with anything you said in your post. Been there done that. :wink:

Interesting you mention she is on her way out. I’m not sure what sort of public knowledge that is, but I must say that I heard the same thing from someone very qualified to say so. Hopefully what we have both heard is accurate.

I find it interesting that everyone keeps saying this or that association wants to get yoru money… LOL I agree, they all do including NACHI. However the one difference I have found is for my $289 I have gotten way more than my monies worth already. Do I expect someone to put up with all the members bs for free? No of course not. Does anyone out here really believe there will ever be an association that can please all of its members? I’m sure you’ll all agree the answer is no. Do what is best for you. Hopefully most will see that what is best for themselves is also best for their customer!

Sean

As with most things the damage she help cause may not be repairable.

Sean, excellent words! I had the same experience when I started in HI just under 2 years ago. OAHI ignored me, I to was able to find a mentor to follow from here at the NACHI messageboard and after attending some of the seminars I have met and recieved valuable advice from many experienced guys. I have recieved excellent replies and information from many people on this messageboard even some of the guys who are critical of Nick and NACHI have replied to my questions and given me valuable information. Nobody is born experienced and this is an industry where you basically have to gain the experience on your own, but a resource like NACHI and the helpful inspectors who frequent this board are an extremely valuable asset. We all don’t have to agree with each other on everything but as long as I know I have a resource to turn to when something I don’t necessarily understand well enough comes up than I feel pretty good.

Nick

I bet you it would take you longer than 35 seconds to apply to OAHI, fwiw. :wink:

Hey Jerry,

Thanks very much. I agree totally with your post. One thing is certain, even though there are some disputes here and there, I have found that everyone has been helpful in one way or the other here. NACHI is a great place to be! I know it kinda sounds like kissing up however consider I really have nothing to gain by kissing up and you will come to understand that it is genuine appreciation for NACHI and its members who have been very generous with their time and patience (I’ve posted some pretty greenhorn questions).

Couldn’t help but notice Jerry you’re pretty close to me. Perhaps I can bend your ear some time?

And yes Ray, it would take anyone more than 35 seconds to apply to OAHI… however it wouldn’t take longer than that for them to take your money for an application! You just won’t get the application for weeks : ) Hopefully that all turns around or better yet hopefully PHPIO offers more of what we have here and an inclusion in CAHPI.

Nick, for clarification does NACHI ever intend to be affiliated with any of the other associations such as CAHPI?

Sounds good Sean, we wil have to find a day with some free time.